Do You Mix Primarily with a Mouse or Control Surface?

[nat whilk II]

 

I'm also left-handed, but my parents changed my writing hand when I was a little kid (which they realized in retrospect that this wasn't the healthiest thing to do), so I write right-handed. I also play guitar right-handed. So using a mouse right-handed is not hard for me, and I gravitated to it naturally.

 

 

Thinking about this - I'm basically mutt-handed:

 

Play guitar right-handed

 

Bat right-handed Golf right-handed Ping-pong left-handed Tennis left-handed

Kick a football with my right foot Throw left-handed

 

Use a hammer with my left hand, skillsaw with my right, wrenches first choice right hand

 

Mouse mostly right, but left is not too hard

Write left-handed - if I experiment with right-handed writing, and if I go really slow, it's not too hard, is in some ways more legible than the random squiggles and scratches I call "writing" that I do with my left hand

 

It's been a long time since junior high, but if I remember correctly it felt like I could do more potential damage punching someone with my right hand:rolleyes:

 

Is there such a thing as a left-handed piano??? I remember Joe Zawinul used to reverse his keyboard via MIDI just to find new patterns for running up and down the keys....

 

My left arm is much stronger than the right, but the hands are fairly equal. Right hand is definitely the "can you open this jelly jar for me?" hand.

 

If I enter a door in the middle of a wall, once inside I will instinctively turn right unless prompted otherwise.

 

What does it all MEAN:eek:

 

nat whilk ii

[Roy Brooks]

I mix with a mixer with sliders on it.

[UltramegaOK]

I mix with a mouse. I have difficulty with MIDI, in general. Even though I have read some books and magazine articles about MIDI, I just do not have the brain for programming. I personally need a drag-and-drop solution. The MIDI language is challenging to my brain. So, re-programming a MIDI device to meet my personal needs is difficult and I have not been able to successfully customize a control surface to match a) the software functions of my DAW (Cubase) and b) my personal preferences for ease-of-workflow.

 

I had a Korg Control 49 but could not figure out how to successfully re-program the device to easily do the things I wanted to be able to do to keep a creative work flow going. I evantually swapped it out for the Yamaha KX-49 which is designed for Cubase, so I get more out of it, but do not use it for mixing, just tracking and virtual instrument control.

 

Here's an example: the Korg has 8 sliders/knobs which (default) map to the first 8 tracks of the Cubase mixer using the Cubase map that was included. I wanted to be able to assign a command button on the Kontrol49 to allow switching the slider/knob controls from managing the first 8 Cubase tracks to the next 8 tracks (9 - 16), then again to the next 8 tracks (17 - 24) and so on. I could not figure out how to make it work.

 

SOFTWARE WANTED: Universal drag-and-drop MIDI mapping for DAWs. Software would be able to read or load the default functions (map) of a MIDI device, as well as the assignable features of the DAW being used. Using the software, the user would be able to drag-and-drop assign functions of the DAW's mixer/track/insert/etc controls to the physical bottons, knobs & sliders on the map/device. Multiple pre-sets could be saved and within a few clicks, called-up as needed.

[Bruce Swedien]

People.....

 

What a question..... No wonder recordings sound like pure doo-doo these days...

 

Bruce Swedien

[Ernest Buckley]

People..... What a question..... No wonder recordings sound like pure doo-doo these days... Bruce Swedien

 

Bruce, I can assure you, if you mixed with a mouse and/or control surface, it would not sound like doo doo.

 

I`ll take it another step further, if some of us were mixing Michael Jackson, J LO, etc..., it would not sound like doo doo either.

 

Its a little bit of a trade off on both ends, is it not?

 

[WRGKMC]

I use the mouse for several reasons. I'd like a control surface, but I'm a holdout who waits. If something isnt essential I wait for a good buy to come along.

 

It would reduce fatigue i'm sure. I use a mouse all day on the day job and to use it nights and weekends putting in alot of hours mixing is painful.

