Where are the MySpace superstars?

[soundwave106]

www.myspace.com/jeffreestar he's also in that electro niche group which is growing but getting more widespread in terms of the target market, but may replace post-punk on radio in terms of music trends. In the 'hipster' scene, he is huge!! there are so many guys that try to imitate him it's sickening.

He's really imitating the whole post-modern sex attitude started with the "electroclash" (or whatever name you want to call it) scene in the late 1990s, the androgynous fashion fits in that scene to a T. In no way do I consider Jeffree Star as big as say Fischerspooner was, at least at this point. In no way, furthermore, do I consider even Fischerspooner a superstar.

That's the thing, you got to keep perspective that success in a niche genre is limited. Christ, I listen to space music / ambient music and goa trance, and I know that in those genres 1000 CDs sold is a pretty damn big number. I mean, is Steve Roach or Infected Mushroom superstars? I can't say they are. Does it matter much, no, Infected Mushroom and Steve Roach have had highly successful careers in their niche... but they are not and will never be superstars. (Footnote: Do you really *want* to be a superstar? I don't.)

[thedolaon]

He's really imitating the whole post-modern sex attitude started with the "electroclash" (or whatever name you want to call it) scene in the late 1990s, the androgynous fashion fits in that scene to a T. In no way do I consider Jeffree Star as big as say Fischerspooner was, at least at this point. In no way, furthermore, do I consider even Fischerspooner a superstar. That's the thing, you got to keep perspective that success in a niche genre is limited. Christ, I listen to space music / ambient music and goa trance, and I know that in those genres 1000 CDs sold is a pretty damn big number. I mean, is Steve Roach or Infected Mushroom superstars? I can't say they are. Does it matter much, no, Infected Mushroom and Steve Roach have had highly successful careers in their niche... but they are not and will never be superstars. (Footnote: Do you really *want* to be a superstar? I don't.)

 

 

yea, i understand, i was talking in terms of this decade. Jeffree Star is definitely a continuation of that whole look and feel. But i still think he's bigger than Fischerspooner (i love his song, Emerge).

 

Do i really want to be a superstar....use to...not anymore. after being grounded in reality, i've realized that I may be more of a behind the scenes person. There's just too many factors that hinder or help you in this business that's it not even worth trying sometimes.

[BlueStrat]

Do i really want to be a superstar....use to...not anymore. after being grounded in reality, i've realized that I may be more of a behind the scenes person. There's just too many factors that hinder or help you in this business that's it not even worth trying sometimes.

 

This sounds wise beyond your years!

 

It's great to want to perform, but not being limited to it is a great thing.

[NewWorldMan]

Job For a Cowboy got a huge boost from Myspace and Metal Blade took notice:

"In this day and age of video-sharing hubs and social-networking hotspots such as YouTube and MySpace, JOB FOR A COWBOY’s ascending popularity was sure to find additional like-minded fans and new supporters. And sure enough, it did. On MySpace, the band accrued over 6 million plays and upwards of 130,000 “friends”, while the YouTube favorite “Job for a Sponge” – featuring the JFAC song “Knee Deep” as voiced by the affable Spongebob Squarepants and his horde of metal warriors – became an internet sensation that would soon see a number similar tributes (LAMB OF GOD, THE BLACK DAHLIA MURDER, etc.)."

The internet and Myspace as a tool for major promotion and recognition is something relatively new. You'll have to give it more time, and when you do, you'll see more people gain recognition because of it.

