Soldering and Wiring

[wooden]

Ok, soldering, how do you that? I have heard everything and i have my own method but i have even been told to use contact cleaner in the parts befor heating them and any thing, some use flux some others dont, some tin the wires some others dont. How do you do it?

 

Wiring and patching: is it a good idea for any reason using balanced cable with ts conectors and wire them appropiately?

 

patching: what happend when you conect ts connectors with trs inputs/outputs or the other way around? Thanks.

[where02190]

You should NOT use contact cleaner on surfaces to be soldered, as the solder will not flow well onto the metal and cause poor connections.

 

Using a TRS on a TS connection is a waste of connectors, as the ring will connect to nothing. Also if you are connecting a balanced source to an unbalanced input, you are floating the neutral and losing 1/2 your signal.

 

Whenever you combine balanced and unbalanced you should use unbalanced cabling, as the connection will be unbalanced, and as previously stated you can end up losing signal due to a floating ring(neutral).

[The Chinese]

 

Originally posted by where02190 You should NOT use contact cleaner on surfaces to be soldered, as the solder will not flow well onto the metal and cause poor connections. Using a TRS on a TS connection is a waste of connectors, as the ring will connect to nothing. Also if you are connecting a balanced source to an unbalanced input, you are floating the neutral and losing 1/2 your signal. Whenever you combine balanced and unbalanced you should use unbalanced cabling, as the connection will be unbalanced, and as previously stated you can end up losing signal due to a floating ring(neutral).

 

 

Where-

 

I've seen a couple of posts now where you're advising tying the neutral to ground when going balanced to unbalanced. This is often true, but not always, and is becoming less true as more electronically balanced output stages are hitting the markets... For example, the Digidesign 192 requires to "float" the "neutral" (I think you mean cold, there is no neutral in signal wiring...).

 

Bottom line is to consult your owners manuals or contact your manufacturer.

 

-Todd A

[The Chinese]

 

Originally posted by wooden Ok, soldering, how do you that? I have heard everything and i have my own method but i have even been told to use contact cleaner in the parts befor heating them and any thing, some use flux some others dont, some tin the wires some others dont. How do you do it? Wiring and patching: is it a good idea for any reason using balanced cable with ts conectors and wire them appropiately? patching: what happend when you conect ts connectors with trs inputs/outputs or the other way around? Thanks.

 

 

A) whenever 2 pieces of metal make contact, they should be tinned.

 

B) heat the work, not the Solder.

 

C) get a Good quality Iron that can get hot enough to do the job quickly. Make sure it has swappable tips. use the right size tip for the job at hand.

 

D) Get Rosin fillled Solder. Then you don't have to worry about flux.

 

E) Get a Sponge to wipe the tip of your iron on to clean it. It helps to cut some slits in the sponge w/ a razor blade.

 

F) Never blow on a Soldered connection to get it to "dry"

 

Be careful.

 

 

-Todd A.

[Phil O'Keefe]

A) whenever 2 pieces of metal make contact, they should be tinned.

 

B) heat the work, not the Solder.

 

C) get a Good quality Iron that can get hot enough to do the job quickly. Make sure it has swappable tips. use the right size tip for the job at hand.

 

D) Get Rosin fillled Solder. Then you don't have to worry about flux.

 

E) Get a Sponge to wipe the tip of your iron on to clean it. It helps to cut some slits in the sponge w/ a razor blade.

 

F) Never blow on a Soldered connection to get it to "dry"

 

(G) Be careful.

 

H) Don't breathe the solder fumes.

 

I) Get a Sal Ammoniac tinning block and use it. Your tips will last longer and make better contact, and thus better heat transfer, to the work.

 

J) If the solder dries dull and grey looking, you have a cold solder joint. Desolder (I prefer a bulb, others prefer a desoldering wick) it and then redo it from scratch.

 

K) Make double sure you have all the parts on the cable before you start soldering the connection. You'd be surprised how often people forget that one...

 

L) When soldering to metal jacks or parts with plastic housings, fuseholders or jacks, make sure you don't overheat and melt the plastic.

 

M) Practice soldering and desoldering things on wire scraps and cheap busted up electronics boards until you get the hang of it.

 

N) Never forget - that tip is hot! Keep it away from flammible materials, and your body. Burns hurt.

[where02190]

 

Originally posted by The Chinese Where- I've seen a couple of posts now where you're advising tying the neutral to ground when going balanced to unbalanced. This is often true, but not always, and is becoming less true as more electronically balanced output stages are hitting the markets... For example, the Digidesign 192 requires to "float" the "neutral" (I think you mean cold, there is no neutral in signal wiring...). Bottom line is to consult your owners manuals or contact your manufacturer. -Todd A

 

 

neutral=cold.