 

Another item is I'd have to see how much more resources thay may use. I run my less than stellar recording computer to the max many times. If it sucks recources to run it then I'm back to another computer upgrade which is not where I want to go right now. I do use a wireless mouse and keyboard which work very well so I'm not stuck in the same position all the time. I also set my mouse speed in the control panel to crawling slowly so I can get very detailed changes in movement when scrolling numbers.

 

For some rough mixing I peak level numbers for evening things up. fancy meters and eye candy have no effect on me. I do however often get up, walk around the room to just listen when I'm getting to the point where things are getting colse to finalization. i may even crank up my big system and rattel the paint off the walls and listen from another room or down the hall. Anything that may point out something i missed or can be improved.

[MrKnobs]

I mix with a mixer with sliders on it.

 

Me too.

 

Admittedly, I use a digital mixer these days, so you could say the sliders and knobs are a control surface for the chips inside the mixer. Then again, on an analog board, the knobs and sliders are a control surface for the electronic circuits within... if you want to get philosphical about it.

 

Terry D.

 

P.S. Oh, and a mouse and keyboard comprise a control surface, just a really crappy one.

 

P.P.S. Yes, I understood your question, I'm just being pedantic.

[Mike Aimer]

Mouse because I've been waiting to buy a house, then waiting until the basement is gutted, designed, built, then waiting to find the right console to buy.

 

I can't wait to not have to use a mouse exclusively. I'm used to pushing faders normally.

[Extreme Mixing]

 

People..... What a question..... No wonder recordings sound like pure doo-doo these days... Bruce Swedien

 

 

Careful Bruce, you're showing your age. More and more young people have grown up with the new shape of technology and they use it quite well. You were always at the top of the technology ladder. Things are different, but they're still the same.

 

Steve

[Bruce Swedien]

Steve.....

 

"More and more young people have grown up with the new shape of technology and they use it quite well."

 

That's the biggest pile of horse puckey I've heard in a long time. Listen to the way music recordings sound now. They do not use it well. They merely use it.

 

If I am showing my age I am proud of it.

 

Bruce Swedien

[Jeff da Weasel]

They do not use it well. They merely use it.

 

 

Excellent point. The results do seem to speak for themselves.

[Bruce Swedien]

Are there any recordings you hear these days.... so strong sonically that they make you want to own that recording for your self just so you can listen to it any time you want?

 

Hmmmm.....

 

Bruce Swedien

[Jeff da Weasel]

 

Are there any recordings you hear these days.... so strong sonically that they make you want to own that recording for your self just so you can listen to it any time you want?

 

 

Only one in all of 2010... the new Neil Young album Le Noise produced by Daniel Lanois. That was my only "must have" for the entire year. Sad, huh?

[Bruce Swedien]

True... But not all that sad. What this really is is a proper mandate for us all to get busy and make some really GOOD recordings.

 

Where is it written that it would be easy?

 

Bruce Swedien

[Lee Flier]

Well, maybe we need a new A.A. program - "Audioholics Anonymous."

 

You know - the first step is admitting there's a problem.

[Jeff da Weasel]

 

Where is it written that it would be easy?

 

 

Nowhere. In fact, "easy" can often be directly correlated to "crappy". There's always hard work involved by someone... usually someone who refuses to let details slide, and puts in the extra hours making it great, regardless of what gear they use.

[Anderton]

 

Are there any recordings you hear these days.... so strong sonically that they make you want to own that recording for your self just so you can listen to it any time you want? Hmmmm..... Bruce Swedien

 

 

Bruce, PM me with your mailing address, and I'll send you a harpsichord recording of Bach pieces that I guarantee will knock your socks off. I didn't do an X-Y off in the distance, but close miking with Gefells, and stereo room mics for a beautiful, warm-sounding room with rosewood panels. Every review it's received in the classical music press has been over-the-top favorable.