[keithtoxic]

I'm pretty sure Andy McKee isn't a "superstar" by any stretch of the imagination (see BlueStrat's interesting remarks about "superstardom" in today's music world), but I'd say YouTube made him much more popular than he was prior to his video being up. Here's an article from my hometown website about him: http://www.lawrence.com/news/2007/nov/09/post_position/ Just thought I'd weigh in with a possible example of the kind (not the exact) of example that the OP may have had in mind. There - that sentence was wishy-washy enough to hope to avoid getting flamed! Peace

 

 

I nearly forgot about Andy McKee. Me and my buddy sat there for a week trying to learn some of his songs. They're real fun to play :]

[BlueStrat]

 

Job For a Cowboy got a huge boost from Myspace and Metal Blade took notice: "In this day and age of video-sharing hubs and social-networking hotspots such as YouTube and MySpace, JOB FOR A COWBOY’s ascending popularity was sure to find additional like-minded fans and new supporters. And sure enough, it did. On MySpace, the band accrued over 6 million plays and upwards of 130,000 “friends”, while the YouTube favorite “Job for a Sponge” – featuring the JFAC song “Knee Deep” as voiced by the affable Spongebob Squarepants and his horde of metal warriors – became an internet sensation that would soon see a number similar tributes (LAMB OF GOD, THE BLACK DAHLIA MURDER, etc.)." The internet and Myspace as a tool for major promotion and recognition is something relatively new. You'll have to give it more time, and when you do, you'll see more people gain recognition because of it.

 

 

Well, once again, that's great for them, but outside the "world of metal", no one know who the hell they are. Words like "huge" and "superstar" are gross exaggerations when compared to the culture as a whole. And while popularity may be the new indicator of success (it used to be income), no one has effectively figured out a way to transform popularity into making a living.

 

I think myspace is great to promote within a genre, but it's also (inadvertently, I think) contributed mightily to the Balkanization of the music business. Instead of one big vibrant business, there are all these small pockets of activity, and none of them really knows anything about the other. Now, no one ever has to listen to anything they don't want to, for the first time in the history of recorded music.

 

It's always been that way to a small extent: a great divide between country, rock, jazz, easy listening and soul has always existed since their creation. But at least a lot of us were exposed to lots of those things by virtue of limited number of radio stations and formats, and parents who exposed us through records, radio and TV to guys like Johnny Cash and other country greats, Sinatra and Torme and Dean Martin, Count Baise and Duke Ellington and Ray Charles, and so on. So many of these guys transcended genre interest and became mass cultural icons. In addition, many of us, consciously or unconsciously, Incorporated these influences into our own music.

 

I don't think we're seeing this today. If anyone does transcend genre, they are almost always torn down by the different music genres. John Mayer? {censored} music and a sellout. Justin Timberlake? Gay. Amy Winehouse? Self-important derivative train wreck. Etc etc. The culture has become so fractured musically that, far from propping up any form of greatness, we are quick to tear it down and hold it up to scorn. Our only musical heroes today are the obscure names known only to our own little genre interests.

 

Not a judgment so much as an observation I've witnessed occur over the past 15 years or so. I find it fascinating, from a sociological point of view.

[NewWorldMan]

Well, once again, that's great for them, but outside the "world of metal", no one know who the hell they are.

 

 

You can't judge success and superstar status by saying someone has to have universal appeal and be well known outside of their genre. Not everyone cares about every genre of music, and when you get into something as extreme as metal can get, you shouldn't measure the success of a metal band by whether or not the country, jazz and Top 40's pop fans know who they are and vice versa. There's multi-platinum selling country artists playing to sold out arenas that some metal fans have never even heard of and so forth. You need to look at their intended audience that the music appeals and is marketed to.

[BlueStrat]

 

You can't judge success and superstar status by saying someone has to have universal appeal and be well known outside of their genre.

 

 

Sure you can. Doesn't "superstar" by definition mean mass appeal, or at the very least, known by a huge number of people? No one is a superstar if only 1% of the population knows who they are. I'd bet over 70% or people over 20 know who Madonna or Christine Aguilera or Justin Timberlake are. Job For A Cowboy? Not so much.

 

 

Not everyone cares about every genre of music,

 

 

Of course they don't. But that isn't the same thing as knowing who someone is. I despise Madonna, but I wouldn't deny her status as a superstar.

