Advice on using reverb on tracks

[robinryan]

Hi People

 

I need some advice and hope you can help me out on this.

 

I am recording tracks with an experienced road musician, ie someone who works the pubs and clubs. He has a definite idea of what he wants, and he will say "put some reverb on that", and i open up IK multimedia Classik Studio and insert a preset reverb on the track, say for example a drum reverb preset on a drum track, but it is always the wrong sound according to him, and i end up spending 15 minutes going through presets, whilst he gets more and more ratty and moaning saying "i just need a standard reverb".

 

What exactly is a standard reverb?

What would be the correct setting for a "standard" reverb on:

Drums

Vocals

Guitars

Piano

 

What setting would i use? What plug in reverb could be considered a standard reverb? I bought IK Multimedia because it seemed like a complete solution but now i am wondering if it is too fancy and not "standard".

 

Can anyone give me some advice on this, as i am getting more and more annoyed.

 

Many Thanks

Rob

[Johnny-Boy]

There are many kinds of reverbs - from small room reverb to caverns. A different reverb can be used for each instrument. Short reverbs for drums and longer, warmer reverbs for vocals.

 

You want to use reverb sparingly and precisely. For instant; when applying reverb to drums you may only want to add reverb to the snare, toms, etc - not the entire drum set. Especially take care when adding reverb to the kick and bass. Some sounds are better left dry.

 

You'll have to experiment by applying small increments of reverb to one track at a time.

 

I'm sure you'll get much better advice from the experts here. You can find a lot of advice by Googling such sites as this one: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul08/articles/reverb1.htm

 

Best, John

[Jesse G]

Ask him what sort of space he wants it so sound like it's in and maybe try a preset that corresponds with that and start tweaking from there.

 

If the reverbs aren't sounding "right" to him, try making the reverb lengths in-tempo by using the formula "60,000

[slider]

I like using a reverb called 'Vintage Plate'. it does not take much. it seems to sweeten the vocals, smooth the edges and gives some depth. I'd say that's pretty standard; whatever, that guy means.

[Rimmer]

Hi People I need some advice and hope you can help me out on this. I am recording tracks with an experienced road musician, ie someone who works the pubs and clubs. He has a definite idea of what he wants, and he will say "put some reverb on that", and i open up IK multimedia Classik Studio and insert a preset reverb on the track, say for example a drum reverb preset on a drum track, but it is always the wrong sound according to him, and i end up spending 15 minutes going through presets, whilst he gets more and more ratty and moaning saying "i just need a standard reverb". What exactly is a standard reverb? What would be the correct setting for a "standard" reverb on: Drums Vocals Guitars Piano What setting would i use? What plug in reverb could be considered a standard reverb? I bought IK Multimedia because it seemed like a complete solution but now i am wondering if it is too fancy and not "standard". Can anyone give me some advice on this, as i am getting more and more annoyed. Many Thanks Rob

 

If it were me, i'd tell him there is no such thing as a standard reverb. If he thinks there is then I would ask him a ton of questions on how deep, wide, long, transient he expects it to sound until you get ratty.

 

Maybe he truly doesn't know himself and is expecting some sort of guitar amp spring reverb.

 

Apart from anything. Until you are in the mixing stage I wouldn't pissing about trying to be ultra specific about a reverb choice anyways. Sounds like a bit of a primo uomo to me..

[UstadKhanAli]

A relatively short plate or hall reverb is fairly standard, provided that you are not slathering the audio with it and it's used at a reasonable level.

[bgollwitzer]

I would look at spring reverb presets with a guitarist since that is historically what is found in guitar amps. My guess is that sound is what he considers standard in his frame of reference. Cheers.

[soapbladder]

My 2 cents:

 

Less is more (usually); pre-delay in the 30-45 range can help with clarity; don't put different types/lengths on every track if coherence is important; low-pass filter up suitably high prevents the bass from getting mushy.

 

SB

[Phil O'Keefe]

I would look at spring reverb presets with a guitarist since that is historically what is found in guitar amps. My guess is that sound is what he considers standard in his frame of reference. Cheers.

 

Again, it might be.

[Phil O'Keefe]

Hi People I need some advice and hope you can help me out on this. I am recording tracks with an experienced road musician, ie someone who works the pubs and clubs. He has a definite idea of what he wants, and he will say "put some reverb on that", and i open up IK multimedia Classik Studio and insert a preset reverb on the track, say for example a drum reverb preset on a drum track, but it is always the wrong sound according to him, and i end up spending 15 minutes going through presets, whilst he gets more and more ratty and moaning saying "i just need a standard reverb".

 

We need to work on our communication skills. That's not intended as an insult - but it's a definite art; learning how to talk to others about art. And one you can learn to get better at with time and experience.

 

What exactly is a standard reverb?

 

What indeed? And is my definition the same as yours - or more importantly, his?

 

What would be the correct setting for a "standard" reverb on:

 

Drums - room or plate, short decay.

Vocals - plate, chamber, hall, room - it depends on preference, style, genre, etc...

