File Under "Cool": Mini nuclear plants to power 20,000 homes

[burdizzos]

 

Question, burdizzos: For someone like me, 27 years of age, who has a college degree and is stuck working in retail world, what kind of education would be a good prerequisite to get involved with upcoming high tech jobs? The nuclear, solar, and wind power industries will be growing by leaps and bounds in the next few decades. My company already told me they would pay half my tuition if I get my MBA, but I'm wondering if a dual degree involving something completely different might serve me better. I guess with the uncertain economy I've been thinking hard about making a career change into something more secure and high paying.

 

 

There are many community colleges and tech schools that offer programs in Electromechanical Instrumentation and Power Production and Distribution, including many online type courses. The industry is going toward computer based digital control systems with PLC based local controls for small scale operations. The technology in this industry is changing at a ridiculous pace.

 

There will be a significant turnover in Instrumentation Techs in the next few years. Most guys in the business are over 55.

 

Check out thinkjobs.com for listings of I&C Tech type jobs.

[bassman1956]

I'll volunteer my back yard for the first installation.

 

 

I'll take the second!

 

 

Am already looking at small wind & solar, most likely not viable but... Also looking at rain water collection for the yard, and radiant floor heat. Little measures add up.

[bassman1956]

While we're talking energy, just curious. I've got forced hot air in a ranch with basement, 1400sq ft, 90% eff. furnace about 10 years old, and an atrocious 30 year old gas heater for the garage/workshop, and even worse 25 year old A/C unit out back. The 2 things I can do this next year to really benefit things is to replace the A/C unit (tech says it's shot anyways, "don't even lean on it!"), and get a better workshop heater. But for the house, not worth it yet unless there's a big savings on energy. I'd still need the forced air system for the A/C.

 

Anyone done this swap? Forced air to radiant floor heat?

 

 

Edit:

oops, meant for this to be a new thread.

 

D'Oh!

[Renfield]

Energy and water. Those two fields will always be in demand, and are recession-proof. I'm starting to hate my job, and I'm applying for school starting next year, hopefully in the spring. I'm torn between pursuing a degree in graphic design, or a degree in Water Quality Management. One would satisfy me personally, the other would provide job security. C7

 

 

Despite your recent issues with graphic artists, as one I highly suggest staying the hell away from it if your goal is long term job security and money. There isn't really a whole lot of either for 99% of the people out there.

[Craig Vecchione]

I can see tree-huggers locking this up in court forever.

[bassman1956]

 

I can see tree-huggers locking this up in court forever.

 

 

Yes but.

 

The energy crunch is eminent by any path. Sooner or later it needs faced. When that time comes, maybe this will be good.

[Craig Vecchione]

 

Yes but. The energy crunch is eminent by any path. Sooner or later it needs faced. When that time comes, maybe this will be good.

 

 

I think this has potential to be a fantastic solution. Small power is good....it's actually more efficient due to reduced line losses, and less prone to terrorist activity. It's no free lunch by any means, but it's got a good shot at working out. As long as the tree huggers don't beat it the way they've managed to {censored} this country out of good nuclear power the last 30 years.

[burdizzos]

I think the power industry will shut this down before the environmentalists do.

 

They have a vested interest in centralized and regulated power production and distribution.

 

Decentralizing power production and distribution would lead to widespread deregulation and plummeting energy costs. Power companies that have spent millions on long term compliance for large fossil fuel plants will not let something like this happen without a huge fight because they stand to lose their asses unless they get gov't assurances that they will be the sole proprietor of the new plants.

[Renfield]

I think the power industry will shut this down before the environmentalists do. They have a vested interest in centralized and regulated power production and distribution. Decentralizing power production and distribution would lead to widespread deregulation and plummeting energy costs. Power companies that have spent millions on long term compliance for large fossil fuel plants will not let something like this happen without a huge fight because they stand to lose their asses unless they get gov't assurances that they will be the sole proprietor of the new plants, and be allowed to continue to rape the consumers despite the well documented lower costs of alternatives.

 

 

Fixed.

[burdizzos]

 

Fixed.

 

 

Take your complaint to the gov't. They are the regulators of energy production and distribution. The companies are merely meeting the requirements set forth by the man.

 

What cheaper alternatives are you talking about?

