Members bernardo gui Posted October 16, 2012 Members Share Posted October 16, 2012 Originally Posted by 67mike Just curious.....WTF happens if your neck needs adjustment with seasonal changes? What happens if you change string gauge or tension? I think the above would throw plekk out the door? Neck adjustments,no problem Higher gauge strings, "adjust" the nut. Remember: PLEK is the uniformed, computerized leveling of your fretboard. Having someone who KNOWS how to use the PLEK machine properly is crucial. My homeboy Mel said it: action so low, you wanna raise it. (I played a $100 Squire Strat that was PLEK'ed & it played like a $3000 Custom Shop Strat....blew me away) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Canadian Jeff Posted October 16, 2012 Members Share Posted October 16, 2012 Originally Posted by bernardo gui Neck adjustments,no problem Higher gauge strings, "adjust" the nut. Remember: PLEK is the uniformed, computerized leveling of your frets. Having someone who KNOWS how to use the PLEK machine properly is crucial. My homeboy Mel said it: action so low, you wanna raise it. (I played a $100 Squire Strat that was PLEK'ed & it played like a $3000 Custom Shop Strat....blew me away) fify Also, for what it's worth, my $100 fret leveling kit will get a Squier playing like a CS Fender and you don't need to live anywhere near a Plek machine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BydoEmpire Posted October 16, 2012 Members Share Posted October 16, 2012 I don't know, I think it is catching on. I see a lot more companies advertising that their guitars are PLEK'd than I did 3 years ago. Expense will probably keep it from being used on cheaper guitars, and as was mentioned, it's no guarantee of perfection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman3001 Posted October 16, 2012 Members Share Posted October 16, 2012 Originally Posted by Canadian Jeff fify Also, for what it's worth, my $100 fret leveling kit will get a Squier playing like a CS Fender and you don't need to live anywhere near a Plek machine. Where can I get this fret leveling kit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Canadian Jeff Posted October 16, 2012 Members Share Posted October 16, 2012 Originally Posted by guitarman3001 Where can I get this fret leveling kit? You make it. All I bought was my fret crowning file. The rest is just put together. You also need to know how to setup a guitar. There is a little more to it than just "leveling the frets" (although not much more). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members scolfax Posted October 16, 2012 Members Share Posted October 16, 2012 Originally Posted by OldGuitarPlayer Because it's a gimmick. Completely level frets with precision down to a hundredth of a millimeter is a gimmick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angry Tele Posted October 16, 2012 Members Share Posted October 16, 2012 as you see in the video Gibson pleks thier guitars before they finish them let alone put the strings on. I thought plek would be one of the last steps but its not. All it does is level and polish the frets. Putting the strings on and adjusting the truss rod, and bridge is done by humans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Burgess Posted October 16, 2012 Members Share Posted October 16, 2012 We have a saying were I work, and yes we do manufacture products, that saying is: "If it works, don't fix it." So if your guitars are already selling why would you want to spend more money so they would do what, sell? Doesn't make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angry Tele Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Originally Posted by Burgess We have a saying were I work, and yes we do manufacture products, that saying is: "If it works, don't fix it." So if your guitars are already selling why would you want to spend more money so they would do what, sell? Doesn't make sense. Probably because people associate plek with high-end instruments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Burgess Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Originally Posted by Angry Tele Probably because people associate plek with high-end instruments. Yeah, it would make sense on a high end axe.. I'll just stick with good setup. Seems to me once you start bending strings it all goes out the window anyway but what do I know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Canadian Jeff Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Forget bending. How about when winter hits and your fretboard dries out a little? It's pretty unlikely that your frets didn't move at all. How about when summer hits and your fretboard absorbs some moisture? Your frets just moved again. What about just playing the darn thing? Your taking weight off and putting it back on the neck very rapidly. Your frets just moved again. Play your guitar? You're wearing down your frets.The whole "accuracy down to an imperceptible level" thing is a tad laughable to me. There are so many things that will cause the landscape of your guitar to change that it's utter folly to assume a well-leveled board one day is going to be exactly the same the next. I'm not saying tomorrow you're going to wake up and your guitars will be fretting out everywhere, just that such a level of precision as is described when anybody mentions a Plek machine is impossible to maintain. If we were talking about composite guitars and stainless frets I'd be all over a Plek job like a fat kid on cake. For wooden instruments though? Again, I'll stick to my budget fret-leveling tools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angry Tele Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 but it takes a plek 10 minutes to level and polish frets, almost perfectly. How long does it take a human to do a crappy job? 1 hour? at the very least plek insures consistant quality, and decreased labor/cost. Gibson has 8 pleks, 1 guy runs them. Thats 8 guitars every 10 minutes paying 1 guy instead of maybe 8 guitars a day 1 guy could probably do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Canadian Jeff Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Originally Posted by Angry Tele but it takes a plek 10 minutes to level and polish frets, almost perfectly. How long does it take a human to do a crappy job? 1 hour? at the very least plek insures consistant quality, and decreased labor/cost. Gibson has 8 pleks, 1 guy runs them. Thats 8 guitars every 10 minutes paying 1 guy instead of maybe 8 guitars a day 1 guy could probably do. I was thinking more from the perspective of the end-user. It takes me about an hour, though I don't do a crappy job... Anyway, I've setup a lot of guitars and IMO the #1 thing that needs attention on new guitars is nut height. You can actually get the action fairly low with junk frets so long as the bridge is able to stay relatively high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stringbender11 Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 The technology of the PLEK is pretty amazing in the video. Personally though I prefer it to be done by hand by a luthier, even if it isnt as perfect. I like the personal touch. Obviously not everyone feels the same as me though.To answer the OPs question, I agree with the posters that said guitar makers arent setting up their guitars now, so why add an unnecessary expense? It seems like just about every new guitar you buy from the major brands could use a set up right out of the box, so manufacturers are clearly not doing them. Therefore I doubt they're clamoring to add expensive, complicated machines to their factories