Music placement in TV ads...Sell out?

[Frantag]

My doctor won't take songs or guitar lessons in exchange for her services. She will take money. As a result, so will I.

 

Money in itself is not a bad thing nor are the majority of those who have a lot of it. Whoever said artists must starve was f-ing wrong.

[Will Chen]

 

My doctor won't take songs or guitar lessons in exchange for her services. She will take money. As a result, so will I. Money in itself is not a bad thing nor are the majority of those who have a lot of it. Whoever said artists must starve was f-ing wrong.

 

Yet another discussion point.

 

I believe this falls into the "entertainment vs art" part of the argument in which some artists (with very fragile egos) need to feel that there work is on another level which the masses just can't understand and also that true art can only come from suffering. True "artists" didn't create to entertain the "bourgeois", true art had a greater meaning. I'm of the thinking that art for the sake of art is complete crap.

 

Art is the embodiment of an endless conversation and a conversation of one is pretty boring. Now depending on who's on the other side of that conversation, you might talk about the injustices of political systems and the evil empire of conformity or how the weather was nice today. Good art can speak to both on their own level without pretension and is very rare.

 

Entertainment is niched and mostly disposable, but is "fun" by its very definition. Entertainment leaves little to the imagination and often ignites a commonly digestible emotion which many can share together without too much afterthought which is not necessarily a bad thing.

 

Art and entertainment are not mutually exclusive terms, yet many want them to be.

[Anderton]

Or as Duran Duran once said, "How can anyone accuse us of selling out when all we wanted to do was buy in?"

[Ernest Buckley]

 

Yet another discussion point. I believe this falls into the "entertainment vs art" part of the argument in which some artists (with very fragile egos) need to feel that there work is on another level which the masses just can't understand and also that true art can only come from suffering. True "artists" didn't create to entertain the "bourgeois", true art had a greater meaning. I'm of the thinking that art for the sake of art is complete crap. Art is the embodiment of an endless conversation and a conversation of one is pretty boring. Now depending on who's on the other side of that conversation, you might talk about the injustices of political systems and the evil empire of conformity or how the weather was nice today. Good art can speak to both on their own level without pretension and is very rare. Entertainment is niched and mostly disposable, but is "fun" by its very definition. Entertainment leaves little to the imagination and often ignites a commonly digestible emotion which many can share together without too much afterthought which is not necessarily a bad thing. Art and entertainment are not mutually exclusive terms, yet many want them to be.

 

 

For many years while I was still trying to figure out how to write (and I still am, I`m just better at it now), I considered my music "art". This gave me an excuse to say the reason why I wasn`t rich and famous was because people didn`t get my "art". Now, after some growing up, I realize I was completey bull{censored}ting myself.

 

There are so many people on these forums knocking successful entertainers saying, "I can do this, I can do that." I was one of them for some time but the reality, you can`t or you can`t yet.

 

Using the term "art" for ones work is just a cop out. There is some great music out there right NOW that is entertaining and artistic. And what is art? Yes, this is another topic but I think most would agree, art expresses a human condition or inspires one to greater things or simply leaves one in awe. Popular music can do this.

 

I listen to a lot of music which is popular and it also leaves me in awe and inspired. YMMV

 

Just to get back on topic of this thread, I think of Moby as an artist/entertainer and businessman. The guy (say what you want about him or his music) is extremely successful and that inspires me. I would like to accomplish a fraction of his success. So would most of us so we could get back to making our "art".

 

 

Be Lucky,

EB

[Billster]

Yeah, Ernest, the root of the problem is that "success" has nothing to do with "art", so if you want an income from your "art" you have to deal with the fact that most other people consider your "art" their "commerce".

 

It is possible to be successful both artistically and popularly (and by extension, financially), but the popularity and financial success are often not a direct result of anything artistic.

[Will Chen]

 

It is possible to be successful both artistically and popularly (and by extension, financially), but the popularity and financial success are often not a direct result of anything artistic.

 

 

But indeed possible. Many consider much of the Beatles catalog works of art, but honestly they were a pop band. Sure, at some point they began to experiment more and test the boundaries of what would be commercially consumed but most on this board that are fans of the Beatles probably would pick one of their more traditionally structured songs as their fav when polled.

 

Regarding music as art, perhaps these words shouldn't really be used to describe each other? Perhaps music is just music and we should drop the notion that it is anything more?

 

After marinating in this topic for a couple days, I guess a "sellout" is someone who doesn't stand for anything and at any point during the timeline of one's life could have a different definition. Some might argue that some pieces are too personal to "sell", but I see nothing wrong with offering the public an extremely intimate view into one's emotions. If McDonald's feels the deep emotions I experienced with the birth of my son will help them sell more hamburgers, good for my bank account. However, I wouldn't feel right about altering the word "son" to "big mac" and would consider myself a sellout if I did. Of course, that decision might also be driven by lacking the money to feed my son or put a roof over his head. How could one forsake their very inspiration for pride?