 

 

when you get into something as extreme as metal can get, you shouldn't measure the success of a metal band by whether or not the country, jazz and Top 40's pop fans know who they are and vice versa

 

 

You're confusing success with being a superstar. I already said in another post that it is entirely possible for bands to be successful and remain unknown:

 

I said this:

All music is pretty much specialty stuff these days marketed to narrowly defined niches. I think the days of the mass appeal band is pretty much over. As I said before, it's now entirely possible for bands to make a living on just a following, rather than on mass appeal. But just because a band may be popular in a particular genre doesn't mean they're 'huge names'.

 

 

There's multi-platinum selling country artists playing to sold out arenas that some metal fans have never even heard of and so forth. You need to look at their intended audience that the music appeals and is marketed to.

 

 

Exactly, which proves my point, which I stated here:

 

I think myspace is great to promote within a genre, but it's also (inadvertently, I think) contributed mightily to the Balkanization of the music business. Instead of one big vibrant business, there are all these small pockets of activity, and none of them really knows anything about the other. Now, no one ever has to listen to anything they don't want to, for the first time in the history of recorded music.

 

 

There are lots of platinum artists I've never listened to. However, if there are platinum artists no one has heard of, they're living in a cave with no TV, radio, print media or computers.

[ihateyouguys]

You can't judge success and superstar status by saying someone has to have universal appeal and be well known outside of their genre.

 

 

But to be considered a superstar, they basically have to be the dominant entity in their field. Think Michael Jordan during his prime.

 

Being a household name is often a byproduct of being a superstar, but not necessary. What is necessary is that if people were asked "who is the biggest name in X" they list the supposed superstars first.

 

Which leads to the question, if people who follow the genres were questioned as to who the top acts were in those genres, would any myspace act be listed?

[NewWorldMan]

All music is pretty much specialty stuff these days marketed to narrowly defined niches. I think the days of the mass appeal band is pretty much over.

 

 

If you think that all music these days is specialty stuff marketed to narrowly defined niches, then why are you looking for superstars that have came from Myspace since there would be virtually no superstars in general from any source if that were true?

 

Again, Myspace is a relatively new medium to promote versus traditional methods that have been around since the dawn of the music business. If you want to see a superstar emerge from Myspace, you'll have to wait it out. I think you're expecting too much, too quick from a relatively new promotional tool.

[BlueStrat]

 

If you think that all music these days is specialty stuff marketed to narrowly defined niches, then why are you looking for superstars that have came from Myspace since there would be virtually no superstars in general from any source if that were true?

 

 

I'm not. That's my point. Myspace cannot create superstars, no matter who it's proponents point to.

 

You might want to read ther whole thread. I have been skeptical of all the claims of the power of myspace since it's beginning.

[icthyopolis]

the power of myspace is to make superstars obsolete, it's pretty old fashioned to be looking for superstars anymore

[NewWorldMan]

 

I'm not. That's my point. Myspace cannot create superstars, no matter who it's proponents point to.

 

 

That wasn't my point...I was saying that by your assumptions, there would be no superstars in general being created these days, let alone one from a relatively new promotional medium.

[thedolaon]

Again, Myspace is a relatively new medium to promote versus traditional methods that have been around since the dawn of the music business. If you want to see a superstar emerge from Myspace, you'll have to wait it out. I think you're expecting too much, too quick from a relatively new promotional tool.

 

 

i agree with this.

 

i understand the whole superstars argument(sp) from both sides, but i agree with this too.

 

The whole music industry (this has been said many times) is shifting and i'd say within the next three years as we go into the new decade, we'll start seeing not necessarily myspace, but internet music superstars in their genres become more mass noticed and the ones with the smartness of marketing and promotion will be the ones with staying power.

