Singing?

[chadhogan]

So, i come in search of some answers. I have been playing guitar for about 12years. I teach at the music store full time, gig regularly, and have lots of recording experience in big studios. Heres the problem: I can't carry a note with my voice to save my life. HONESTLY, is singing something that can be taught? Im 20 years old, and i would really like to learn, i just don't have anyone to point me in the right direction. What would you singers suggest for someone looking to start from scratch? Thanks a bunch guys.

[walfordr]

Yes you can learn. Find a teacher.

[barneyc4]

I just started taking singing lessons a 3 days ago and I ive been playing guitar for 3 years and im doing really well. Use your instrument to learn! My teacher is teaching me with the guitar. I say or try to say the note that I play. Get it? Start with the scale DO RE MI FA SOL LA SI DO and play it on the guitar. Then try to say the notes while playing it.

Yesterday I moved on to my first song. Wish You Were Here by Pink Floyd. I can {censored}ing sing it! Learn with your instrument.

You can do it man. Use your instrument.

edit: by the way, im 19.

[slideaway]

yes a good teacher is probably the best way to do it!

but i did teach myself some - and i was as bad as it gets proir to having a go at it out of necessity, the way i did it was to work out the vocal lines/phrases of songs on git by ear to the letter and write it down notation wise. and i would then practice pitching/singing along to vocal line often, think of the voice as an instrument no different to a real instrument, and you have to train your ear/voice to do what its told

but that does nothing to help with breathing,projection ect. that you need some training for - and it does take a long time to learn if your not a natural, but the beauty of that method is it also benefits your lead playing well too

remebr, music - its all in your head! and confidence is a HUGE part of it, maybe 50 - 60% but get your confidence by knowing you know how to play the vocal line, so how hard can it be?

i am very surprised that vocal lines arent covered in the tab world?

[slideaway]

lol snap barneyc4

[barneyc4]

lol

[slideaway]

i will elaborate, a bit on my notation method, creat a page with all the lyrics - broken down to syllables, put the corresponding notes on the syllable, important to draw a quick reference map on the page of the correct matching note position in the right octaves on the fretboard (try to stay in the bottom 5 or so frets of normal tuning) a lot of action in singing takes place on the edit: (g as well) B and high e strings in the first 3 to 5 frets - include all the slides by connecting notes - and there is a lot of sliding in say blues - try and write out mick jagger vox lines - they are the biggest challenge i ever experienced, he slides/slurs constantly!

and i reckon fitness is REALLY important if your not a natural singer

[barneyc4]

yup... fitness. go hit the treadmill or start swimming. get those lungs strong!

ab work also helps a lot!

[chadhogan]

Thanks a bunch guys! I'm going to try to find a teacher tomorow. We have about 110,000 people, someone has to teach vocal. I am really excited, i've always wanted to learn.
Thanks
Chad

[slideaway]

Good luck with it Chad! singing is great fun and very cosmic/and good for ya once you feel comfortable with it

[Terry Allan Hall]

Most churchs have a choir director, and most seem to give vocal lessons on the side.

Also, check your nearest community college.

[OldGuitarPlayer]

Interesting topic...

When I was a young lad starting to play the guitar my parents made me sing at the same time. I think they felt that music was also entertainment and if you were to play guitar you also have to sing. They always associated guitar with singing...like Hank Williams (country), Elvis/Beatles (rock), Woody Guthrie/Dylan (folkie). It wasn't entertaining for my family or friends to just listen to me play Eric Clapton or Jeff Beck licks all day...they wanted to hear some John Denver and Stompin' Tom Connors (for you canucks) songs so I started singing....it all went downhill from there...

Trust me, get a teacher right away and learn to do it the proper way

OGP

[slideaway]

what about mic technique, who teaches that? pretty important if amplified, almost another art form in itself?

OGP, your a fan of the guv'nor/JB (and that other nobody you mentioned )! me too! a JBaholic actually

your lucky to have been brought up in a musical house/family i envy that

[slideaway]

sorry Chad for spamming,

but i never never hear it mentioned how the guitars first 5 frets contain the average human vox range, in standard tuning.

does anyone else think this partly explains it universal success, to a degree?

I always here tenor saxaphone as closest to average human voice, but thats more to do with the breathing/timbre part?

[jconway]

As many have already said, get a teacher. Second, I would try practicing scales on your guitar and sing the notes as you play them. This can also help with ear training because you'll get more familiar with how notes sound.

 

Also, one of the easiest things you can do is sing along with your favorite songs. One think that is helping my singing is singing along with Beatles songs.

[bassred]

Ok, you've seen those cheesey adds in Guitar mags about perfect pitch, and one for 'relative pich' right.. order them. they don't teach you how to sing, that is going to require a teacher, but they teach you to recognse and deliver intervals. My guitard bought them (he needed some serious help) and they've made a wrld of difference! He has what I call a Bob Dylan voice, he's not extremely musical, but his voce works for Stones songs and some other more forigiving pieces... his relative pitch has become 10 tims better, so his overall delivery is much better (not much you can do to teach a 50 year old guy aout tone and timbre...)

I borrowed the CD's and went through the exercises, they really do help you pick out what pat of a harmony or melody you ned to be getting out...

Nothing beats practice. play some easy songs like Sweet Home alabama and Brown Eyed Girl and sing along, then record yourself and listen for your strengths and weeknesses...


I've been playing and singing for 12 years, to me it is completely natural, but it wasn't always, it gave me another hurdle here and there, but it is totally worth the effort! I love singing.

