A new, cool, thing

[Ryst]

Gus???

[felix]

Anyone even remotely concerned that it doesn't use field-replaceable batteries?

[Ryst]

I am remotely concerned. Now the minidisc is looking better.

[blue2blue]

I'm not an M-Audio fan -- but I think I'd buy their products over Sony's anyday. Everytime I buy something from Sony I end up saying "never again." (Yeah, that's a joke but I'm not really laughing.) My Sony VCR is far below the old Panasonic it replaced. My Sony headphones are the least comfortable cans I've worn since 8th grade language lab (they were only $20 but the Koss phones they replaced sounded better and were a hundred times more comfortable)... and even Sound Forge and CD-Architect are proving weird and unworkable in ways they never did when Sonic Foundry was still in the driver's seat.


Sad thing is -- Sony was the first tech company I ever fell in love with way back at beginning of the 60's...

[mandoman]

Anyone find out about the Phantom power thing?

It's just boneheaded to make a field recorder where you can't swap in a new battery. Can you even use an external battery pack for extended recording (assume some sort of battery to usb connector in this case)?

Is the battery even 'user servicable' or are they pulling the same cr*p as apple and their ipod where they expect you to buy a new unit when the battery goes dead or send it in to be serviced for a ridiculous fee (3rd party battery replacement kits aside).

This is the big problem I have with M-audio (not to mention their crappy mac drivers), they have great product ideas that they bring to market at decent prices, but something always seems to miss the mark...

I was thinking of preordering this puppy but it makes sense to wait for some reviews after it comes out, or at least until they post the online manual for it to get the full skinny.

[mandoman]

I am (or was) a big minidisc fan in it's day. Minidisc is perfect for getting song ideas down, recording music lessons, recording FM radio, and recording live music when quality is not a big concern. Being able to quickly add track marks is a key benefit.

However, with the advent of the ipod, if music is not on cd or in my computer, I just don't listen to it. So unless I get a minidisc recording into a computer asap, the disc usually goes unlistened too and forgotten. The problem I have here having an older unit is I can only do transfers in 'real time', which sucks and makes it far less likely for me to get a recording into the computer.
Now I basically have a hundred or so minidisc I will probably never listen to again or hope to ever get on to CD or MP3...

Sony really tried to listen to the minidisc community and add usefull features: longer record times, linear PCM recording, and most importantly, FASTusb transfers.

However, those sony bastards are crippling their minidisc units with crappy DRM, in this case, you have to use their sh*tty software to get recordings into the computer. This just plains sucks and will keep me from buying their unit.

I really don't think Sony's HD compares favorably to the microtrack. You don't get the same quality mic pres and 24/96 A>D. Most importantly, no b.s. DRM in the mircrotrack, use any compact flash reader to transfer data directly into the computer, no additional software required. These are key features, and make the microtrack far more attractive than the sony HD minidisc.

Basically:
Minidsc = consumer
Mircrotrack = prosumer.

Now, hopefully the microtrack will live up to it's potential...

[jazmaan]

This is the most detailed review I've been able to find online so far.

http://www.core-sound.com/microtrack_2496/1.php


The review is from Core Sound which makes a competing product.

They say their product is superior for professional work but the Microtrack is fine for consumer level recordings comparing favorably with MD. (duh!)

Apparently the Microtrack comes with a T-microphone with TRS plugs. But I can't tell if the included mic uses phantom power. I don't think so.

But Sony's T-Mic uses "plug-in" power so who knows.

Core Sound say the Microtracks "phantom power" is not up to spec anyway.

[Phil O'Keefe]

Gus, can you arrange for me to borrow one for a review?

Looks very interesting! Thanks for the heads-up BL!

[GY]

I've got an Edirol R-1.

http://www.edirol.com/products/info/r1.html

It's very useful. It does not have stereo record bar graph like the M shows. I wonder if the M record controls can "lock" together instead of fiddling with two controls. The literature says it also has an 1/8" TRS mic input with 5v for powered condenser mics. Not good for mics like the stereo AT-822 unless you can turn the 5 volt off like you can on the Edirol.

