Divorce, depression, confusion

[Keentwist]

It appears that you have came to the right place, plenty of experts here!!

Do what you gotta do man!!!

[Detox]

Work on having a positive outlook. Think of good things.

[no-logic]

Van....go see your doctor. He will give you a simple test for depression and will help with figuring out if that is your problem. I have been on deprression medication for a year and it has made a different person out of me. I almost left my wife also. It brought me to my senses and I love her more now than I ever did. Do it!

[vanlatte]

Originally posted by Weirdocat As for my "insensitive and harmful comments".. I think that should be left up to Vanlatte to hike me up on it.. which so far, he has not. He is more than aware of the situation, and I am fully confident he will approach it with the best will in the world.

 

 

I didnt take it as insensitive or harmful at all. I took it as "regardless of what state of mind you were in, you hurt me so here comes the whuppin'".

 

We now return you to our regularly scheduled broadcast of "Tomato, Tomoto, Potato, Pototo"

[Bluesman0511]

Originally posted by Zamfir ...Find the right couples therapist. May take some shopping around (get references from friends?), given the mesh of three personalities. The good ones teach listening and communicating skills (which frankly, we men are often not particularly good at, so we get frustrated and angry when we don't get what we want)...

 

 

 

Originally posted by s4001 ...Psychiatrists are basically druggists, for counseling you will need counselors or therapists. Actually you will need both. Try counseling first and only if the counselor feels medication is appropriate, a psychiatrist. If a counselor or psychiatrist doesn't feel right, fire them IMMEDIATELY and find another one. You may need to go thru several of them. There are people out there who can help you, but more who cannot. It's about personality, not technical ability...

 

 

Could not have said it better. I have woefully had way too much experience with this sort of thing, for me and for other family. Grab ahold of whatever method works and cling to it, but don't be afraid to move on if it ain't working for you. Results is the only criteria.

 

One other thing, and this comes from my heart because I relate strongly to your description of your pain. Don't take it all on yourself!!! Admit where you {censored}ed up and then let it go. Clinging to the pain won't help. You need to get past it. Remove as much that is negative from your mind in order to allow the positive stuff to have room.

[Bluesman0511]

Originally posted by Weirdocat ...I grew frustrated over the misconception that depression is classed as a disease, which it most certainly is not. Your ignorance on the matter grows clearer with each post you make. No, it doesn't really matter, but it is important that you understand not to place such labels upon people. Disease, as I mentioned earlier, holds more harmful connotations than "disorder". If you're so concerned for Venlatte's wellbeing, maybe you should accept that terminology?

 

 

Mostly you're both full of {censored}...

 

Do you think that the "diseased" or "disordered" among us really care what you call it? The semantics don't count for a fart in a windstorm as long as there is some help to be found.

[Weirdocat]

Originally posted by Bluesman0511 Mostly you're both full of {censored}... Do you think that the "diseased" or "disordered" among us really care what you call it? The semantics don't count for a fart in a windstorm as long as there is some help to be found.

 

 

such philosphy, especially from one obviously so well versed in mood affective disorders! Or should that be suffering from one?

 

you're entitled to your own opinion although the "full of {censored}" comment was a little unecessary.

[Bluesman0511]

Originally posted by Weirdocat such philosphy, especially from one obviously so well versed in mood affective disorders! Or should that be suffering from one? you're entitled to your own opinion although the "full of {censored}" comment was a little unecessary.

 

 

I don't know about that either. Seems to me that "full of {censored}" is something that is easily provable by objective reality.

 

And while it is also true that each of us is entitled to an opinion, it needs to be understood that "opinion" does not exclude us from being "right" or "wrong".

 

Sorry if I am getting touchy. The "suffering from one" comment actually strikes close to home. So you will forgive me if I believe my opinion carries a little more weight because of it...

[Kin Corn Karn]

Originally posted by Weirdocat can I just say (as a psychology student)

 

No. You're a psychology student. When you have a Ph.D. and/or an MD in psychology and clinical experience, then you get to hold forth on diagnoses. Until then, shut up - you might learn something.

[Bluesman0511]

Originally posted by Kin Corn Karn No. You're a psychology student . When you have a Ph.D. and/or an MD in psychology and clinical experience, then you get to hold forth on diagnoses. Until then, shut up - you might learn something.

 

 

And even as a practicing clinical psychologist of considerable reknown I will still not abandon my intelligence and fully submit to your opinion if I disagree in my own mind and experience.