[Cripes]

One year from the time I learned basic playing to the time I could sing along. Mind you, it wasn't so much that I couldn't sing but rather play and sing. I started out fingerstyle and getting the concentration/focus/coordination to do that and sing was daggone frustrating. But, as with Oldguitarplayer, it went nicely and smoothly downhill from there.

[guit30]

seriously, it ain't that hard, get a cheap karaoke machine and cds with your favorite songs, hey lessons too if you wish
J

[chadhogan]

i found one here in town! She works at our competition's store, but its all good since we don't have vocal instructors(we just don't have enough room left!) I'm really excited about starting, although its gonna be weird being the student instead of the teacher hahaha. Anyways, i'll let ya know how it goes for me. My new larrivee has forced me to learn how to sing.

Thanks guys
Chad

[eflat]

I sing like Morrissey. . .

[guitarist21]

It also might be beneficial after having had a couple of singing lessons to join a choir or something. I learned a lot from being in a choir that I couldn't learn so well in a one-on-one lesson, like blending with multiple singers and different kinds of harmonies.

Ellen

[moctzal]

It also might be beneficial after having had a couple of singing lessons to join a choir or something. I learned a lot from being in a choir that I couldn't learn so well in a one-on-one lesson, like blending with multiple singers and different kinds of harmonies. Ellen

 

 

+1

 

Being in a four part choir really trains your ear and teach you intervals. Join every one that you can. They've done wonders for my singing over the past 5 years or so.

 

Confidence is one of the biggest parts of it too. Extremely important to any good singing.

[babablowfish]

The vocal chords are muscles. Muscles can be trained. The major impediment, IMHO, is that when you can't sing at first the awful sound you make discourages you from trying again. But I can remember when I first started trying to play guitar there were tortured cries of mercy from the folks within the kill zone begging me to stop. But I didn't and their sacrifice will not be forgotten. Anyway, just think of it as training a muscle. Think Steve Vai or Bruce Lee for that matter were born that fast? You may not be able to become another Bing Crosby, but you can get better.

[nylon rock]

If you want, go take lessons.

A simpler approach is to just not expect much from your singing, so sing softly so that you are barely audible above your guitar. Play the guitar lightly so that you don't have to stretch your singing abilities, limited as they may be. Singing can easily be done at speaking levels. You will be well within your means at speaking volumes.

Just as a conversation has ebbs and flows of enthusiasm that involve changes in pitch to make a point, singing is little more than that too. At a speaking level, if you listen to the lyrics to understand the emotion of the song and then try to convey that emotion when you sing (at a speaking level), you'll start to get the hang of it.

Then, when you play your guitar to your singing, if you are a little off key, you'll hear it, so just adjust your pitch up or down to the correct pitch and muddle through. You'll do better the next time you give the song a try. Eventually you'll get it right, or close enough, from start to finish. If you can't hit a note, then fake it with a falsetto just for that brief moment.

My singing is very soft or of low volume. People will say that they can't hear me. That's because they're spoiled by loud music. If I had a microphone they'd hear me just fine. If I can't hit a note sometimes, I'll go to a different note. It might not be the "correct note" but it works with the music nonetheless. By the way, most pros sing well because they have a microphone, but also because being a pro, they've already gotten familiar with their abilities and know when they have the lung power and range, ahead of time, from practice.

Some people are really good singers anyway. But they learned how to sing at some point, somehow. So, start your journey yourself, and stay within your means. You'll sound just fine once you give it a try on what you're practicing after a few runs through it. When you're comfortable, you'll start to experiment with your voice. But you have to get to that point first, so start today.

[Etienne Rambert]

A lot of excellent advice, especially to take lessons and secondly to sing with a choir.

 

Your first lesson will tell you something that is extremely important. Can you hit a note? I took voice lessons with ex-wife #2. She couldn't hit a note. I could. Teacher dropped her & kept me.

 

That's the most important thing - can you hit a note?

 

After that, breathing is most important. Breathing creates the shape and sustain for the vocal notes.

 

I took lessons - I learned how to breathe. But I wish I had gone the choir route too. I can sing lead. But I haven't got a clue about singing harmonies.

 

Finally, I disagree with one piece of advice though. Don't sing softly. Singing is all about breathing. It's fundamental.

 

Breathing shapes and controls the projection of your voice. Any vocal teacher will tell you that. The first thing they teach you is how to breathe. You need a lot of breath for singing. The notes come out when you exhale. The more breath you have to use, the better the sound will be.

 

So don't sing softly until you learn how to project first.

 

Finally find a singer you admire. See if you can sing in his range and then copy him.

 

For me it was -

 

Jerry Lee Lewis: "Another Place, Another Time"/"She Even Woke Me Up to Say Goodbye".

 

I was in a barracks in Vietnam the first time I head the Killer sing a Country song. It turned my head around. I still remember it.

 

A bunch of stray dogs were fighting outside my window. GI's were on the second stairwell throwing them scraps of meat to see which ones would live and which would die. And I heard the Killer's voice singing "Please Don't Talk About Me When I'm Gone"* rising from that carnage.

 

Wow! At the time I thought, "That's it! That's what music really is! That is the holy grail of male vocals,".

 

I still think that today.

 

I was a Bobby Darin fan since I was a kid too. I copy his voice a lot.

 

Tony Bennett "Sings for the Jet Set" circa 1965 or so is also great album to learn vocal technique on. Bennett had a limited vocal range. But his phrasing, along with Darin's, was the best AFAIC. You will learn how to sing a hard "R" sound with this album.

 

 

----

*It's a breezy Dean Martin song. The Killer re-did it on his "Touching Home" album circa 1971. He turned it into an existential country-rocker that blisters along at about 180bpm. His version smokes Dino and anyone else who will ever try to record that song again.