Members BerkleeBill Posted June 30, 2006 Members Share Posted June 30, 2006 I'm skeptical this is the "ultimate" VH amp.Sure, the 50wts and "Vox voiced normal channel" ( ) don't add up -- but lets realize one important factor... Van Halen used a 1967 100wt Superlead. A main characteristic of this amp is the shared cathode, wicked low smoothing, and a preamp that doesn't break up until at least 4.Since this amp is a clone of a 68, it's guaranteed to be split cathode -- and that's just gonna sound way different by design. Also, a lot of the 100wt heads from 1968 (and on) had high focussed gain (0.68 cathode bypass on V2) and were quite trebly.Yeah, so you stick a Variac on it and drop the voltage down to 90. Sure, it's gonna brown up like VH - but it's also gonna do a major number on your tubes (like VH did on his). But inherently, I don't think the Variac alone is gonna make a 68 circuit sound like a 67 circuit.You can clearly see what's a doin in the 68 right here:1968 Plexi Circuit -Bill "my story and I'm stickin to it" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DAVID PHILLIPS Posted July 1, 2006 Members Share Posted July 1, 2006 Originally posted by BerkleeBill I'm skeptical this is the "ultimate" VH amp. Sure, the 50wts and "Vox voiced normal channel" ( ) don't add up -- but lets realize one important factor... Van Halen used a 1967 100wt Superlead. A main characteristic of this amp is the shared cathode, wicked low smoothing, and a preamp that doesn't break up until at least 4. Since this amp is a clone of a 68, it's guaranteed to be split cathode -- and that's just gonna sound way different by design. Also, a lot of the 100wt heads from 1968 (and on) had high focussed gain (0.68 cathode bypass on V2) and were quite trebly. Yeah, so you stick a Variac on it and drop the voltage down to 90. Sure, it's gonna brown up like VH - but it's also gonna do a major number on your tubes (like VH did on his). But inherently, I don't think the Variac alone is gonna make a 68 circuit sound like a 67 circuit. You can clearly see what's a doin in the 68 right here: 1968 Plexi Circuit -Bill "my story and I'm stickin to it" It is modeled after a 68, that doesn't mean it is built exactly the same as one. The variac does not effect the tubes. The heaters see a constant voltage, so it doesn't hurt the tubes. The Variplex doesn't break up till after 4.Inside of my Variplex with the Mustard upgrade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 496dart Posted July 1, 2006 Members Share Posted July 1, 2006 the sound clips are very close ...but..theres something slightly different in the low end. A bit flabby/ muddy. That could be the les paul that was used. Re-do the clips with a humbucker strat !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DAVID PHILLIPS Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by 496dart the sound clips are very close ...but..theres something slightly different in the low end. A bit flabby/ muddy. That could be the les paul that was used. Re-do the clips with a humbucker strat !!! Here is another clip of the Variplex into a 4x12 with Vintage 30's instead of 25's. Miked with a SM57 into a API Mic pre. Les Paul. The variac is set at 60 volts so it is running as a 9 watt head. The amp is dimed. Because of some sound differences ,because of coversion to MP3 format, between my original wav and the mp3 of the original clips I posted. I made the bit rate on this clip 320 instead of 192. Davidhttp://www.davidphillipsmusic.com/variplexvintage30.mp3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 64DUECE Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Did Carl bump this thread or something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rawchannel Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 I just think the 2nd clip sounds like good marshall tone, it doesn't have the subharmonic content of the first one. Maybe the v30's handle it a little better than the GB's... how loud is that amp in the room you're recording?? Like, cover your head loud, or like bedroom loud w/the variac? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members shredhead666 Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by carlygtr56 Pic- Would it have killed them to have stuck the variac INSIDE the headbox? It's not like they don't have TONS of room inside those things... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members shredhead666 Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by carlygtr56 I agree with Ratter. The word "nailed" is used too often. I've only ever heard the VH sound "nailed" twice. Once was on VH1, the other time was this dude here who pulled all but one power tube on a 100 watt super lead w/ some slight mods, and ran a variac also. He said the amp was basically going to destroy itself running in that configuration, but damn if it didn't sound just frickin' like VH1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 496dart Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 are you sure there was just one tube in it? I wouldnt think a push/pull--class AB amp would work with just one tube ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 496dart Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by DAVID PHILLIPS Here is another clip of the Variplex into a 4x12 with Vintage 30's instead of 25's. Miked with a SM57 into a API Mic pre. Les Paul. The variac is set at 60 volts so it is running as a 9 watt head. The amp is dimed. Because of some sound differences ,because of coversion to MP3 format, between my original wav and the mp3 of the original clips I posted. I made the bit rate on this clip 320 instead of 192. Davidhttp://www.davidphillipsmusic.com/variplexvintage30.mp3 Dave---i like that one ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members