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Minor bluesy jam anyone?

mosiddiqi

By mosiddiqi
in The Lesson Loft — Guitars

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GreenAsJade Newbie

GreenAsJade

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Guys, this is the original terrific take done by Monson in the Euro thread over in GJ..very Hank Marvin..I loved it!..he doesn't post in the LL but I said I wanted to share his take with you all and he's fine with that:


http://www.box.net/shared/858hezizkq

 

Now that's what I call a sparse take!

 

More "Satre" or "Buddha" than "Monson", don't you think? ;)

 

GaJ

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GreenAsJade Newbie

GreenAsJade

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and should be treated as such

 

 

oooeerr? What does this really mean "should be"? It kind of reads like you're saying "if you don't play a ballardy thing over this, you've done it wrong"...

 

I guess you mean "lends itself well to be being treated this way"? I've been playing with it to try to find some _different_ way of approaching it :)

 

Edit: now that I think more about it ... what does it mean, "to treat something as a ballard?". This is a question in the sense of "gee I need to learn about how to think about a ballard, before I can even start to think about how to do it differently!"

 

GaJ

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GreenAsJade Newbie

GreenAsJade

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Great takes everyone. It's cool to hear such different art created over the same canvas.


I had some spare time today, so here's my take on it:




.

 

 

That was really sweet! Can you talk about what goes into it? Scales, note choice, what you were "thinking"?

 

I really liked the approach to the second section... that change is coming up, you're leading up to it to land on the C

 

Thanks!

 

GaJ

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bigboy_78 Newbie

bigboy_78

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That was really sweet! Can you talk about what goes into it? Scales, note choice, what you were "thinking"?


I really liked the approach to the second section... that change is coming up, you're leading up to it to land on the C


Thanks!


GaJ

 

 

I haven't listend to Jasco or Gennation yet, I'm sure they're both killer takes, but I was thinking the same thing. It would be great if the "pros" could outline how they approached it. Turn this thread into more of a lesson session.

 

I'd like to know what Jeremy is playing when he starts playing a million notes to the bar. Is it just arps? Surely these are pre-memorised lines and not something you have picked out on the fly.

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Jasco Newbie

Jasco

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Jasco, great take.. loved the little encirclement gypsy jazz licks you threw in there, too... sounded killer..




Yes, a couple of cheesy things in there like the Django line, and the banjo-roll ascending powerchord. :lol:



But, I think it could have used some HUGE reverb.




LOL, not a chance. :lol: I'll cheat and add some digital ambience if I don't have time to set up extra room mics to catch it live, but no longtail reverbs for me. I lived through that sound in the 80's and I don't want to live through it again. Occaisionally I might use a delay with a fairly severe high pass filter slapped on it.

Today I was experimenting with composite acoustic and electric sounds, since I'm wanting something like that for some upcoming recording I'll be doing.

I mic'd the guitar acoustically, but also ran to an amp in another room and mic'd it, then blended the two mics. I didn't bother to phase align the two mics afterword like I'd do in a real recording, but just kind of ear-balled it during the practice takes.

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Jasco Newbie

Jasco

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That was really sweet! Can you talk about what goes into it? Scales, note choice, what you were "thinking"?


I really liked the approach to the second section... that change is coming up, you're leading up to it to land on the C


Thanks!


GaJ

 

 

Thanks for the comliment.

 

I'm trying not to think while I'm playing, but still kind of keeping track of the chord progression in the back of my mind.

 

The problem I have is if I think too much, it sounds more mechanical than musical.

 

 

When practicing though, I will think about what chords and notes I'm playing, and their relationships and functions. Main focus would be on chord tones, and as the chords change, I'd ask what changes and what stays the same. I'd especially look for notes that change by a half-step.

 

So... One part of this progression has an A7 going to a C.

 

What notes stay the same in each chord? E and G

 

Any notes that change by a half-step? C# to C

 

So, for practice, I might try holding an E or G over the change, or I might try accenting a C# to a C over the change.

 

Hope that helps a little.

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GreenAsJade Newbie

GreenAsJade

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I haven't listend to Jasco or Gennation yet, I'm sure they're both killer takes, but I was thinking the same thing. It would be great if the "pros" could outline how they approached it. Turn this thread into more of a
explicit
lesson session.



+1 :thu:

(my addition of "explicit" :) Theres a lot to learn by just listening and studying, but so much to learn from comments like Jasco's (thanks, J).

