Members jlw001 Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 As mentioned before you get a lot more microphonic and rattle noise with a combo than with a stack. With a stack you can also strategically place the speaker cab while keeping the head in a rack or something. Also, there is increased low end projection and tightness with a 4X12 that you just aren't going to get with a combo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Welladjusted Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 advantages for stack:separate pieces are often easier to carry than a heavy combo Only in regards to large 2x12 amps and mesa's more complex amps. The Mark IV 1x12 is 85 lbs. But even then, most decent 4x12's are between 90 and 130 lbs with 2x12's at around 60 average. And even then, that's just the cabinet. Heads average at 50 lbs. Stacks have a lot of disadvantages. Size, overpowering volume, and the inability to really crank them without hearing damage. Combos lack the low end response of a 4x12 and mix and match options are much more limited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Alchemist Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 Only in regards to large 2x12 amps and mesa's more complex amps. The Mark IV 1x12 is 85 lbs. But even then, most decent 4x12's are between 90 and 130 lbs with 2x12's at around 60 average. And even then, that's just the cabinet. Heads average at 50 lbs.Stacks have a lot of disadvantages. Size, overpowering volume, and the inability to really crank them without hearing damage.Combos lack the low end response of a 4x12 and mix and match options are much more limited. my F-30 head weighs 30 lbs, my Dr Z 2*10 cab is at around 35, my supersonic cab weighs 90 lbs.... my twin reverb weighs around 70..... you DONT have to buy the biggest cab and heaviest head available... there are a lot of options out there, many of which work very well....many amplifier heads are low watt, because you buy a head doesnt mean it has to be 100 watts.... and the OP asked about the same amps, but in combo versus head/cab format (not a fender champ vs a JCM800 halstack) , if it weighs 50+ lbs in a head format, its going to weigh much more in a combo because its the same amp! its also going to be just as loud, although not as focused people seem to have this idea that if its a stack it must be overbearingly loud, it can also be quiet, and there a lot of advantages to being able to mix and match cabinets and speakers.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members metalheadUK Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 In this day of decent PA's and miced backlines, stacks have no benefit that I can see over combos, other than the overiding one that drives so many guitarists that they look better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dazza1004 Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 combos - discreet stacks - watch the landloard crap his pants as you bring it in ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Alchemist Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 In this day of decent PA's and miced backlines, stacks have no benefit that I can see over combos, other than the overiding one that drives so many guitarists that they look better. so speaker cabinets have no effect on tone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members yzfou Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 so speaker cabinets have no effect on tone? I don't think that's what he means, in response to the OP the point is more that if you take the same amp with a 2 12 combo or a 2 12 cab, will there be a tonal difference between the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Alchemist Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 I don't think that's what he means, in response to the OP the point is more that if you take the same amp with a 2 12 combo or a 2 12 cab, will there be a tonal difference between the two. there might be, you probably have more control over close-back open back, with combos you are stuck with what you get..... also like mentioned a bunch of times, less vibration affecting the amp.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members yzfou Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 there might be, you probably have more control over close-back open back, with combos you are stuck with what you get..... also like mentioned a bunch of times, less vibration affecting the amp.... But trough a good PA, a miced combo, I think, might sound just as good stack:idk: though I tried it at my rehearsal place and since the PA is meh, miccing is not a good option,my stack sounds way better than my combo, but the sound insulation in that place is meh too, so the amp needs to be cranked more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members metalheadUK Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 so speaker cabinets have no effect on tone? Only onstage tone in larger venues....once you're guitar sound hits the mike, most of your control over the sound has been handed to the sound guy. If you play in smaller clubs, or really need to hear "your" sound onstage, then of course, using the kit that gets you that sound is the right option.# Dont forget, that just because you have a good sound (or a sound YOU like) on stage, that doesn't mean that is the sound that the audience is hearing. I bought a 100 watt Marshall SL-X half stack for use with my old metal band. Number of times I have been bothered to haul it downstairs, load it up and use it.....ZERO! My Combos go out all the time. Use what works for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members csm Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 I think it is a lot easier to sit on MOST combos and play, whereas you probably have to stand up and play with a STACK. That means you get better Metal poses, but can't look as laid back when playing the blues. You need a chair if you're BBKing or something. BB only started to sit down onstage when he got to be (a) old as the hills and (b) big as a house. John Lee Hooker sat down on stage so's he could stomp his feets. The nearest I ever got to owning/using a stack was my old much-missed early 60s piggyback AC30 (head and 2x12 cab) and, for the record, it didn't sound any different to a regular AC30 combo. Combos work fine for anything at or below the 4x10/2x12 level: anything a reasonably fit guy can carry by himself, or anything not putting out so much level that the speakers would shake the ampy bit to pieces. Stacks make sense only if you're using one or more 4x12s, or if you want to travel with an amp head and hook it up to speaker cabs that'll be waiting for you at the gig/session/rehearsal/whatever. Unless you need either major volume ("Have you heard my good friend Biggus Bottomus?") or the flexibility to use your favourite head with a variety of speakers, combos make a lot more sense for everybody except devotees of lo-wattage boutique heads and dinky matching cabs. The sight of even a half-stack (let alone a full stack, let alone two) in a small-to-medium venue make me want to (a) bust out laughing at the thought of the inappropriate rockgod wankarama which is about to ensue, (b) retreat to the bar even when I