OK, so now that we have the covers out of the way

[JasmineTea]

They say to write what you know, (

Some of the time, maybe even most of the time. But the best stuff happens when one pushes the envelope into places it's never been before. Forces one to get out there in the ether and fly around.

 

IMO, rules are meant to be understood. Sometimes it's good to break them, sometimes not. How you break them....ah, see? A portal to the ether!

[Cripes]

not authentic irish, sadly. thanks for listening.

 

 

Good go. Capo 3, chords C and G. I followed along and had a lot of fun with it. It lends itself very well to some cedar borne celtic coloring. Regardless of what you think of yourself, it's just this very kind of writing that is so easy to build on.

 

If I collaborated I would leave the basics alone though I might bring in one other major and a minor chord for a bit of color. F and Am work quite handily.

[MattSkibaIsGOD]

Good go. Capo 3, chords C and G. I followed along and had a lot of fun with it. It lends itself very well to some cedar borne celtic coloring. Regardless of what you think of yourself, it's just this very kind of writing that is so easy to build on. If I collaborated I would leave the basics alone though I might bring in one other major and a minor chord for a bit of color. F and Am work quite handily.

 

 

Thanks a lot cripes. I will play around with it some more tomorrow and have a new verison up soon. Since you guys have a pretty good representation of the kind of thing I like to write, why not post your originals in here if you have links.

 

EDIT: and thanks a lot RT1, that is some great advice. Would a USB audio interface be a good thing to pick up? With something like the Tascam 122 or whatever it's called, i could mic both my vocals and my guitar better that I can at the moment I reckon.

[brahmz118]

Me too! I'd love to collaborate with anyone. Guitar, bass, mandolin, drums, whatever.

I might be interested in trying something challenging, like adding an acoustic framework to some of your electric noodling, after the fact. Easier said than done...

[Cripes]

I'll give it a swing, but can't promise that I'll come up with anything good. My initial tendencies are usually very simplistic -- if it's chordal, add linear stuff. If it's linear, add counterpoint. I'd like to think outside the box a little better. Maybe pan most of the original stuff right and come up with a good left. Chop things up, rearrange sections, add blanks and fill them in, etc. Just thinking out loud. That's all it is, isn't it? I might be interested in trying something challenging, like adding an acoustic framework to some of your electric noodling, after the fact. Easier said than done...

 

 

I did the opposite. Not that it's better, but it is easier to lay down an acoustic track as a starting point for a lead, bass, whatever to come underneath.

[Etienne Rambert]

The links in my sig, 3 pages on 3 continents*, contain original compositions & recordings. But my compositions aren't strictly acoustic, per se. Most of them are orchestral pieces with acoustic guitar accompaniment. I have a couple of new acoustic instrumentals I've been working on though. I want to record one of them with only a steel-string acoustic and an electric dan bau. Composed it on Rosewood. I'll probably record it with Maple though.

---

 

*I'm happiest with the French site. I didn't put it up. It's a list of film composers in which a waltz I wrote & recorded was included.

 

It's very flattering. I don't know the owners of the site. They asked my permission & I gave it to them. My waltz is hardly known outside of France. It's barely known inside of France.

 

But I don't deny that it is a magnificent waltz. It's undeniable, per se. Saraswati smiled on me when put that one together. I'll probably never top the ending. I should have walked away from music then & there instead of wasting all this time and spending all this money.

 

I screwed up the ending. I hit a bad note by accident. And it worked brilliantly!I don't think I'll ever get that lucky again.

[Terry Allan Hall]

I perform originals in a ratio of about 1 in 3 (2/3rds covers, in other words), primarily songs from the two CDs I carry to sell at my gigs.

Used to be very prolific writer as a teenager, sometimes 5 or 6 a week...hopefully, the fewer songs I write as a geezer (several a year) are better, but that's not for me to say...

[brahmz118]

I did the opposite. Not that it's better, but it is easier to lay down an acoustic track as a starting point for a lead, bass, whatever to come underneath.

 

 

Agreed. At the same time, I think it could be interesting to try it backwards. With the framework in place first, there's not too much that the lead part can do to create drastic changes in the feel of the piece. When the lead part is played first, the harmony and rhythm can really be tweaked to pull the rug out from underneath, so to speak. In theory, that is...

[Etienne Rambert]

 

Originally Posted by guitarist21 View Post Me too! I'd love to collaborate with anyone. Guitar, bass, mandolin, drums, whatever.

 

 

Brahmz: I might be interested in trying something challenging, like adding an acoustic framework to some of your electric noodling, after the fact. Easier said than done...

 

 

I always add acoustic guitar last or next to last. Acoustic guitar and VX finish the recording for me. But I use synths for everything except acoustic guitar and voice. So the acoustic parts are not basic for me. They're the most challenging, more challenging than vocals. Trying to blend an acoustic guitar into a digital mix has always been difficult for me.

[JasmineTea]

Recording.

 

It's always best to build a work track first. A work track would consist of a click track and another insrument like guitar or piano that can play chords, and map out the changes of the song, giving the other instruments something to play along with. After that's done you begin to add bass and drums and everything els. What's nice about this is any part of it can be re-done as long as the work track is still underneath it all.

 

Some good ideas to use in a work track: Preceed it with a few measures of an A note for tuning the additional instruments. DO NOT use a tuner prior to recording additional instruments. Once the first few tracks are established, you will have to tune to the recording. The A note preceeding should be done with an instrument from one of the established tracks. You can also add the A note after-the-fact.

 

If there will be multiple time sigs you'll need to anticipate where they'll start and have a few beats preceeding the new time sig. This means you'll probly need a seperate click track for each time sig, as the preceeding count-off beats of the the new sig could over-lap the first time sig. Likewise, if you return to the first time sig you'll need another click track.