shredhead666 Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by 496dart are you sure there was just one tube in it? I wouldnt think a push/pull--class AB amp would work with just one tube ? Promise. I thought it was pretty weird too. Ask an amp tech though, they'll tell you that it WILL work, but it's generally not a good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members telephant Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by shredhead666 I've only ever heard the VH sound "nailed" twice. Once was on VH1, the other time was this dude here who pulled all but one power tube on a 100 watt super lead w/ some slight mods, and ran a variac also. He said the amp was basically going to destroy itself running in that configuration, but damn if it didn't sound just frickin' like VH1. You're talking about Vhoholic. But even his 5150 clips sound ridiculously close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members thegame Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Doesn't anyone else think that the recording gear used on VH1 (la 2 compressors, neve preamps, analog tape, plate reverb, etc) played a huge part in the tone? What I'm getting at is all these clone amps are trying to reproduce the recorded EVH tone, which was probably different (and dirtier) than the sound coming directly out of the cabs. I can appreciate an amp that doesn't need all that extra stuff to get "that" tone, but then its a different amp IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 496dart Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 excellent point. every guitar tone you hear on CD is "colored" a bit by mics/ mic pre's/ your speakers/ etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members maz_master Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by psychodave Personally, I have not heard anyone get the close to the VH sound unless they were using an old Marshall (ralle). The old plexies have a certain tone that CANNOT be reproduced. If you have never played one in person, you wont be able to understand what I am talking about. I personally think it is the transformers. I think many of the new clones sound better than most of the old ones I've played, many of which sounded like {censored}. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members maz_master Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by DAVID PHILLIPS Here are some clips of the Variplex.I ran a reissue Les Paul with a Tom Holmes in the bridge into the Variplex dimed across the board dropped to 90 volts. The head went into a 70's Marshall cab with 25Watt Greenback reissues. It was then miked with a SM57. No EQ.http://www.davidphillipsmusic.com/variplexrev.mp3 Reverb http://www.davidphillipsmusic.com/variplexdry.mp3 No reverb I still think the original Peacemaker clips did this tone better and more like the original recordings. That said, so much of the old EVH tone so many people seem to be chasing is in the recording process, post FX, mic'ing, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members maz_master Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by Guvnor Not to mention, the VH tone is honestly NOT THAT GOOD... people are just nostalgic for the sound of their youth... I've always found it TOO fizzy... :thu: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members maz_master Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by DAVID PHILLIPS Here is Ed in 1984 jammin by himself in a rehearsal hall. Pretty damn close. Keep in mind the recoding is a bit distorted, but you hear the same type of gain and tonality. David www.davidphillipsmusic.com/EVH1984 More proof that recording techniques are everything...also nice to hear that even EVH can sound much less than stellar when just goofin' around by himself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members maz_master Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by Chubtone I hear that too. The amp sounds killer and for leads it seems spot on. For rhythms though it sounds like he is getting too much power tube distortion or speaker breakup. It is fizzy, fuzzy, spitty sounding to me on the rhythms. Ed's amp does sound like that in the 1984 studio jamming clip that he posted in this thread though. That is a sound I am just always trying to stay away from when I go for cranked plexi tones. Me too. Don't dig that tone at all...and didn't when it came out either. I also always thought EVH's lead tones, especially high on the neck, were too thin. However, I like the tones that *evolved* from the EVH tone and improved upon it in many ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members maz_master Posted July 5, 2006 Members Share Posted July 5, 2006 Originally posted by shredhead666 I've only ever heard the VH sound "nailed" twice. Once was on VH1, the other time was this dude here who pulled all but one power tube on a 100 watt super lead w/ some slight mods, and ran a variac also. He said the amp was basically going to destroy itself running in that configuration, but damn if it didn't sound just frickin' like VH1. I remember that....and agree...but, I still think the Peacemaker clips that first hit the scene nailed it too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members shredhead666 Posted July 6, 2006 Members Share Posted July 6, 2006 Originally posted by maz_master I remember that....and agree...but, I still think the Peacemaker clips that first hit the scene nailed it too... Nah I disagree about the peacemaker. Too grainy/fizzy. They have entirely too much ghosting going on, VH didn't have that much to the point where it was pronounced, it was just a little superficial in his sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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