[Renfield]

Take your complaint to the gov't. They are the regulators of energy production and distribution. The companies are merely meeting the requirements set forth by the man. What cheaper alternatives are you talking about?

 

 

Funny, sounded like this was your complaint. I just added my 2 cents to it.

 

The cheaper alternative is what was mentioned in the OP.

[Crescent Seven]

Despite your recent issues with graphic artists, as one I highly suggest staying the hell away from it if your goal is long term job security and money. There isn't really a whole lot of either for 99% of the people out there.

That's kinda what I figured. I'm just tired of not being happy; I have no expectation of wealth, and without a degree, I'm never going to be either happy or wealthy. The money isn't the motivation, I want to work for myself someday. I've considered being a many-jobs kind of guy, someone that works for himself doing a few different things. To me, my time and my psyche are more important than having money and things. Right now, I'm close to broke and I'm becoming more and more depressed as I start to see that what I'm doing right now isn't going to satisfy me anymore, especially in light of several changes my company and industry has made this year, starting with changes to the pay scale that has culminated in me getting a $170 paycheck this week, when on the old plan, it was several times that. I could make more than that designing flyers for local bands.
C7

[burdizzos]

 

Funny, sounded like this was your complaint. I just added my 2 cents to it. The cheaper alternative is what was mentioned in the OP.

 

 

 

My complaint is two fold, but it's impossible to point a finger at who is really at fault because it is a chicken and egg situation. First, gov't regulation will make something like the small scale reactor impossible. Secondly, larger power companies will lobby like hell to make sure it doesn't happen or at least ensure that their stake in the industry is covered. Since the gov't is responsible for the regulation that encourages the industry to lobby, I can't really blame the power companies, but I know that they are not above reproach.

 

The reactor in the OP could be a cheaper altrernative, but that all depends of the gov't. Notice a recurring theme here?

[L-1329]

Cool indeed. I wonder if they could scale it down furthur and use them to power commercial ships. That would save a LOT of oil if the large ships ran on little and responsibly safe reactors, plus not needing to be refueled for a decade would probably be cheaper for the operators too.

[Renfield]

That's kinda what I figured. I'm just tired of not being happy; I have no expectation of wealth, and without a degree, I'm never going to be either happy or wealthy. The money isn't the motivation, I want to work for myself someday. I've considered being a many-jobs kind of guy, someone that works for himself doing a few different things. To me, my time and my psyche are more important than having money and things. Right now, I'm close to broke and I'm becoming more and more depressed as I start to see that what I'm doing right now isn't going to satisfy me anymore, especially in light of several changes my company and industry has made this year, starting with changes to the pay scale that has culminated in me getting a $170 paycheck this week, when on the old plan, it was several times that. I could make more than that designing flyers for local bands. C7

Sounds like we're in similar boats. I don't have the piece of paper, but I know if I get it, at most I'd qualify for $5k more a year, and that's at the top end of the scale.

I just spent my Friday and Saturday (one of my days off) working a tradeshow effectively for free as I am salary. I took $100 out of my account before I left to make sure I could cover expenses while gone (that's about a third of my take home for the week). I came back with $3 in change in my pocket and I'll be able to get at most $40 back in expenses, half that was gas.

I also had to take 2 hours of my other day off, today, to return the company van to the office, I wasn't allowed to bring it back tomorrow morning for reasons they couldn't give me.

I answered questions for people with pieces of paper and no clue all weekend. Those people make an easy $10k+ more than I'll ever make and it's me telling them how to do their jobs.

[bassman1956]

Cool indeed. I wonder if they could scale it down furthur and use them to power commercial ships. That would save a LOT of oil if the large ships ran on little and responsibly safe reactors, plus not needing to be refueled for a decade would probably be cheaper for the operators too.

 

 

Ah, cool.

 

Didn't the Navy experiment with this a few times?

Wonder if they had any luck.

 

 

[burdizzos]

Ah, cool. Didn't the Navy experiment with this a few times? Wonder if they had any luck.

 

 

Most aircraft carriers and all US navy submarines are nuclear powered. The trouble is that they are powered by the most inefficient nuclear reactors on the planet. They must be made that way so that they are inherently stable and, more importantly, they can respond to rapid changes in steam demand for changes in propulsion demand during maneuvering.