 

Now, on myspace to me an unsigned success on myspace has to have at least 5million plays and around 3million+ views if done without help (as in did not use robots to up plays and view). I think it's fine to use robots to promote yourself by adding people who may like your music, not to someone who likes country and you send them metal. It's just another part of getting out there and promotion, but i don't like when bands use robots to up plays and views...that's cheating to me. (but that's another thread anyway)

 

Like Bluestrat said, there's a point where you reach popularity and now it's time to start trying to get mass appeal. This is the part where you really do need "money" to do this. If you get enough money, put an AD in music magazine alot of people read, put huge ADs on websites people go to, Mtv, Fuse, Current Tv, blah blah. I'm sure someone can do this on their own, but that requires alot of someones money/out of pocket. So basically, once you get to a certain point of success and popularity, and want to go the next step then....you know what i just sed.

 

But it also depends on what success means to a certain band/artist.

[thedolaon]

This sounds wise beyond your years! It's great to want to perform, but not being limited to it is a great thing.

thanx! me and my mate are now like, if anything happens go with it, if not...its not the end of the world. maybe they're the ones who are not ready.

[soundwave106]

 

the power of myspace is to make superstars obsolete, it's pretty old fashioned to be looking for superstars anymore

 

 

There *are* superstars of sorts, though nothing compared to the 1970s/1980s waves. They just aren't coming from integrated bands anymore. If you look at the current Billboard charts, most of your entries are coming from hip-hop, dance-pop, and pop-country. These genres rely on charismatic front ends that sing or rap, the songwriting backend being often invisible. Out of the current Hot 100, only one is an integrated band (Finger Eleven) with one additional one being a singer-songwriter (Sara Bareilles). I don't see a reason why this model won't continue for a while, even though I don't care for this model all that much.

 

For the most part, I personally see the Balkanization of music as a good thing -- much better for consumers who are easier able to find what moves them. As a bonus, slowly but surely this "superstar" stereotype is starting to fade away. To me, that's good because the music industry exploited a *lot* of naivety half based on this superstar stereotype. I'd prefer to see bands that play what they want versus piggybacking on the Latest Great Trend.

[Dean Roddey]

the power of myspace is to make superstars obsolete, it's pretty old fashioned to be looking for superstars anymore

 

 

That sounds profound to say, but I don't think it means much. There will always be people who transcend their particular niche and become widely known for what they do. In some cases that might be because they make the most generic music possible and therefore appeal to a wide demographic in some way. Or it may be because they have something going besides the music, they catch some wave that becomes well known to the general public, they become famous for being famous, etc... In some cases it it will just be because they happen to become kind of the representative of the music of a generation and so are held up beyond their peers (think Nirvana perhaps.) Sometimes they will just come out of almost nowhere with an album that just blows a lot of people away, a la Alanis Morrisette. It won't always last long, but while it does they will be people you can't not at least know the name of.

[Dean Roddey]

I don't necessarily see the Balkanization of music (or entertainment and other aspects of media in general) as a necessarily good thing. Yes, diversity is a great thing. But the point of diversity should be to give people more expressions and ideas to experience, not to allow everyone to slide down into a self-reinforcing niche where they experience fewer expressions and ideas. Diversity is beneficial mostly when it throws more ideas into a bigger mixture that everyone experiences. So it fails on this front, and means fewer and fewer common points of reference that provide some sort of coherence to a society, without even providing any counter-balancing benefits that diversity should provide.

[BlueStrat]

 

That wasn't my point...I was saying that by your assumptions, there would be no superstars in general being created these days, let alone one from a relatively new promotional medium.

 

 

 

There in fact are not many superstars being created today. I have said this repeatedly.

 

Name one act or person of superstar status doff the top of your head that has emerged in the past 10 years. There may be a few-50 Cent, JayZ, John Mayer, Amy Winehouse (who will unfortunately be tossed into the Brittney-Anna Nicole-Lindsey Lohan category of being more known for her train wreck life than her talent). You can name some, but you really have to think about it. Names of the current 'superstars' that immediately jump out at most people are those from the 70s, 80s, and 90s.

