Changing the saddle, nut and bridge pins.

[athomas]

hi

 

I was looking into upgrading the saddle, nut and bridge pins on both my Martin and Taylor. An early christmas gift for myself

 

Any suggestions on what to buy? How much difference it would make? Should i get it done by my local Sam Ash luthier or take it to Mandolin Brothers in NY?

[BrandonBrinley]

*cough* tusq www.tusq.com *cough*

[AugTPD]

www.guitarsaddles.com

 

Bob Colosi makes great stuff and he can make an exact copy of your saddle in any material. You can do the saddle and pins pretty economically without paying anyone to install the saddle. The nut can get more expensive due to the labor cost of have a luthier set it up.

[daklander]

Mandolin Bros or some other qualified luthier.

[happy-man]

I wouldn't change a nut unless there is a problem with it. A nut shouldn't change the sound much.

 

Bridge pin change is a matter of taste. Check out Freeman's bridge pin sound files. It's not really a matter of "upgrade", it is a matter of wanting a different sound. You might prefer the sound of plastic over ebony or brass. This is something that might be fun to try, and you can do it yourself.

 

I assume your Taylor and Martin both have Tusq saddles. I wouldn't change those either unless you have a problem. You could "upgrade" to bone, but I don't know that you'll notice any difference.

 

I'd rather take the money and get leather straps, or maybe an Yamaha F-335 for a bang around. Only my opinion of course.

 

Scott O

[kwakatak]

 

Mandolin Bros or some other qualified luthier.

 

 

+1

 

Not knowing anything about Mandolin Bros. or Sam Ash I'd say go with the mom & pop place. IMO a chain is less likely to be able to do such refined work as a nut installation in-house. If you can get a luthier to do it, even better.

 

BTW - according to the Martin and Taylor websites, both your guitars already have tusq saddles and nuts. If you have an issue with the tone I say upgrade the saddles to bone and play it by ear with the nut on each.

 

That's what I did when I got my Larrivee. I'd played the same model in a store so I knew what the guitar was capable of and something was holding my new guitar back. So I ordered a bone saddle from guitarsaddles.com, slackened the original strings on the guitar (so I could compare before & after) and put 45 minutes of smelly and dusty work into sanding the new saddle to fit and putting it in. Afterwards I noticed a definite increase in clarity and sustain but the strings were also suspect so I changed them too. Even a new set of Elixirs sounded clearer over whatever what was on it when I received it. I still have issues with the open strings and suspect that the nut is the culprit, so I ordered a bone nut blank directly from Larrivee but haven't found a luthier to install it yet.

 

As for the pins, I'd change them just for looks but have no opinion on what they'd do for tone. I put ebony pins with MOP dots on my Larrivee but it had already had plain ebony pins on it before so I can't comment on any changes there. All I know is that I like the look better. YMMV.

[babablowfish]

Although I have no idea what difference the changes will make on your particular guitars, all three can have a big impact, including the nut. This is a topic which comes up every-so-often. As far as I am concerned it was definitely established that the nut can effect tone even when the strings are capoed! Go to the link below and read it all the way through, if you haven't already. I changed the nut on my Yamaha FG-340 because of what I learned here and it did make a difference.

 

http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1238790

[athomas]

thanks for all the info. I probably just change the pins & saddle. My martin has plastic pins!

 

Anyone has a link to Freemans bridge pin test.

[Guitar Hack]

I ran this issue past a luthier once and he said that replacing the saddle and pins to bone is overrated and won't affect the sound much. However I have no personal experience that this is the case.

[totamus]

I would go to a Luthier directly. Stay away from anyplace that your interface is a sales clerk. A good Luthier will watch you play and ask you about your preferences. Changing the Nut and Saddle will affect your guitars playability, intonation and tone. The materials used will make a difference in sound, but it is not a dramatic change. The playability of your guitars may be dramatic though. The Luthier will also check the neck adjust, fret condition and general guitar health.

 

You want to establish a relationship with a Luthier that you trust. Many stores dont send guitars to a Luthier for a set up (and this is a set up), they have "Guitar techs" do the work. This is often a kid on staff with minimal training.

[Hudman]

Some people claim that tusq and bone are very similiar when used as nut material. I have no intention of replacing the tusq nut on my Larrivee, but I do have a bone saddle and ebony bridge pins.

 

Here's a great article on guitar nuts:

http://www.acousticguitar.com/article/default.aspx?articleid=7643

[Freeman Keller]

 

thanks for all the info. I probably just change the pins & saddle. My martin has plastic pins! Anyone has a link to Freemans bridge pin test.

 

 

It is in the Tech section of the Annex.

 

I'll agree with what several people already said - normally the factory nuts are pretty good, but the big improvement there will be setting it up really well (some factory nuts are a bit high). Replacing a nut is a big job and if fairly labor intense, and in my humble opinion has the least effect on tone.

 

I changed the stock saddle in my Taylor to bone (I assume the original was Tusq) and frankly could not hear any difference. Since I have both one of these days I'll do an A/B recording and post it, but when you think about the theory of the saddle's function the biggest effects would seem to come from the density of the material (not much difference), stiffness (ditto) and fit in the slot (the skill of the builder). The biggest sonic effects of a saddle change can be the compensation - if your present one(s) are not compensated then do that for sure. Colosi's are compenated and highly recommended.

 

The pin tests did show big changes in sound which I attribute mostly to mass. I'll let you listen before I tell you what I ended up with in both my Martin and my Taylor - might surprise you. The other things that some people feel have a lot of impact are the setup at the saddle - slotting and/or ramping the bridge and on your Martin (if it hasn't been done) reaming the pin holes.

 

Sound wise the order that I think things affect a guitar are strings........... then setup, pins, picks and technique, then........................ saddle and nut.

[EvilTwin]

I like ebony pins. Marcellis put some rosewood ones (at least I think that's what he said) in his recently purchased Guild that apparently made the guitar get some mojo. Some folks on here dig brass pins.

 

It's all a matter of taste...and you can probably buy a few and try 'em out for yourself to see what suits you. You may actually like plastic more (if memory serves, the pin test proved a couple people wrong on how good plastic could sound on a Martin).

 

You can buy a bone saddle, but only your ears will decide if it's an improvement. I've got guitars that have tusq, and others with bone. They all sound good to me.