If you guys will add "so, the way I tackled this was... " or "what was going through my mind was..." this will be so awesome!

GaJ

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GreenAsJade Newbie

GreenAsJade

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What the hell.


http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=889990&songID=8806167



The other part of "lessons" is feedback :)

For me, this was "too randomly outside". From time to time there are "outside phrases" which don't somehow connect.

Out of curiosity, are phrases like 0:40 deliberate (you're thinking, now I'm mixing this up, going outside") or more like "a mistake"?

If they're a mistake, hey, no shame, I couldn't do better, I'm just interested!

GaJ

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gennation Newbie

gennation

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oooeerr? What does this really mean "should be"? It kind of reads like you're saying "if you don't play a ballardy thing over this, you've done it wrong"...


I guess you mean "lends itself well to be being treated this way"? I've been playing with it to try to find some _different_ way of approaching it
:)

Edit: now that I think more about it ... what does it mean, "to treat something as a ballard?". This is a question in the sense of "gee I need to learn about how to think about a ballard, before I can even start to think about how to do it differently!"


GaJ



Ballad, not Ballard. I assume that was just a typo but I didn't want you to think that was a music term or anything.

What I mean is that this progression is full of classic Minor movements using Harmonic and Melodic scales and Minor cadences and alterations. The is what "Minor" contains...not just derivatives of the Natural Minor scale, or Pentatonic Minor scales.

Approaching it from a Minor Pentatonic and Diatonic 3-note-per-string approach misses a lot of the underlying music and forward motion in the song/progression. IOW, I would call it a Minor Jam and leave the "bluesy" part out, especially for a room full of guitarists.

In this progression it's very easy to build nice Minor melodies, tensions, and resolutions that are not just found in Rock/Blues lickery (that's not not a musical term either).

Take mine and Jasco's take, that's why it sounds different, were playing off melodies and cadences and then embellishing them around the framework of what's going on harmonically.

It makes the music sound like its going somewhere and was played for a reason.

For me, learning how to approach playing comes from a few times being in the studio in the 70's and early 80's and taking a solo and having the guy running the session saying something like "if I wanted George Lynch on my tune I would've hired him." Not specifically George but to that effect. Those are the moments you learn to play beyond your comfort zones, your stock licks or comfortable licks and moves...and you play stuff you've never played before...not because it feels good but because it sounds really good, and it sounds right, and keeps on sounding right, and it becomes the glue of the tune.

Because of these times I NEVER try and play the same thing from tune to tune. It's unimaginative.

You know, I had this chord progression wrote out when I did my take a while ago, and ironically enough Sunday I was cleaning my music room and ran across it and I believe I threw it away. I'll see if it's in the trash and can explain some of the movement going on...

actually, why don't you learn it an post the chord progression. It'll be a great learning experience.

I've always wanted to transcribe my take over this progression, maybe this is a good time to. And then we can pick it apart.

If you want to indulge yourself learn a couple of classic Minor tunes like Summertime or 'Round Midnight.

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gennation Newbie

gennation

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Great takes everyone. It's cool to hear such different art created over the same canvas.


I had some spare time today, so here's my take on it:




First track on the page titled E minor ballad.


And you've got to stop the automatic player at the bottom of the page.

 

 

Nice take Jasco! There's a lot of similarities in our takes. Nice Gypsy quotes in there too.

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pmc100 Newbie

pmc100

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The other part of "lessons" is feedback
:)

For me, this was "too randomly outside". From time to time there are "outside phrases" which don't somehow connect.


Out of curiosity, are phrases like 0:40 deliberate (you're thinking, now I'm mixing this up, going outside") or more like "a mistake"?


If they're a mistake, hey, no shame, I couldn't do better, I'm just interested!


GaJ

 

 

Yep. That was a definite {censored} up :o It was just quickly knocked out in one take and I couldn't be bothered fixing it.

 

I don't have the ear or the theory to follow in key 'correctly' so I was just playing what sounded good to me (apart from the {censored} up). I was playing in E and A which seemed appropriate most of the time but looking back, I missed the changes a couple of times.

 

Thanks for the feed back. I've learned something :thu:

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Mark Wein Newbie

Mark Wein

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Great takes everyone. It's cool to hear such different art created over the same canvas.


I had some spare time today, so here's my take on it:


http://www.jascoguitar.com/rhythmtracks


First track on the page titled E minor ballad.


And you've got to stop the automatic player at the bottom of the page.

 

I'm going to steal your licks. seriously. this is my favorite so far....:eek:

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