 

The whole point is that it is record companies and their promo machines, not the internet, that has created superstars. Can the internet help? Yes. Can it do the job solely? Not in a million years. As record companies lose more and more relevance, you will see fewer mass appeal and mass marketed superstars, at least in music.

 

Is this a good or bad thing? I don't know, and don't really care. I just see it as something that is currently happening. I don't have a dog in the hunt, I'm just an observer of the human condition and it's social constructs.

[mickeydean]

the power of myspace is to make superstars obsolete, it's pretty old fashioned to be looking for superstars anymore

 

 

right on the money.

[BlueStrat]

 

right on the money.

 

 

It is, and it isn't. I mean, if the result of it's power is to make sure superstars are obsolete, I agree.

 

But I doubt that a good many of the bands and acts putting music up, spamming for friends, angling for hits and downloads, and promoting the crap out of themselves see it that way. I think a very significant number of them see myspace as indeed at the very least a stepping stone to stardom, if not a means in itself to it.

 

There's large gap between intent and result.

 

BTW- I agree with Dean, and have made his point before, too: Superstars are a result of shared cultural experience that are one facet of a cohesive society. Once society loses all of it's common experiences and values, it quickly begins to break down, which is what Balkanization does. We're a long ways away from that, but music is one more way in which the culture is becoming isolated into genre and lifestyle 'tribes'.

[jlantsberger]

That wasn't my point...I was saying that by your assumptions, there would be no superstars in general being created these days, let alone one from a relatively new promotional medium.

 

 

I think that's exactly what he was trying to say.

 

Your point, if I got it right, is that it will take time for superstars to emerge from myspace, right? Based on bands like JFAC? But that's the thing right there. I only happen to know that band because I happen to have friends who like annoying (personal opinion) breakdownmoshmetal. But I think the definition of superstar (though there seems to be debate about this in the thread) is to have such mass appeal that most people can't help but know who you are. Which? They don't.

 

Myspace can be a tool to do this, but not without labels, at least not now and probably no time soon. Hell, look at the featured artists on myspace music's front page. I can't check it right now because I'm at work, but every time I've seen it, it's been major label artists.

 

It reminds me of a convo I had with an ex girlfriend's mother one time. She was wondering if it would be possible to have major protest songs like in the late 60s that could be used to move people to action, or at least raise major awareness of social/political issues. I told her it wasn't possible, because due to the internet, myspace, ipods, there are no longer people who's songs have that kind of reach. Yeah, Nickleback has a song about everybody getting along and "seeing the day that nobody dies" that recently got a ton of radioplay. Most people I know have never heard it, because they're so far into their own genres.

[mickeydean]

It is, and it isn't. I mean, if the result of it's power is to make sure superstars are obsolete, I agree. But I doubt that a good many of the bands and acts putting music up, spamming for friends, angling for hits and downloads, and promoting the crap out of themselves see it that way. I think a very significant number of them see myspace as indeed at the very least a stepping stone to stardom, if not a means in itself to it. There's large gap between intent and result.

 

 

i think a good many people on MySpace have much lower expectations than the traditional version of superstardom. it's not american idol lol.

 

sure there are people who believe My Space is a stepping stone or the means to stardom as you say, but i see those folks sorta like people laughing at a joke they don't really get.

[mickeydean]

BTW- I agree with Dean, and have made his point before, too: Superstars are a result of shared cultural experience that are one facet of a cohesive society. Once society loses all of it's common experiences and values, it quickly begins to break down, which is what Balkanization does. We're a long ways away from that, but music is one more way in which the culture is becoming isolated into genre and lifestyle 'tribes'.

 

 

dean has more opinions than gigs.

[sabriel9v]

"Superstars are a result of shared cultural experience that are one facet of a cohesive society. Once society loses all of it's common experiences and values, it quickly begins to break down, which is what Balkanization does. We're a long ways away from that, but music is one more way in which the culture is becoming isolated into genre and lifestyle 'tribes'."

 

This is one of the smartest things I've read in this forum.