 

Perhaps not "selling out" is just an idealistic game for the young to play?

 

I'm a sellout. Not because I ever wrote/placed any music in a commercial (I wish I was so fortunate) but rather that I used to be a musician, music was everything and I would've given every last drop of my blood to the audience if they so demanded. Now I'm a day dreaming cube-ite, sitting at a desk working a job I find mildly tolerable to sustain a lifestyle which was created by accepting this line of work in the first place.

[RockViolin]

I'm a sellout. Not because I ever wrote/placed any music in a commercial (I wish I was so fortunate) but rather that I used to be a musician, music was everything and I would've given every last drop of my blood to the audience if they so demanded.

 

Duuuude. That's righteous. That's integrity. Professional at least! Sellout isn't the word that springs to mind. I've met players that...well, they've admitted that they try harder when the $$ is good. That's a sellout!

 

But yeah, thinking the show must go on, I once made the poor choice to play a big Saturday night show with really bad bronchitis. We got to the very quiet end of a Bernstein piece and I got that urge to cough. I must have turned red, purple, and blue stifling it. Tears running down my cheeks. 1rst violins-edge of the stage too. I think I saved it, for most of the house. Oh the sacrifice. An audience member 2 rows back got up at the end and approached the stage and handed me a cough drop. My sacrifice didn't go unnoticed...sadly.

[Ed A.]

I find some of the most interesting music from commercials. The GEICO commercial with the yuppie caveman at the airport is probably my most recent favorite. I found that the song "Remind Me" that they used for that commercial is from a band that I never heard of called Royks

[blue2blue]

 

 

 

I miss the audio on most commercials -- if I see the commercial at all.

 

I have a fast thumb on the Mute and FF buttons. I almost never watch TV in realtime just so I can FF through adverts.

 

Which is NOT to say I don't appreciate a good TV or radio spot the first time or two -- I absolutely do. There are some GREAT commercials out there and a lot of houses that do consistently pretty good.

 

 

Like others, I was hardcore about "selling out."

 

I remember hearing "Leavin' on a Jet Plane" on an airline comercial in the 60s a few years, IIRC, after PP&M had their hit with it. It REALLY offended me. (Always had a bit, soft spot for the song, one of the few John Denver things I like, though he seemed like a nice guy.)

 

 

I think when I started turning around was when they started using cool, obscure stuff -- essentially much hipper than you'd hear on the radio, by and large. Stuff like Nick Drake or old Billie Holiday classics -- I was just glad to see the unwashed masses exposed to something with a little class and intelligence, even if it was used to sell perfume or whatever.

 

 

That said -- I think the very next ad agency that licenses Iggy's "Lust for Life" for an add should be blacklisted out of the advertising biz... I mean, what kind of self-respect does an agency creative director have when he's the 150th guy to license the same song?

[blue2blue]

 

 

 

I miss the audio on most commercials -- if I see the commercial at all.

 

I have a fast thumb on the Mute and FF buttons. I almost never watch TV in realtime just so I can FF through adverts.

 

Which is NOT to say I don't appreciate a good TV or radio spot the first time or two -- I absolutely do. There are some GREAT commercials out there and a lot of houses that do consistently pretty good. (The folks who do the Jack in the Box ads are faves -- though not so much I can pull the agency name off the top of my head.)

 

 

Like others, I was hardcore about "selling out."

 

I remember hearing "Leavin' on a Jet Plane" on an airline comercial in the 60s a few years, IIRC, after PP&M had their hit with it. It REALLY offended me. (Always had a big, soft spot for the song, one of the few John Denver things I like, though he seemed like a nice guy.)

 

 

I think when I started turning around was when they started using cool, obscure stuff -- essentially much hipper than you'd hear on the radio, by and large. Stuff like Nick Drake or old Billie Holiday classics -- I was just glad to see the unwashed masses exposed to something with a little class and intelligence, even if it was used to sell perfume or whatever.

 

 

That said -- I think the very next ad agency that licenses Iggy's "Lust for Life" for an add should be blacklisted out of the advertising biz... I mean, what kind of self-respect does an agency creative director have when he's the 150th guy to license the same song?

[Frantag]

 

That said -- I think the very next ad agency that licenses Iggy's "Lust for Life" for an add should be blacklisted out of the advertising biz... I mean, what kind of self-respect does an agency creative director have when he's the 150th guy to license the same song?

 

 

But then Iggy will lose his Florida mansion....

[RockViolin]

-- I was just glad to see the unwashed masses exposed to something with a little class and intelligence, even if it was used to sell perfume or whatever.

 

Mozart's "Eine Kliene NachtMusik" ---diaper commercial.

 

I'm sure he'd be pleased.

 

Perhaps another angle?

 

Is nothing sacred?