 

I hope I made that abundantly clear...

[Bluesman0511]

I want to apologize. I think I ( and maybe a few others ) have steared this thread in a wholly inappropraie direction considering the serious nature of Van's original post.

I am sincerely sorry...

[bnyswonger]

I think a few other apologies may be in order.

This was the wrong thread for you guys to get in a pissing match in.

Positive vibes Vanlatte. PM me if you need to talk to someone.

[der oxenrig]

Originally posted by Bassius www.zoloft.com :D:D serioulsy

Everybody i've talked to who's taken that has just made things worse. I've taken it and had to be taken off of it because it just made me even more depressed & pissed off. I'd avoid it if I were you.

[Undertoad]

Everyone's brain chemistry is different and so it make take a few tries to get it right.

[Craig Vecchione]

Originally posted by Weirdocat since when was I condescending and dismissive?

Let's see:

"er.. it's a disorder. Different from a disease. Get it right."

"I'm not going to say any more on this. It is an affective mood disorder, and has been classified as such for a long time. And no website you've just googled is going to change that."

Originally posted by Weirdocat I grew frustrated over the misconception that depression is classed as a disease, which it most certainly is not. Your ignorance on the matter grows clearer with each post you make.

There's the condescention again. You think me ignorant for using a term that has been shown to be used in context by the AMA? You may have a couple of years of classes under your belt, but I've dealt with depression in my family, and with their doctors, for probably longer than you've been alive. They allow room for and use both terms. Perhaps you could try to be less unyielding.

Originally posted by Weirdocat No, it doesn't really matter, but it is important that you understand not to place such labels upon people. Disease, as I mentioned earlier, holds more harmful connotations than "disorder". If you're so concerned for Venlatte's wellbeing, maybe you should accept that terminology? And for the record, it is not my opinion, but stated fact (at the moment). As for my "insensitive and harmful comments".. I think that should be left up to Vanlatte to hike me up on it.. which so far, he has not. He is more than aware of the situation, and I am fully confident he will approach it with the best will in the world.

It's you that is ascribing labels and connotation to a simple term. Having a "disorder" is no less serious than having a "disease".

Do you think your comments are read only by Vanlatte? Obviously your words have negatively touched several others who have commented here, and possibly more who have not.

Please read *MY* replies. I haven't argued the terminology until this post; it doesn't matter whether you call it disease or disorder. My issue has been with your other comments.

Originally posted by Weirdocat And finally... my response to Zamfir's response was pure joy at finally having someone on my side Whilst fighting a lone battle is fun at best, it's always nice when someone shares your opinion. Especially when it's backed up by a weighty tome of DSM-IV

The AMA seems to feel differently. But they're perhaps not so weighty?

[bonscottvocals]

Deep, dark depression, excessive misery.
If it weren't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all.
Blues, dispair and agony on me....

[Weirdocat]

Originally posted by Kin Corn Karn No. You're a psychology student . When you have a Ph.D. and/or an MD in psychology and clinical experience, then you get to hold forth on diagnoses. Until then, shut up - you might learn something.

Perhaps someone should tell all those medical students who get to practise in hospitals that they should quit it? Because they're only students?

I must say, I'm taken aback by the vicious responses by so many people on this forum! Craigv, for the last time, depression is referred to as a disorder, not a disease. It's one of the first things we lowly students learn in psychopathology. It is called such, because calling it a disease implies that it is infectious and non-treatable. The wording may not matter to you personally, but it does matter to some people who don't like beng told they have a brain disease Plese understand that I do speak on some authority here, regardless of my student status, I do actually know what I'm talking about although I may not have placed it in the right way

And finally Bluesman, you can {censored} off And no, I didn't learn that in psych 101.

[BigPigPeaches]

I would personally like to make the following offer: I will gladly sodomize anyone currently involved in this thread.






























That's what I thought. No takers.

[Rippin' Robin]

Originally posted by BigPigPeaches I would personally like to make the following offer: I will gladly sodomize anyone currently involved in this thread.

 

 

Damn, I miss out.