While there are a few units that prefer the neutral be floating in an unbalanced wiring scheme (TC Electronics 2290's for instance) the vast majority need to have the neutral and ground tied for best signal to noise ratios. When in doubt it is always best to check the manufactures guidelines or contact them for their recommendation.

[wooden]

So in general what is your choice when you use any combination of unbalanced/ balanced inputs/outputs. Or do you always check the manual and that? what happend if you are trying to connect two devices and one recommends one thing and the other just the opposite?

 

My question was if there is any advantage of using trs cable with ts connectors?

[wooden]

What more thing, what happen if you should use a floating pin cable and you use it the other way? or what happend if you should connect it and you leave it floating?

 

Where: about the contact cleaner the person who told me that stated that it is for cleanning you fingers grease.

 

Do you all tin parts to be soldered? and when you do the joint you add more solder right?

[where02190]

I generally always tie neutral and shield when wiring unbalanced.

 

There would not be a scenario where "one recommends one thing and the other just the opposite" as if this were the case, then both units would be balanced. (We're talking about what a balanced units specs are for running unbalanced remember.) An unbalanced unit isn't going to give you specs on wiring balanced since it cannot operate balanced.

[wooden]

Originally posted by where02190 I generally always tie neutral and shield when wiring unbalanced. There would not be a scenario where "one recommends one thing and the other just the opposite" as if this were the case, then both units would be balanced. (We're talking about what a balanced units specs are for running unbalanced remember.) An unbalanced unit isn't going to give you specs on wiring balanced since it cannot operate balanced.

 

Thanks for educating me thanks a lot for answering too, even when i do not so smart questions.

[The Chinese]

 

Originally posted by where02190 neutral=cold.

 

 

Not the same thing.

 

An electrical Neutral carries current back to ground. Go look at your electrical box, you'lll see that the neutral buss is actually grounded. the potential is not equal to the Hot line.

 

A (-) signal or cold, actually carries a voltage equal to the voltage in the (+) line, except it's 180 Deg out of phase.

 

that's why Symmetrical power, Or Balanced power, has no neutral.

 

 

-Todd A.

 

P.S. I would disagree with saying the "Vast Majority" of Balanced output stages. Servo Balanced is the key to what you are looking for. They and only they can short the pin to ground with no loss or risk of damage. If you Ground the Pin 3 of a transformer balanced output stage, you will lose signal and risk the output stage. On certain electrically balanced output stages, you could actually burn the op-amp out. Of course, the input the signal is feeding as well, look for Servo Balanced or Differential.

[where02190]

Neutral=cold is a very common term for british gear.

[wooden]

I hadnt tinned my iron, and i tried it today, but the solder failed to cover it, instead there was a little bulb in the iron and the rest fell to the floor, is it because it was dirty or what? i cleaned it with a sponge but maybe it was dirty still

 

i have 60/40 rosin core solder 0.032" diameter

 

is it any diference between it and 40/60?

 

do you keep your solder in any special way? does it oxidize? because the solder i was using is pretty old

[MarkGifford-1]

Never solder in your underpants.

 

MG

[The Chinese]

 

Originally posted by wooden I hadnt tinned my iron, and i tried it today, but the solder failed to cover it, instead there was a little bulb in the iron and the rest fell to the floor, is it because it was dirty or what? i cleaned it with a sponge but maybe it was dirty still i have 60/40 rosin core solder 0.032" diameter is it any diference between it and 40/60? do you keep your solder in any special way? does it oxidize? because the solder i was using is pretty old

 

 

That's your Iron not getting hot enough.

 

-Todd

[where02190]

 

Originally posted by MarkGifford-1 Never solder in your underpants. MG

 

 

...or barefoot. In fact don't solder in just socks either.

[wooden]

Originally posted by The Chinese That's your Iron not getting hot enough. -Todd

 

Thanks, thats my weller 40W Ill try with my 30W truper. what about the solder?

 

and those advices about not soldering naked are very good

[Paully]

I've been stockpiling Kester 66/44 rosin-core for a while now. The benchmark for years, but rumor has it that this mix will shortly be illegal in the US. Great stuff, easy to flow, and good contact strength, but the lead issue will make it obsolete shortly(early 2007). About $13-14 for a 1lb. roll.

 

Paul

[Phil O'Keefe]

Originally posted by wooden I hadnt tinned my iron, and i tried it today, but the solder failed to cover it, instead there was a little bulb in the iron and the rest fell to the floor, is it because it was dirty or what? i cleaned it with a sponge but maybe it was dirty still

 

See my item "I" comment in the list above.