to do something they dont do anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members scolfax Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Originally Posted by Canadian Jeff Forget bending. How about when winter hits and your fretboard dries out a little? It's pretty unlikely that your frets didn't move at all. How about when summer hits and your fretboard absorbs some moisture? Your frets just moved again. What about just playing the darn thing? Your taking weight off and putting it back on the neck very rapidly. Your frets just moved again. Play your guitar? You're wearing down your frets. The whole "accuracy down to an imperceptible level" thing is a tad laughable to me. There are so many things that will cause the landscape of your guitar to change that it's utter folly to assume a well-leveled board one day is going to be exactly the same the next. I'm not saying tomorrow you're going to wake up and your guitars will be fretting out everywhere, just that such a level of precision as is described when anybody mentions a Plek machine is impossible to maintain. If we were talking about composite guitars and stainless frets I'd be all over a Plek job like a fat kid on cake. For wooden instruments though? Again, I'll stick to my budget fret-leveling tools. Don't bother brushing your teeth, they'll just get dirty as soon as you eat something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ralph onion Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Thank you for the video. Everything guitar is getting so damned complicated now. Paint jobs, where they are made, types of strings, what kind of bridge, tremelo or not, what the {censored} the neck is made of, baked maple or helicopter blade composits, {censored}! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twangr Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 The Plek process is indeed quite good but, "it ain't all that". It only deals with the frets and the nut. The process is based on several assumptions that are not always 100% reliable. Most notable is that of the set of the truss rod along with grain structure of the neck.As was seen somewhat in the video wood is NOT a stable material (notice the moisturizing of the rough mill room and the various drying cabinets throughout the production process). Neither is wood consistent from piece to piece even if milled off of the same piece of lumber. These inconsistencies can and do work against and occasionally defeat the Plek process.Computerization removes the variability of the human element from the fundamental functions of the Plek process. However, computers and their controlled machines are only as good as the programming running the computer. On top of that there remains the human element of setting the guitar in the machine then removal of the guitar and any further handling after the Plek process. These all offer minor challenges to the Plek process which, though small in themselves, do add to cumulative error when taken all together.Is it worth it? Yes. Definitely! But only on an otherwise good guitar. You have to realize that there are limitations to the technology. Can a luthier do better? Maybe. Maybe not. Here it depends on the skill level of the luthier and his/her ability to accurately diagnose problems and develop the correct solutions without breaking the guitar or the bank.As was pointed out earlier and seen in the video, Gibson puts their guitars through the Plek process before they are even finished let alone have any hardware on them. Another flaw is the variability of strings. Not all strings are consistent in manufacture. Strings also react wildly to variations in temperature.Then there's the final consideration of the player. Strings do not react the same in different tunings. Strings also respond quite differently to how they are plucked, type of pick used, variability in the player's skin structure or even the hardness of callous on the fingers . No computer program, no matter how well written, can account for all these particular variables. The Plek process is a great step forward in many aspects but there are still details and challenges that only a skilled luthier can tweak and rectify to make the guitar an ultimate guitar for the the individual player. Of course, the challenge here is finding that skilled luthier... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Tidal Rhythm Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Why isn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members scolfax Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Originally Posted by twangr The Plek process is indeed quite good but, "it ain't all that". It only deals with the frets and the nut. Sux. A german-engineered computer-controlled robot that only gives you a perfect fretjob and also cuts the nut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members McCain Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Originally Posted by Angry Tele as you see in the video Gibson pleks thier guitars before they finish them let alone put the strings on. I thought plek would be one of the last steps but its not. All it does is level and polish the frets. Putting the strings on and adjusting the truss rod, and bridge is done by humans. I'm surprised they showed that part because that's not a real plek job. Your supposed to have the guitar under string tension first , that's the whole idea behind the machine, all they did was level the frets in a plek machine. It's suppose to be properly set-up and under tension first, I would guesstimate for at lest a week for the neck to settle before it's put in the machine to first be computer analyzed, removed and the strings removed from the fretboard and then put back in the machine. The only thing that makes that a Plek job it the name on the machine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Originally Posted by Ratae Coritanorum So your Johnson got PLEKd? Totally PLEKd. Best PLEK I ever had. A woman of experience who could PLEK like a rabbit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Snappy Hat Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 How did any guitarist write any hits in the last 50 years and more without being Plek'd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PrawnHeed Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 It is. There are many who are still struggling to grasp the concept of CNC machines though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members scolfax Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Some people are very afraid of The Dreaded PLEK! They'll say anything! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angry Tele Posted October 17, 2012 Members Share Posted October 17, 2012 Originally Posted by McCain I'm surprised they showed that part because that's not a real plek job. Your supposed to have the guitar under string tension first , that's the whole idea behind the machine, all they did was level the frets in a plek machine. It's suppose to be properly set-up and under tension first, I would guesstimate for at lest a week for the neck to settle before it's put in the machine to first be computer analyzed, removed and the strings removed from the fretboard and then put back in the machine. The only thing that makes that a Plek job it the name on the machine. yeah in this case they are using plek as a tool to cut labor and increase quality control. Its akin to using a cnc instead of a ban saw like fender did in trhe 50s. Is one better than the other? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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