 

*sigh*

[Craig Vecchione]

Originally posted by Weirdocat Craigv, for the last time, depression is referred to as a disorder, not a disease. It's one of the first things we lowly students learn in psychopathology. It is called such, because calling it a disease implies that it is infectious and non-treatable. The wording may not matter to you personally, but it does matter to some people who don't like beng told they have a brain disease

As I stated earlier, *I'm* not debating what depression is labeled. My problem has been with your comments, and especially the attitude you've taken towards me. You essentially started right out by insulting my intelligence with the "get it right" thing. If you didn't intend for that comment to seem condescending, you should pay a lot more attention to how you write.

As a lay person I'm not required to know the specific term of an illness. Considering the fact that depression is labeled in many ways (disorder, disease, illness, condition) in many sources, it's way out of line for you to call me 'ignorant'.


You state "Disease" implies infectious and non-treatable.

According to Webster's Medical Dictionary:
"Main Entry: dis

[N*Joy]

Originally posted by T. Alan Smith T Next, KEEP SHARING YOUR EMOTIONS WITH EACH OTHER. Finally, try taking the bulk of the attention you pay to yourself and your feelings, and put it into your wife and what she's feeling. Marriage is work. It's discipline.

 

 

+1 WTF is the point in paying someone to get you talking when you can do it yourself!?!

[bassballs]

Originally posted by vanlatte I am a fargin wreck Some of you know I served my wife with divorce papers last week. I have since called it off. The last few years for me have been an exercise in frustation; knowing that I have a good wife but craving independance. After 15 years of marriage I decided to end it. I didnt realize it at the time, but I am beggining to wonder if I am depressed. I was emotionless through the whole process; it's almost like I blocked everything out to make it easier. I watched my wife crumble before my eyes getting quite possible the worst news she has ever had, other than the death of a loved one. I was utterly unmoved. Each step of the way I wondered if the next step would ignite some feeling in me, but nothing did. Then, 4 days after serving her, I was driving home and NINs "Hurt" happend to be playing. When it got to this line: What have I become My sweetest friend I was overcome with guilt and regret in such huge portions that I had to pull over. There was a small voice, somewhere inside whispering "You can't do this, you can't leave your sweetest friend. Go back to her" I raced home and we spent the entire day talking and crying. It was like all the pent up emotion had nowhere else to go and it just rocked both of us. I called off the divorce but we are not out of the woods yet. I am wondering if there is something deep going on here; I seem to have this namless pain that surfaces once in a while to lash out at those closest to me and it's been going on for far to long. I have never been a fan of counseling or "touchy feely" stuff so I am not really sure where to turn here. I feel like I am walking around in a fog; everything is far away and I am always on the verge of breaking down. Anyone been through this, or have any good advice on where to start? Might seem like an odd request to make on an internet forum but I know there are all shapes and sizes here and have come to value the opinions of many who post here.

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Undertoad

Do you show other symptoms of depression? They are:

* Persistent sad, anxious, or "empty" mood
* Feelings of hopelessness, pessimism
* Feelings of guilt, worthlessness, helplessness
* Loss of interest or pleasure in hobbies and activities that were once enjoyed, including sex
* Decreased energy, fatigue, being "slowed down"
* Difficulty concentrating, remembering, making decisions
* Insomnia, early-morning awakening, or oversleeping
* Appetite and/or weight loss or overeating and weight gain
* Thoughts of death or suicide; suicide attempts
* Restlessness, irritability
* Persistent physical symptoms that do not respond to treatment, such as headaches, digestive disorders, and chronic pain

If you are in a depressed state, everything can seem less meaningful, including your relationships.

Many many people have benefitted from talk therapy, medication, or both. Put away any preconceptions you have about psychiatry and stuff, and if you have some of those symptoms, make an appointment to see a psychatric doc. You will thank yourself a thousand times over, if this is the case.

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I was recently diagnosed with depression. I never knew I had it. I thought everyone had their good and bad days like I do. Everyone does have good and bad days but, not like I do.

Most of the times when I get down, nothing triggers it. It just happens. I can't control it. I wish I could. The only thing I can do is hope it passes quickly and it isn't a bad one this time.

Most of the times when I get depressed, it lasts a few days. I just feel down. I feel worthless and very insignificant in this world. I'm very unmotivated when I get depressed and I become very introverted. Sometimes, not a lot but sometimes when I get into these funks, if its a bad one...I have thoughts of what it would be like if I just wasn't around. I think of what I will leave behind for my family and I calculate how long the money will last...If it will cover both of my children going to a good college, pay off the mortgage and still have enough money for my wife to live comfortably and raise my children with everything they need. I actually put a dollar amount on my existance. It's not a question of how to do it. I have a mental list that I've had as long as I can remember.

