Members grunge782 Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 I haven't looked up tabs in quite a while, but I've recently gotten back into acoustic and need a little help with some tougher songs. However, I'm surprised to see how many tabs are taken down due to copyright infringement. I understand completely if its the artists song being pirated, but are someone else's tabs of the song really considered that artists intellectual property? I mean half the time the tabs aren't even completely right. I'm sure sheet music companies hate guitar players tabbing, but this seems a little ridiculous to me when musicians are just trying to help teach other musicians how to play music. I think its really just pro guitar players who aren't making that much money trying to milk as much as they can from amateur guitar players since they don't have a wide fan-base. This whole copyright infringement thing is getting a little out of hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ovid9 Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 This whole copyright infringement thing is getting a little out of hand. Yup. So, instead of using {censored}ty off tabs just d/l the sheet music off teh interwebz for free. Seriously though, its really dumb. There's pretty much 0 tabs of Dethklok stuff out there (or at least there wasn't a few months ago) for this reason. Sucks. Also, judging from the quality of the average tab out there, I think I should give a shot at tabbing some songs. I mean, I can't get it more wrong than some of the ones I run into... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grunge782 Posted February 7, 2012 Author Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 Well the thing that is the strangest about this whole situation is there are tons of youtube videos showing people how to play some of these songs, but then a bunch of letters and numbers typed representing the song is more of an issue . BRB gonna go pirate some lyrics because that is a hell of a lot more fun than listening to the actual song... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PaoloJM Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 Haven't used tabs in a while, but when I did I used Tux Guitar to audition the tab before even bothering to work with it.So many sound so far wrong you're better off just getting your ear up to speed.Copyright on tabs is bull{censored}. The only valid case is if the artist produced a book of tabs themselves and the tab in question was a direct copy of that publication. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 I haven't looked up tabs in quite a while, but I've recently gotten back into acoustic and need a little help with some tougher songs. However, I'm surprised to see how many tabs are taken down due to copyright infringement.I understand completely if its the artists song being pirated, but are someone else's tabs of the song really considered that artists intellectual property? I mean half the time the tabs aren't even completely right. I'm sure sheet music companies hate guitar players tabbing, but this seems a little ridiculous to me when musicians are just trying to help teach other musicians how to play music. I think its really just pro guitar players who aren't making that much money trying to milk as much as they can from amateur guitar players since they don't have a wide fan-base. This whole copyright infringement thing is getting a little out of hand. Welcome to the 1990's... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JR13 Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 they can't sell those tab books to anyone if they're online, pisses me off though. Its damn near impossible to find a solid Rory Gallagher tab Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members metalhobo Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 are someone else's tabs of the song really considered that artists intellectual property? Short answer: yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members paul88lx Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 All the more reason to try and develop a good ear. Although at times I have to find a tab to figure out a thing or two that my ears can't decipher. Not trying to troll or be a smart ass at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grunge782 Posted February 7, 2012 Author Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 Welcome to the 1990's... I used tabs a lot when I started learning guitar, but I never remember seeing a tab taken down due to copyright infringement as I have recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kardula Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 All the more reason to try and develop a good ear. Although at times I have to find a tab to figure out a thing or two that my ears can't decipher.Not trying to troll or be a smart ass at all. i certainly agree with this in part, it's just that some people are unfortunate to not like a lot of music that's easy to figure out by ear. Me, i love the oldies so there's a lot of stuff I should be able to pick up by ear there...but if you listen to exclusively techdeathmetal then I can see where learning by ear is discouraging. On top of that, I would have assumed that tabs would have fallen under the fair use policy...if all esle fails state that your tabs are a parody of the song and not the actual song Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sixtonoize Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 I used tabs a lot when I started learning guitar, but I never remember seeing a tab taken down due to copyright infringement as I have recently. Apparently you never went on HC when the main draw was OLGA (the On-Line Guitar Archive). So yeah...welcome to '96. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grunge782 Posted February 7, 2012 Author Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 Short answer: yes. An issue like this doesn't have a short answer. At what level of showing someone else how to play songs does it become copyright infringement? If I send an email of a couple of chords to a song to a friend who is trying to learn it, am I infringing on that artists copyright? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members teemuk Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 It kinda goes to the grey area since those tabs, even if totally independently notated, may conflict with copyrighted books containing chords, lyrics, tabs, notation, etc. So yeah, you tabbed it yourself but how can you prove that it's not copied from a 95% identical tab in a copyrighted book. The net host providers are also real bitches when it comes to alleged copyright infrengements. Basically they'll threaten to pull off your site at the very moment someone claims a copyright infringement, even despite the fact that such allegation is never even proved to be correct in any way. Just the mere probability of possibly having "trouble ahead" is enough reason for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members metalhobo Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 An issue like this doesn't have a short answer. At what level of showing someone else how to play songs does it become copyright infringement? If I send an email of a couple of chords to a song to a friend who is trying to learn it, am I infringing on that artists copyright? The song in physical or demonstrative form is copyrighted. You cannot legally reproduce or distribute musical notation of a piece written by someone else nor perform the song in public without a license or consent of the copyright holder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grunge782 Posted February 7, 2012 Author Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 Apparently you never went on HC when the main draw was OLGA (the On-Line Guitar Archive).So yeah...welcome to '96. Well I guess it took a while to hit the other sites then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stevetemp Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 When will "let me show you how to play that song" become illegal? We show off our own clips of our favorite artists songs here. Is that illegal? (I think a 30 second clip of original artist IS legal). We take our favorite lines from movies and use them all the time. And...I've heard talk (conspiracy) that movie distributors frown upon family and friends viewing your movies with you in your own home...sheesh! IMO...there s BIG difference between "showing someone how to play a song" (even if via the internet) and attempting financial gain from it. i.e. "stealing intellectual property". I wonder what the legality is of a music store teacher showing a kid how to play a song? The simple act of writing it down the difference? Public consumption? I bet most of the artists don't mind too much, unless they own their own publishing company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grunge782 Posted February 7, 2012 Author Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 The song in physical or demonstrative form is copyrighted. You cannot legally reproduce or distribute musical notation of a piece written by someone else nor perform the song in public without a license or consent of the copyright holder. But I didn't send them the whole song though, I only sent him/her a few chords they needed work on. There is a difference between that and sending a digital copy of the exact sheet music that a company released. And what happens when the tabs miss a note or two? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members metalhobo Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 When will "let me show you how to play that song" become illegal? It is illegal. It's just most artists/record companies don't care. We show off our own clips of our favorite artists songs here. Is that illegal? (I think a 30 second clip of original artist IS legal). It is illegal. A 30 second clip IS using someone else's copyrighted work, but it would likely fall under Fair Use if tried in court due to its brevity and character/purpose (tone testing). IMO...there s BIG difference between "showing someone how to play a song" (even if via the internet) and attempting financial gain from it. i.e. "stealing intellectual property". There doesn't have to be any "financial gain" to indicate copyright infringement. I bet most of the artists don't mind too much, unless they own their own publishing company. I would imagine so, which is why such litigation is pretty rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members metalhobo Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 But I didn't send them the whole song though, I only sent him/her a few chords they needed work on. There is a difference between that and sending a digital copy of the exact sheet music that a company released. And what happens when the tabs miss a note or two? Well, a few chords probably can't be considered an original/creative work due to the commonness of most chord progressions, so it's probably not copyrighted. Even incorrect tabs should be considered derivative works and thus are included by the rights held by the copyright owner (songwriter). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ~Abstract~ Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 Apparently you never went on HC when the main draw was OLGA (the On-Line Guitar Archive). So yeah...welcome to '96. Just came in to post this. I FOUND hcaf thru the OLGA...which was shut down a few years later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dicky sofa Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grunge782 Posted February 7, 2012 Author Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 Well, a few chords probably can't be considered an original/creative work, so it's probably not copyrighted. Even incorrect tabs should be considered derivative works and thus are included by the rights held by the copyright owner (songwriter). So then how many chords does it then become copyrighted? I don't think its as cut and dry as you are making it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tommythelurker Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 So then how many chords does it then become copyrighted? I don't think its as cut and dry as you are making it. news flash: US law is almost never "cut and dry" but pretty much everything metalhobo has stated is dead on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members metalhobo Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 So then how many chords does it then become copyrighted? I don't think its as cut and dry as you are making it. I didn't say it was cut and dry. I said that guitar tabs are the right of the songwriter. Whether the song itself (sans lyrics) is copyrighted or not is a separate issue to be decided by a court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members paul88lx Posted February 7, 2012 Members Share Posted February 7, 2012 This thread reminds me of Vanilla Ices' Ice Ice Baby. David Bowie went after him hard for the bass line in that song. Since it was a blatant lift of the tune Under Pressure he did with Freddy Mercury. I don't remember if he got away with it or had to pay. Although this does raise a another question. Would tabs fall under the same rules and regs that sampling does? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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