Guitars - room, stage or club, small chamber. Spring reverb is probably THE most common and well known to guitarists themselves.

Piano - chamber, hall, large room.

 

Again, none of that is carved in stone - just some possibilities that are fairly commonly used.

 

What setting would i use? What plug in reverb could be considered a standard reverb? I bought IK Multimedia because it seemed like a complete solution but now i am wondering if it is too fancy and not "standard". Can anyone give me some advice on this, as i am getting more and more annoyed. Many Thanks Rob

 

Rob, your IK bundle is good stuff, and should be capable of giving him a good "standard" reverb sound - whatever the heck that means to him. Just ask him for a few musical examples that he could play for you off of a CD or MP3 so you can hear the type of sound he's after. He's not really doing the greatest job of describing it to you when he's saying "standard drum reverb" - that's so genre and preference specific and variable as to be a meaningless description.

 

But it's your job to give him what he wants, which means trying to figure out what he's hearing in his head - which is always a bit of a daunting task. But in addition to trying to get him to give you audible / musical examples, you can also ask him for specific details and his thoughts & opinions while giving him different audio examples to pick from and comment on. Pull up a short decay plate and play the drums with decent amount of that for him and then pull up a long tailed plate and ask him which he prefers - longer or shorter? Does he prefer it louder or softer in the mix? It should help with different types of reverb sounds too - plates, rooms and shorter tailed verbs in general being more commonly used on drums but again, it all depends... but by asking him for his preferences and giving him examples to choose from, you can also, by process of elimination, try to zoom in in something closer to what he's after, while keeping him involved and allowing him to make choices. IMO, that's usually more fun and interactive for the client, more productive and less stressful for you and ultimately works out great in terms of trying to give them what they want...

 

Good luck and I hope it all works out for you.

[WRGKMC]

All good information. I would add that Reverb is used to add depth to the music. The way I look at it is like this. If I was sitting in a really good room or hall listening to a band, and the instruments were spaced apart from each other at the other side of the room, I'd hear the direct sound And the reflectivity off the walls. In a concert hall I'd be sitting in a 3D sonic enviornment with sound coming from the speakers and from the sides and the walls in back of me.

 

When mixing you must decide what venue you want to recreate, PLUS you need to take into consideration the recording will be played back through stereos, cars, etc in an aditional listening enviornment that adds to the reverbs you'll be adding.

 

As a quick example, I may have a typical mix, Vocal and Bass, Kick and Snare center with some stereo spacing on the other drums. Then have two guitars left and right. With EQ dialed in it can sound flat as a pancake. One dimensional. This can be fine if I want an up close intamate feel to the music, but it doesnt always work with all the instruments competing for front and center stage. You may also have Frequency overlaps with littel or no space between the instruments so your focus of attention is all over the place.

 

By adding say some stereo plate reverb to the snare, all of a sudden its pushed back in the mix and the attack/decay of the snare is emphasized and fattened up. Its not so in your face now, but you can focus on it easily in the background.

 

Guitars that are dry in separate speakers can sound lifeless too. A loud guitar with no reflectivity just doesnt sound real unless its maybe a jazz tune or something like that where it needs to be up front. You can try copying the track and pan say the dry guitar right and put reverb on the other track and pan it more center or left. This may help mimick a player on the right side of a stage being direct and his sound spreading out across the room. You hear more reverb left because theres no direct sound covering up his plauing there so you tend to hear more reverb on that side.

 

Thats about all I have to add for now. The main point being, is you have to develop a plan in your minds eye of how you want the music to sound from a three dimensional room acoustics point of view, then Make the tools at hand accomplish that by experimenting with the settings till you nail the sound you have in mind. That is the complete opposite of letting the tools dictate whats possible and driving you to settle with something thats not what you have in mind.

 

This is the most important thing bacause reverbs are a cool thing and its easy to get wrapped up in them and overdo they're use. As others said, you may have the balance depth deep while tweaking the reverbs EQ, Attack, PreDelay, Length etc. When you get all those set, You'll usually need to adjust the balance back so its heard when you focus on it, and maybe not noticed or sounds quite natureal listening on a superficial level. All that comes under the catagory experienced mixing.

 

Lastly, when you think all is well. Give it a few days rest and come back and give it a listen. If it instantly sounds great, you usually have it nailed. If the reverbs are overwhelming and unnatureal, you usually have more tweaking to do.

[WRGKMC]

One last thing I forgot to mention. If your not sure one how much reverbs need for tracks, Find a simular song recorded by your favorite band. Import the stereo wave file into your current mix and use them as an A/B comparison. The beats and tone will be off of course, but you can use it to get your reverbs ballparked, then take it from there.

[robinryan]

Wow, thanks people. There is so much information and good advice that i am going to have to print this out and read it over and over.

 

Many thanks to everyone for taking the time to advise me on this.

 

I know this is probably the wrong place to ask, but this week my computer has started all of a sudden to reproduce sound as if it was a scratched record with crackling and CPU spikes. I haven't adjusted and settings or anything. Could this be a hard disk problem?

 

Once again, i really appreciate all you peoples help

Rob