I've got 2 2GB CF cards for the R-1. I can record nearly 2 hrs 16/44.1 WAV on each card. Of course you can download files via USB at any time.

The MicroTrack uses a rechargeable lithium-ion battery. Probably proprietary. The R-1 uses "AA" cells. Rechargeable NiMH work great for this.

[Brittanylips]

Originally posted by Phil O'Keefe Gus, can you arrange for me to borrow one for a review? Looks very interesting! Thanks for the heads-up BL!

Thank you for picking up on this.

I'm not sure if your potential review would be able to incorporate any sort of comparison, but I'd be interested to know how this little thingamajig stacks up against its competitors. I recall that Roland may have also come out with a little 2 track recorder, and there are probably a few others floating around by now as well.

In any case, this looks pretty sweet.

As this thread suggests, there's a concern over the lack of XLR inputs. I wonder if that's as easy to remedy as speculated above, that all you need to do is use a high-quality XLR to TRS adaptor and you're good to go for XLR-terminating mics?

Also, I'd want to know about how good it REALLY sounds and operates. You know. M-audio does amazing things for the price, but not without (understandable) compromise. At this price, the analog circuitry is not going to replace a Neve. But, it looks awfully handy, and a nice replacement for aging DATs when something a little beefier and better-sounding isn't required. So, to be frank, I'd want to know about its weak links, even though that would not stop me from buying it anymore than knowing the weak links in Casio's groundbreaking DA-R100 didn't stop me from buying one of those little buggers either.

-Peace, Love, and Briittanylips

[Phil O'Keefe]

BL, I'll see if I can also get my hands on an Edirol R-1 for comparisons. Do you know of any other similar products besides those two?

"Weak links" are always something I look for when I do a review.

IMO, one of the nicest things about the "Pro Reviews" concept is that we can all interact on them... manufacturers can give their thoughts and input, the reviewer can give their impressions, the and the readers can ask questions and make comments while the review is "in process". If I do these reviews, it would be great if you can participate too - giving me suggestions on things you'd like tested, and how, making comments about what potentially interests you about the products and what your concerns are... that's a vital part of the whole process.

[Lee Knight]

Just as a heads up...

Electronic Musician's cover story this month is on field recorders. The M Audio is not included in the roundup unfortunately, but it still may be of interest to anyone looking.

The roundup includes 2 Edirols, a Fostex, 2 Marantz, and the top of the pack Sound Devices.

I'm still waiting for a sub $500 4 track with minimal but professional features and sound for location overdubs against a stereo premix.

Picture using a 3 mic Glyn Johns drum setup against a mono premix... anywhere you want!

It can't be that hard can it?

4 tracks!

[Geetar]

I gather that the phantom won't output a full 48v....more in the neighbourhood of 30V. Is this true Gus ?

[Geetar]

Well......... this doesn't seem like it supports that contention:

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.audio.pro/browse_thread/thread/389e5308756ab5ce/2486a784f2761bd8?q=m+audio


I've got a fair few mic's that work way better when they get a decent prod from phantom. 30V may "work", but it's never going to be optimal for mics that actually are designed for 48V.

Still, it seems a great little box, all other factors taken into consideration.

[Brittanylips]

Originally posted by Phil O'Keefe BL, I'll see if I can also get my hands on an Edirol R-1 for comparisons. Do you know of any other similar products besides those two? "Weak links" are always something I look for when I do a review. IMO, one of the nicest things about the "Pro Reviews" concept is that we can all interact on them... manufacturers can give their thoughts and input, the reviewer can give their impressions, the and the readers can ask questions and make comments while the review is "in process". If I do these reviews, it would be great if you can participate too - giving me suggestions on things you'd like tested, and how, making comments about what potentially interests you about the products and what your concerns are... that's a vital part of the whole process.

[nodding agreement, appreciating your invitation, and filling my gills]

The 30v max on the Microtrack

[jazmaan]

Just got mine. I'm not going to talk about the positives - obviously I wouldn't have bought one if it didn't have lots of positives. But here are the immediately apparent negatives:

1. Will not record in mono. (The manual says this should be addressed in a firmware update which is not available today.)