Anyway, my doctor gave me a perscription. I seem to have more good days than bad now. Before it was about 50/50 or 60/40...Now 85/15...I haven't had a really bad day since I've started taking the perscription. However, I have had a couple of days when I was down. Nothing intense. It passes pretty quickly now too.

If you have some of these thoughts, feeling or symptoms listed, please, do youself and your family and friends a favor. See your doctor.

Hope this helps Bro. Good luck and keep us posted.

[Sixgun77]

Originally posted by bassballs Anyway, my doctor gave me a perscription. I seem to have more good days than bad now. Before it was about 50/50 or 60/40...Now 85/15...I haven't had a really bad day since I've started taking the perscription. However, I have had a couple of days when I was down. Nothing intense. It passes pretty quickly now too.

 

 

That's great. I wish I could have found something that helped me out that well. Would have made my high school and middle school years so much more pleasant, not to mention my stay in the military. If it's helping, stick with it.

[Craig Vecchione]

Originally posted by N*Joy +1 WTF is the point in paying someone to get you talking when you can do it yourself!?!

 

 

Depends what the talking is about. Some couples can't get anywhere without some direction to keep the conversation from degenerating into the "same old fight". Sometimes the change of situation is needed, or the outside viewpoint may lend a fresh look at things. Some people are hard to draw out of a shell they've been stuck inside for years, and need constant encouragement.

 

I can personally state that the right counselor can be a godsend, and the wrong one can do more damage than good. Unfortunately it's often hard to know who's who until you've sat down and paid the money. And sometimes it's better to have some individual sessions before deciding whether to sit down together and work on things.

 

This is from too many years experience with marriage counseling, fighting, sometimes unsuccessfully to keep a marriage together. This month I've been married 22 years. Many of them have been with some level of problem, 1-1/2 of those were spent living apart, and the future isn't too bright. Of the counselors we've seen most were a complete waste of time...had no input whatsoever, or spent months discussing how we felt about our parents or childhood and never got around to the problems that brought us there. You have to watch out for the counselor who is looking at you as nothing more than a billable hour. I remember one who really couldn't offer more than, "don't throw out the baby with the bathwater". Great. Thanks.

[The Real MC]

Van, when you go to counseling you should address those cravings of independence. That could be the root cause of your problems. You've been married 15 years, and something is gnawing at you like a bug up your ass. Out of frustration, you initiated divorce proceedings instead of talking to your spouse about it. You know now that was a bad move. Get through the regret and remorse, and move on.

The next step is to find a compromise on how to satisfy your cravings while maintaining a marriage relationship. That may mean you may have to meet somewhere in the middle, you may not be able to have 100% of your cravings satisfied. Your spouse gave up a lot to live with you for 15 years, so you may have to give something up too. Marriage is a compromise. This takes the two of you to make it work, and it sounds like your spouse is willing to stay in the game. Trust me my friend, you have a good woman on your hands (from her reaction to what you put her through) and you don't want to let her go. She'll help you get through this, but both of you will have to work at it.

You're not the first person to go through this. Many professionals are fiercely independent yet lead healthy marriage relationships. They make it work because both sides reach a compromise and the wife will support it. The best example I can think of is Ronnie Van Zant of Lynyrd Skynyrd. His wife knew he was a career musician, knew the sacrifices it took to make it, and accepted it and supported him despite the fact that Ronnie was away all the time. Ronnie was very appreciative of his wife's support.

Engineers, lawyers, doctors, managers, nurses, there are all kinds of professions where independence and marriage can make it work.

I went through depression when my ex abandoned the marriage. I got through it with zero meds. Two things helped a great deal.

Talking with friends who went through a similar experience makes you realize that you are not alone. You have to find people who can emphasize and have a face to face talk with them. It isn't the same on HC or the net. When I talked with musician friends who got through it, that's when I started to crawl out of that hole.

Being in a good church also helps a great deal. I strongly believe that was the reason I was able to get through depression with zero meds. I was lucky to rent a room from this Baptist family. I started going to Bible study and attending services. I understood the Bible a lot better and realized that the Bible was the solution to depression. A lot of folks can be skeptical, but it worked for me.

Hang in there, Van. A lot of couples have traveled that road and have made it through the storm together. You got a spouse who is willing to go through it with you, and that is the best thing you could ever have.