 

Most importantly, IMO, is to imagine as much of the arrangement as you can before hand. Have a good idea how the dynamics will go, one part to the next. Think it through as best you can because once it's in motion and there are plenty of good tracks coming through the speakers, it'll be too late to re-arrange.

 

At the same time, the creative fluids tend to flow wonderfuly once it's in motion. And there are plenty of changes that can be made.

[Cripes]

Recording. It's always best to build a work track first. A work track would consist of a click track and another insrument like guitar or piano that can play chords, and map out the changes of the song, giving the other instruments something to play along with. After that's done you begin to add bass and drums and everything els. What's nice about this is any part of it can be re-done as long as the work track is still underneath it all. Some good ideas to use in a work track: Preceed it with a few measures of an A note for tuning the additional instruments. DO NOT use a tuner prior to recording additional instruments. Once the first few tracks are established, you will have to tune to the recording. The A note preceeding should be done with an instrument from one of the established tracks. You can also add the A note after-the-fact. If there will be multiple time sigs you'll need to anticipate where they'll start and have a few beats preceeding the new time sig. This means you'll probly need a seperate click track for each time sig, as the preceeding count-off beats of the the new sig could over-lap the first time sig. Likewise, if you return to the first time sig you'll need another click track. Most importantly, IMO, is to imagine as much of the arrangement as you can before hand. Have a good idea how the dynamics will go, one part to the next. Think it through as best you can because once it's in motion and there are plenty of good tracks coming through the speakers, it'll be too late to re-arrange. At the same time, the creative fluids tend to flow wonderfuly once it's in motion. And there are plenty of changes that can be made.

 

 

The tech stuff you lay out is good advice - especially establishing the pitch. The part I bolded up was written for me. Thanks.

[T.B.]

Thanks Cripes, Actually I have posted many of my originals here before (besides the one on Neil Young's site) but they usually just disappear without comment so I thought there was no interest. I'll post some more originals gradually and meter them out over time so as not to offend anyone (who am I kidding? SOMEONE will always be offended no matter how lightly I try to tread! LOL)

 

 

 

I've always listen to everything you've posted. I haven't always responded though I'm sure I have on most of your N. Young stuff. I'm listening so, keep posting your original stuff too.

 

Trina

[brahmz118]

I understand where everyone's coming from, as far as the logic behind starting with a grounding track. I'm just interested in the intellectual challenge of interpreting a naked line. There's a good chance that this is a dumb idea, but I'd like to try it.

Let's say someone (as a result of random noodling) gives me a theme with the notes C - G - F - G - F - G - F - G. Instead of throwing predictable C major chords under that, what if I bounce between Bb and Db as bass notes to achieve a C locrian feel? What if I ground it with a D major chord to create a D7#9 leading to G minor? It just seems like this type of reconstruction would be more restricted if the changes are mapped out ahead of time.

Like I said, this might sound like I'm dramatically increasing the odds of screwing up whatever someone hands to me. If it really counted I wouldn't go against any of the good advice in recent posts.

[Etienne Rambert]

Some recording accidents are wonderful. They go into the mix.

Some are just screw-ups. They don't.

 

I understand the approach Brahmz wants to take.

But whatever progression he uses, he will still be starting

with a "grounding" track, as JT calls it.

 

The grounding track could be a melody line and he could try

to put the bass behind it. Good luck trying to put a drum

track behind a melody line.

 

I think anyone who doesn't lay down a percussion

track first, will have big problems trying to insert one

post hoc.

[JasmineTea]

Some recording accidents are wonderful. They go into the mix. Some are just screw-ups. They don't. I understand the approach Brahmz wants to take. But whatever progression he uses, he will still be starting with a "grounding" track, as JT calls it. The grounding track could be a melody line and he could try to put the bass behind it. Good luck trying to put a drum track behind a melody line. I think anyone who doesn't lay down a percussion track first, will have big problems trying to insert one post hoc .

Actualy it's called a "work track" and it consists of really nothing more than metronome and guitar or piano, and a rough vocal. I say guitar or piano because most songs are writen on guitar or piano, and also because they are chord instruments and map out most any song well.

 

A work track usualy takes no more than one or two passes to make because it's a throw-away track and won't be used in the mix. Mistakes don't matter as long as it follows the arrangment. It's a guide, in other words.

 

After that you'd make what's called a "bed". The bed consists of drums and bass and a rythm guitar or keyboard. It's the foundation of the song upon which everything els is laid.

 

So yes Marcellis, the drums have to go in early.

[LaurentB]

... does anybody besides the elusive Cldplytkmn write their own stuff? I'm curious to hear what others here have come up with.(

 

 

Yes, see http://www.em11.nl/muziekframesuk.htm

 

Acoustic songs:

 

http://www.em11.nl/geluiden/hifi/never_again.mp3

http://www.em11.nl/geluiden/hifi/it_shouldnt_be_like_this.mp3

[MattSkibaIsGOD]

Yes, see http://www.em11.nl/muziekframesuk.htm Acoustic songs: http://www.em11.nl/geluiden/hifi/never_again.mp3 http://www.em11.nl/geluiden/hifi/it_shouldnt_be_like_this.mp3

 

 

wow. nice stuff. What kind of acoustic did you use on "Shouldn't be like this"? It sounds beautiful.

[daklander]

Have a listen here.

Three tunes. One, "Never Done....", all mine, the other two collaborations with Sherrie Davis, and all were put up in various stages of production. There are others....

[LaurentB]

wow. nice stuff. What kind of acoustic did you use on "Shouldn't be like this"? It sounds beautiful.

 

 

Well, thank you! That's a Crafter GAE-30 on that song. "Never Again' is played on my 1978 Hopf classical guitar.