2. Will not scrub audition recorded tracks!
(Again the manual says this should be addressed in a firmware update which is not yet available.)

[jazmaan]

I have a question:

Is it ok to leave the USB charging cable plugged in WHILE recording? Will it draw power from the wall instead of the internal battery while its plugged in?

[Kiwiburger]

I have a question: If you are within the maximum 5m USB cable length to be able to plug this into a PC/Laptop ... why don't you record directly to the PC/Laptop?

I've been interested in this Microtrack ever since I saw it on the website a couple of months ago. I would own one today, if our New Zealand agent would move his butt. The features seem more impressive than the Roland R1 that I nearly bought before I saw this coming.

If you need serious quality preamps with phantom power, the Portico 5012 would go very nicely with this. People have been whinging about the 12V DC input and supplied line-lump, but that means you can run the purest DC power available, anywhere, from a battery if necessary.

As far as power for the Microtrack - I understand you can plug in an external power supply if you don't have USB. I don't see why you couldn't use a external 12V battery for this.

[jazmaan]

Originally posted by Kiwiburger I have a question: If you are within the maximum 5m USB cable length to be able to plug this into a PC/Laptop ... why don't you record directly to the PC/Laptop?

 

 

Because the package includes a small wallwart that lets you plug the USB cable into a wall mains. Similar to what you get with an iPod but a little smaller. No computer needed.

 

What is DOESN'T have is a simple DC power in connector. The only way to charge it is through the USB in.

[jazmaan]

The manual says there's a battery charge meter "iin the upper left corner of the screen."

Um - mine is in the upper RIGHT corner.

The manual says the display will say "Charging Complete" when its fully charged.

um - mine has been charging for 8 hours and the only that's happened is the animated battery icon has stopped animating and seems to indicate full.

[jazmaan]

Loop playback is FAR from seamless. In fact it puts a really annoying loud noise that sounds like a microphone bump at the end of each loop.

Unlike Minidisc, there is apparently no way to place index points within a recording. I consider this a MAJOR shortcoming. Especially when there is presently no scrub auditioning within a file.

No form of titling either. Each recording is given a sequential number and that's it. And if you delete recordings 1-5 the next recordings you make are still going to be named 6, 7, 8 etc. until you format the card.

The controls are generally sluggish rather than crisp and responsive. At this point, I'm thinking this device is not ready for prime time.

[Brittanylips]

Originally posted by jazmaan At this point, I'm thinking this device is not ready for prime time.

That's a shame. It seems like it would be truly wonderful if it was solid. Maybe it's trying to do too much in too small a space.

Perhaps a better solution would have been to separate the mic pre section into an add-on box, with its own power supply, leaving the essential MicroTrak a more robust unit in and of itself. then, if someone wanted to use XRL phantom-power-needing mics, they could just snap on the mic pre unit.

-Peace, Love, and Blips

[Brittanylips]

I'm not 100% sure, but I really wouldn't think that reduced voltage would damage the mic, only that it would degrade the performance of mics requiring a full tank.

It is a shame that the MicroTrak isn't quite what it could be. I'd rather have m-audio bring the unit up to spec than change the literature to reflect design compromises.

If something like the MicroTrak were really solid, it would be AWESOME.

I still like my idea of seperating the mic pre and giving it a dedicated power source --

Oh well.

-Peace, Love, and Blips

[Phil O'Keefe]

I'm not 100% sure, but I really wouldn't think that reduced voltage would damage the mic, only that it would degrade the performance of mics requiring a full tank.

 

I don't think it would. How many times has someone powered down a board with mics still plugged in? As the board power goes off, that phantom voltage is going to ramp down to zero, and if that doesn't kill mics, I can't imagine that a 30V phantom power supply is going to do so either. However, if you have something that does need true 48V for proper / optimum operation, 30V will result in degraded sonic performance.

[jazmaan]

I just noticed that M-Audio's website has downgraded their battery life claims from 8 hours to "4 to 5 hours. 3 hours with Phantom Power."