 

Small reactors could be effectively used on commercial ships if they were used to solely produce electrical power and then the electrical power was used for propulsion. That way, efficient and safe designs could be used. The trouble there is energy storage and it's a huge PITA to design a reactor system that can deal well with a moving and rolling platform.

[Les_Izzmor]

or at least ensure that their stake in the industry is covered.

To me, this is the most likely scenario. They "fast-track" these things but only when they know they're going to get a cut of it.

Sort of like the Mafia, you want to do business in our area you gotta pay tribute.

[bassman1956]

A few years back, UEC, Universal Electric, out of Akron, was working on a turbine generator setup for small hydro plants. I even toured the place, and their test plant built on the Cuyahoga river. Was the same idea: small enough to be moved as a modular skid, and useful any place there was a moderate flow and at least a six foot difference in head. I kept up with them for a couple years. Was hoping to jump on when they went public. Then they disappeared. Apparently too small a company for the battle.

[ec437]

There is no reason this same technology can't be scaled up (say 10X output) and mounted on barges. That could eliminate many of the licensing/siting issues and make the installation/swap in/out process very easy. Decentralizing generation makes a lot of sense all the way around. You could probably power a small country with the transmission losses in the United States alone.

Yeah, cause if there's anything that people love more than radioactive boxes buried underground, its way bigger radioactive boxes floating in their fresh water

[Mr.Mow]

Despite your recent issues with graphic artists, as one I highly suggest staying the hell away from it if your goal is long term job security and money. There isn't really a whole lot of either for 99% of the people out there.

Sorry to be OT..

But I agree, I did a degree in commercial photography then got a job as a Graphic artist, did it for 9 years.. {censored} that..

If you love design work, love doing art.. Don't take it up as a career, I found pretty quickly the desire I had to do the work I wanted to do disappeared, you spend all day doing other people stuff last thing you want to do when you get home is you own.. But that's just me!

I've been out of it for 3 years now and am starting to do my own work again and starting to enjoy it.

Problem I found with that sort of industry is you always have to stay on top and ahead of everything, there's always some young dude behind you willing to do more work for less money and has a 'newer hipper funkier' style and in an industry that is run on 'the latest style' it can be hard work.. (especially advertising).

Always exceptions to all that though I guess..

Oh, power plants, {censored}, those things are cool..

[burdizzos]

Yeah, cause if there's anything that people love more than radioactive boxes buried underground, its way bigger radioactive boxes floating in their fresh water

 

The people of Norfolk, VA don't seem to mind.

 

 

There are 16 reactors in this picture, which create nearly 5500 MW of thermal energy.

[Perfessor]

I can see tree-huggers locking this up in court forever.

 

 

It won't be tree huggers necessarily. The fact that they are underground means potential contact with groundwater. Then there is the safe removal of spent fuel. There is a security problem. The workers at the local nuke plant have a bad habit of dying in their fifties. I work with a guy who worked at the local nuke plant for 9 years and he knows at least a dozen who have died of cancer.

 

Cool idea though.

[burdizzos]

In order for them to contact ground water, the containment systems would have to fail. Given what I've read thus far, that is a near impossibility.

 

The units are assembled at a factory and sealed. The spent fuel is removed back at the factory.

 

The fuel used is not weapons grade in any form.

 

And of course there would be 24 hour security at all installations. That's why I want to volunteer my back yard for the first installation. I'll serve as the maintenance tech and the security guy all in one as long as I get to have a fully automatic assault rifle.

[Perfessor]

In order for them to contact ground water, the containment systems would have to fail. Given what I've read thus far, that is a near impossibility. The units are assembled at a factory and sealed. The spent fuel is removed back at the factory. The fuel used is not weapons grade in any form. And of course there would be 24 hour security at all installations. That's why I want to volunteer my back yard for the first installation. I'll serve as the maintenance tech and the security guy all in one as long as I get to have a fully automatic assault rifle.

 

 

Dirty bombs don't need weapons grade material.

 

Containers leak. I used to live in Machias, NY, not far from the Springville, NY nuclear containment facility. They made spent fuel into a glass for burial. Most trees within half mile of the place were dead or dying, inside and outside the plant bounderies. Some of the trees were on private property.