Members bassknave Posted November 10, 2003 Members Share Posted November 10, 2003 Hi, gang-- Thanks to a change in day jobs and the fact that Stormfront is working virtually nonstop, I haven't had the time to post much. Besides, Andy, Mark, Dann, Bonehead and a few other newer guys are doing such a great job of helping the rookies that I really didn't want to intrude. I have been able to lurk a little bit, and have been gratified to see that this forum maintains its civil, helpful, respectful, welcoming tone. It's a great little community. I did want to add a few centavos about a thread I read a few days ago. Mark and Andy were commenting on the fact that so many bands use crap sound systems and wondering why that was the case. I want to take it from a different tack: I've spent a fortune developing a quality sound system, and moreover, have been able to locate and train a competent BE to run the thing. You old regulars know my background, but for the rest of you guys: I'm a longtime player and studio/commercial production duck with some pretty serious studio credits. I also sideline in cabinet design, and am a pretty solid tech, too--so on to the matter at hand. My friends and I launched our current project, Stormfront, in 1992. All of us have toured regionally--some have been with national acts. All have played major venues. As players, our histories intertwine all the way back to our first road band in 1969. We had a lot of antiquated soundgear when we strated out--but little in the way of an actual system. From what various bandmembers had, I was able to cobble together a half-decent, albeit huge, PA--PV Project 1 tops and mids over a pair of EVX loaded Altec VOT clones. Power was a mess of scrounged BGW and EV amps, with a heavily hotrodded Acoustic 850 used to drive subs. We had a Tangent 16x1 mixer. I wasn't happy with the sound of the system, so I scammed and horesetraded my way through others to get where I wanted to be. We have a clean, powerful, reasonably portable 10kW 4/4 FOH system that accurately reproduces the strong vocal and complex instrumental sounds that are our signature, and can handle every venue we typically play. What has been critical, though, is our finding of a strong, stable BE who has learned to get the most out of the system I assembled. Our mix is loud, detailed and in-your-face. Not everybody can handle it. We had several years of ups-and-downs in the BE department. Sure, you can go PA-on-a-stick, if you're a good setup guy who's willing to spend all day at the venue making the system work in the room--and if the band is simple enough (say, a trio w/2 vox). At one point a few years ago, we tried suffering with a marginally competent (I'm being kind, here) tech on FOH. I added compression and processing to make the system easier to operate--almost automated it, in fact. The result was that the band sounded sterile, and the tech still couldn't balance the mix (3 gtr, Bas, KBs, drums, 4 vox plus brass). It damn near tore the band apart. Despite our strength, we lost rooms, and were at each other's throats. Guys--FOH is an instrument. A bad system can kill you professionally--but so can a good one, if it's operated by an incompetent loon. In the last three years, we've been able to strip out most of the dynamics processing (except for drums & vox), and build the sound of the band into a heart-stopper, live-sounding, but polished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted November 10, 2003 Members Share Posted November 10, 2003 And that advice, my friends, is worth a million bucks. Look to those who have a history of successes if you wish to become successful. No need to copy other people's mistakes, they have been made before and it's a lot cheaper to learn from them, rather than make the same mistakes yourself. There are a good bunch of professionals who both lurk and participate here. The common thing is that they all have a history of success, and have much valuable information to pass on to those open to learning. Phil is one of them who was always worth listening to. You other know who you are. Professionals do not always agree on all points (Terry ) but generally they agree on about 99%. Put us all in an arena together, give us a semi full of gear, a stage, a band and some catering and you will have a decent show regardless of our minor differences. Each one of us will gravitate towards our strengths and defer to our weeknesses. It's all about the profession and working together. I do trade shows where I know virtually nobody and atthe end of the event, we all leave with a smile on our faces and a job well done. It's when you put people who think they are professional together that you will see the fireworks happen. It's what puts the "burn" into "crash and burn". My 2 cents anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SoundMan Posted November 10, 2003 Members Share Posted November 10, 2003 Hey, and old friend, nice to hear from you Bassknave. SoundMan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bassknave Posted November 10, 2003 Author Members Share Posted November 10, 2003 Thanks, guys! Good to be home. (Smiles, wipes eyes, blows nose) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ATOMICDOG1 Posted November 10, 2003 Members Share Posted November 10, 2003 Hiya Phil! Nice to see you here again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members J the D Posted November 10, 2003 Members Share Posted November 10, 2003 Yo, Phil! How they hangin'? Any chance of Stormfront making a Southern run? Some of us would love to catch the act. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Scodiddly Posted November 10, 2003 Members Share Posted November 10, 2003 Originally posted by agedhorse It's when you put people who think they are professional together that you will see the fireworks happen. It's what puts the "burn" into "crash and burn". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sugarfried Posted November 10, 2003 Members Share Posted November 10, 2003 Hi Phil. Glad to hear that all is well. Please put up a post if/when Stormfront comes to Chicago. I'd like to see you guys.-Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ezstep Posted November 10, 2003 Members Share Posted November 10, 2003 Welcome back, Phil. You were missed. And might I add . . . I am trying to learn that instrument (FOH) all the time. I really do learn something everyday, thanks to you guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tony k Posted November 11, 2003 Members Share Posted November 11, 2003 Good to hear from you Phil! I was just wondering where you'd been a few days ago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TheFriendlySponge Posted November 11, 2003 Members Share Posted November 11, 2003 Good to see you post again, Phil. We who lurk (in Live Sound, anyway) have always appreciated your insights and perspective. Don't be a stranger! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Audioeast Posted November 11, 2003 Members Share Posted November 11, 2003 Hey Phil! Glad to see your poking in again....I miss your one liners...(and knowlegable posts) Crap, if you were not here, i'd probably would have never checked out yorkville (which is now our best line) thanks for all the advice and insight......i never stop learning....eva (sorry that was my Mass accent kicking in "wicked haad doood") Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members g4string Posted November 11, 2003 Members Share Posted November 11, 2003 I am not a regular at this forum, or this website. I usually hang out at www.talkbass.com. I used to post quite a bit in the bass forum. But the lack of professionalism and "young punk ass" kids really got on my nerves. There is not a whole lot of usefull, professional, information in the bass players forum of HC. However, I will I agree that is the most professional and helpful forum on this website. I am quite impressed that I always get a helpfull and professional response to my thread eventhough I am a newbie to live-sound and this forum. You guys are worth your weight in gold! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kennykeys Posted November 11, 2003 Members Share Posted November 11, 2003 Hey Bassknave,I had the idea a few times this past summer to post a "Hey, where's Phil?" message, but then every few weeks or so you'd pop in briefly. Good to hear all is well and that the band is busy (too busy?).Kenny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators MrKnobs Posted November 12, 2003 Moderators Share Posted November 12, 2003 Originally posted by bassknave Guys--FOH is an instrument. A bad system can kill you professionally--but so can a good one, if it's operated by an incompetent loon. In the last three years, we've been able to strip out most of the dynamics processing (except for drums & vox), and build the sound of the band into a heart-stopper, live-sounding, but polished. Mark me down as a firm believer in minimal compression at a live show. What's the point of seeing the band live if it just sounds like the CD turned up loud? Terry D. P.S. Welcome back, big guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zeromus-X Posted November 12, 2003 Members Share Posted November 12, 2003 We should tour together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members groove.77 Posted November 12, 2003 Members Share Posted November 12, 2003 Originally posted by Audiopile Comment: I am not a regular at this forum, or this website. I usually hang out at www.talkbass.com. I used to post quite a bit in the bass forum. But the lack of professionalism and "young punk ass" kids really got on my nerves. Pithy response: It's cause few make it past the initiation here without cowering like a whipped pup. Furthermore, after awhile they figure out they're squaring off against soundfolks here and then realize that arguing with a soundman is a loosing proposition since it's a well known and documented fact that soundmen are always right (just ask one sometime). Heh heh...I made it through the initiation - - but I was still a moron about a few things (I still have that Behringer feedback destroyer in my rack case;)) Good to see ya back, bassknave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members thunderpaw Posted November 12, 2003 Members Share Posted November 12, 2003 Welcome back, Phil! Yeah, you were missed here...just glad it wasn't due to illness, death or rediscovery of the fact that the world really is flat. Kim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rangerkarlos Posted November 12, 2003 Members Share Posted November 12, 2003 Hi Phil! Does Stormfront have a current website? Or maybe you can post a schedule? Karlos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tlbonehead Posted November 12, 2003 Members Share Posted November 12, 2003 WOW,all the oldies are stepping in for Phil's welcome home party. Now,where is 5slinger these days? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ATOMICDOG1 Posted November 12, 2003 Members Share Posted November 12, 2003 Originally posted by rangerkarlos Hi Phil!Does Stormfront have a current website? Or maybe you can post a schedule?Karlos I'll second that request! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rangerkarlos Posted November 18, 2003 Members Share Posted November 18, 2003 Originally posted by ATOMICDOG1 I'll second that request! bumparoni Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted November 18, 2003 CMS Author Share Posted November 18, 2003 Originally posted by g4string I am not a regular at this forum, or this website. I usually hang out at www.talkbass.com. I used to post quite a bit in the bass forum. But the lack of professionalism and "young punk ass" kids really got on my nerves. There is not a whole lot of usefull, professional, information in the bass players forum of HC. However, I will I agree that is the most professional and helpful forum on this website. I am quite impressed that I always get a helpfull and professional response to my thread eventhough I am a newbie to live-sound and this forum. You guys are worth your weight in gold! I've been on the Bass Forum for well over a year and have never seen a legitimate question go unanswered. Just as here, there's a lot of bass experience in that forum. They run their forum more like a pub than a library. But real questions get real answers. You might have 16 wiseass comments too, but that's the price of admission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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