 

But more to the point of this topic, even with only four tracks (two mics on the harpsichord and the room mics) I used a control surface to mix them. Not because I was varying the levels, of course, but to set up the crucial blend of room and instrument I needed to be able to move the two room mic faders with one hand and the instrument faders with the other. They tracks of each pair also had to be offset slightly from each other. Sure, I could have done this with a mouse, but being able to compare slight changes in the track pairs rapidly was extremely helpful.

 

I do know people who are actually very capable at mixing with a mouse; they've embraced the technology and figured out how to work around it. BUT...when you hand those people a control surface, it's a revelation. I guess the bottom line is someone who knows how to mix knows how to mix, and they'll use whatever they have. Expose them to better tools, though, and they don't look back.

[Anderton]

I noticed that only one person voted for "Control surface, because I feel a mix should be a performance"...and that was me

 

So Bruce, am I offbase here, or do you see a mix as being a type of performance? Obviously for DJs the mix IS the performance, but I'm talking just regular ol' mixes. That's why I like automation - I can do a performance and improvise, and if it sucks, okay. But if it doesn't, I've captured it.

[Hard Truth]

I use both a Peavey PC1600 and a mouse. I tend to switch back and forth depending on the type of move I'm doing. The controller is used only for the faders, everything else is adjusted with the mouse.

[Lee Flier]

I noticed that only one person voted for "Control surface, because I feel a mix should be a performance"...and that was me

 

Well actually, for me it was "several reasons", that being one of them.

[Anderton]

Well actually, for me it was "several reasons", that being one of them.

 

That makes sense, I had completely forgotten about all the DJ sets you do

[Bruce Swedien]

I noticed that only one person voted for "Control surface, because I feel a mix should be a performance"...and that was me So Bruce, am I offbase here, or do you see a mix as being a type of performance? Obviously for DJs the mix IS the performance, but I'm talking just regular ol' mixes. That's why I like automation - I can do a performance and improvise, and if it sucks, okay. But if it doesn't, I've captured it.

 

A mix IS a performance for me, most definitely. Automation is also for me most definitely.

 

Craig you are NOT offbase a bit here.

 

Bruce Swedien

[Bruce Swedien]

Well, maybe we need a new A.A. program - "Audioholics Anonymous." You know - the first step is admitting there's a problem.

 

You'll have to get in line behind me!

 

Bruce Swedien

[Ernest Buckley]

All of this talk about performance and I agree.

 

I`m a Music Director/Organist at a church... been doing this for 20 years now. It pays the bills and I`m good at it. Yes, a "professional musician".

 

There are weekends when I have phenomenal musicians come in and play for various things with me. Then I get some screw ball musicians who don`t know how to play a simple dotted rhythm. Me, the "producer", the "overseer" of the entire musical experience can only do so much.

 

Great players/performers make me look like a genius, the lousy ones drag me down.

 

If you`re fortunate enough to be in a position where you can pick and choose who you play with and in what room (and what console, if you`re an audio engineer/producer), then there is no reason why you wouldn`t be considered great, awesome... etc...

 

 

All I`m saying is, I think we need to consider all the elements here. A mouse, a control surface is only a small part in the overall production.

 

Put Quincy and Bruce in a room with some average talent and they alone will not produce anything of quality. Yes, it will probably sound really good and you`ll think to yourself, "Wow, if that singer could only sing!"

 

It takes a lot of really good people to make something... great.

[Gus Lozada]

Excellent point. The results do seem to speak for themselves.

 

Actually... isn't that what really matters???

Whatever you use, use it right.

 

You can get crappy results with multi-million or small budget toys. In a great proportion, It all depends in the monkey behind the wheels. And to be sincere, I don't think it does matter if you use a mouse or a huge control surface.

 

Sure, having a huge control surface would speed your work flow and perhaps could help you to mix "old style" by hearing and not drawing an automation curve on screen, which is, as Craig mentioned, a sort of a performing art.