don't want a drink and © curse myself for a novice cuz I forgot to bring earplugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members roygbiv Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 Yeah...Bassman's/Bluesbreakers/Deluxes don't have tone.I'm not gonna argue any more...I'm not trying to argue. Dood, you made sweeping generalizations about stacks and combos. The idea that a combo has more "tone" than a stack is laughable. Even the idea that a combo has less volume than a stack is pushing close to a generalization (although I concede that more people play 100W Marshall stacks than 3W Blackheart stacks--but that could change as more low wattage stacks arrive). Say you take a Deluxe Reverb and mount it in a head cabinet and take the speaker and mount it in a 1x12 open back enclosure. What is the difference tonally from the original combo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members LARRY L Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 NO T O N E Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mo' Cowbell Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 Carry each one a half mile to the stage. That will make the decision for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jaxn slim Posted February 5, 2008 Members Share Posted February 5, 2008 I used to use a Marshall half stack. But I have to admit, it was mostly for looks. I think that combos are more logical for most gigging situations because they are usually smaller in size and easier to carry around. And you can always change out the speaker in the combo. You don't need to buy a whole other cabinet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abstract Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 Dood, you made sweeping generalizations about stacks and combos. The idea that a combo has more "tone" than a stack is laughable. Even the idea that a combo has less volume than a stack is pushing close to a generalization (although I concede that more people play 100W Marshall stacks than 3W Blackheart stacks--but that could change as more low wattage stacks arrive).Say you take a Deluxe Reverb and mount it in a head cabinet and take the speaker and mount it in a 1x12 open back enclosure. What is the difference tonally from the original combo? I made a sweeping generalization because that's what the OP asked for. Forgive me if I sound confrontational...it is unintentional. MOST combos are less than 100w.MOST combos have less than 4 12" speakers. MOST heads have AT LEAST 50w.MOST cabinets have 4 12" speakers. At the SAME wattage output for the head, your halfstack will move MORE air, and have a higher Sound Pressure Level. Meaning, you can get better tone...at lower volume...with the combo. Will all combos sound great? HELL NO!Will all stacks be too loud? Well, the volume knob also turns left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Febson Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 The nearest I ever got to owning/using a stack was my old much-missed early 60s piggyback AC30 (head and 2x12 cab) I have a combo and a head with the same circuit (twin reverb/dual showman) and I have plugged my showman into my twins speakers and found it's not as loud (both rated at 85 watts but are more like 100)among other differences. The advantages of combo are: it's small and loud and has reverb/tremolo The advantages of piggy back are: it's easier to transport Looks badass the closed back projects more and its easy to change speakers Disadvantages are: Combo is HEAVY Piggyback has no reverb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abstract Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 I'm glad someone else spoke to this bs slight. I'll add that BB King has averaged some 300 shows per year for over 40 years, how many shows have you guys played? I played 160ish from July 1998 - June 1999. I don't think he has really played 300/year...more than one or possibly 2 years. Unless you start counting impromptu "performances". In which case that 160 figure would be MUCH MUCH higher. These were 160 (158 I think) FULL 2.5hr...FULL Lights...FULL Sound...FULL Stage performances...in 9 country's. How 'bout you Febson? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Febson Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 I played 160ish from July 1998 - June 1999. Over 52 years B. B. King played at least 15,000 performances That's 288.46 per year...I say let him take a seat he's payed his dues. In fact he's playing a show right now... Yet here you are arguing that combos have no tone on the interwebs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MakeThemSuffer Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 Buy a Fractal Audio Axe-FX.....run to the pa....hey look over there! *runs away* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Le Blur Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 When you unveil a stack, it's assumed you know what you're doing and that your budget is limitless. When you bring out a combo, your playing has to do the talking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WakeTheDead Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 I have currently a couple of combos (Mesa MK IV, Flextone III XL, Roland Cube)... ...and a few different 100w heads (JVM410H, JCM800 Lead Series, Spider Valve 100HD). I used to think that a combo was the way to go for me (ease of portability etc.) but I have since changed my mind. I now prefer using the 100w heads with the option of using either my 1x12, 2x12, 4x12 or full stack options. It's no biggie to carry a head and my 2x12 cab out for a gig or practice. I think the tone I achieve through my heads/cabs blows away anything I could get out of a standard combo (personal opinion of course)... I still have the closed back/ open back option available with the cabs I have and I can choose which speakers I want to use at any given day/time. oh yea, and by the way.... I like my new Spider Valve Head 10x better than anything else in my arsenal! It's all I need tone/volume wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rush340 Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 If they're the same price, I would definitely go with a head/cabinet. More versatile and no buzzing/vibrating electronics. I like the idea of being able to put my amp on top of whatever cabinet(s) I want. If you're a tone nazi, I would expect a dedicated speaker cabinet to sound better than a cabinet with an amp in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kerzeck Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 Over 52 years B. B. King played at least 15,000 performances That's 288.46 per year...I say let him take a seat he's payed his dues. In fact he's playing a show right now... Yet here you are arguing that combos have no tone on the interwebs. You SERIOUSLY need to either A. Reread the thread, or B. Work on reading comprehension skills. That's all I will say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members timeforheroes Posted March 23, 2008 Members Share Posted March 23, 2008 what about running your 1x12 combo thru a larger cabinet? best of both worlds??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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