Members seagullplayer77 Posted July 23, 2009 Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 What if you took one of these: http://www.kksound.com/floatingbridge.html And stuck it under the bridge of any old hollowbody guitar? Not necessarily an archtop acoustic or a jazz guitar, but just a hollowbody electric with a floating bridge. Something tells me that it probably wouldn't sound that great, or else someone would've done it already. LR Baggs has those bridge transducer things, though . . . so maybe it wouldn't be that bad after all. If it sounded halfway decent, yeah, you'd have to switch outputs, but other than that, it'd be a pretty cool trick. What do you folks think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RogueGnome Posted July 23, 2009 Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 Is there a bridge plate on the underbelly of the top? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members seagullplayer77 Posted July 23, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 Is there a bridge plate on the underbelly of the top? Good question . . . Didn't really give that much thought. Though on most hollowbodies, I don't think there is a bridge plate. That's more of an acoustic thing, I think. So let's go with "no." There isn't a bridge plate---just a floating bridge. If you mounted the pickup like they have it in the picture on a hollowbody electric, like a Gretsch, or an Ibanez Artcore, or something like that, how would it sound? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members seagullplayer77 Posted July 23, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 C'mon guys...someone must have at least some thoughts on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RogueGnome Posted July 23, 2009 Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 I wouldn't do it w/o a bridgeplate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members seagullplayer77 Posted July 23, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 I wouldn't do it w/o a bridgeplate. Any particular reason why? I'm just curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members S~R~O Posted July 23, 2009 Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 It is a lateral pull on the strings from the tail piece up to the head stock across the nut to the tuners so it would be a floating bridge and YES it will work. Some arch top instruments have sound posts between the back and the top to stabilize the both top and back (ie; violin). Bridge plates are used on Flat tops with fixed bridges and usually for the ferrell ends of the strings to seat against, along with stability. (without getting all technical) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RogueGnome Posted July 23, 2009 Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 Well, specifically, because if you do not have a bridgeplate, what you will likely find is a soundpost running from the top to the back directly under the bridge, which would preclude placing a K&K properly beneath the bridge.edit: OK, SteveO beat me to the punch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members seagullplayer77 Posted July 23, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 It is a lateral pull on the strings from the tail piece up to the head stock across the nut to the tuners so it would be a floating bridge and YES it will work. Some arch top instruments have sound posts between the back and the top to stabilize the both top and back (ie; violin). I know that it would work, but I was more or less curious about whether or not it would work well and sound decent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Melodeous Posted July 23, 2009 Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 I don't think you looked at the link I posted in the OP. This particular K&K pickup is designed to be placed between the top of the guitar and the bottom of the floating bridge---it doesn't attach to a bridge plate, nor is it designed to. Check out the picture: I know that it would work, but I was more or less curious about whether or not it would work well and sound decent. This is the $64K question. An under-bridge xdcr doesn't necessarily have to be placed under the bridge. It can be mounted anywhere the sound is best from the soundboard. This can be established by using double sided tape and experimenting on places above the soundboard. After that a decent signal chain will make the most of what you've found to be a good placement. It really is just another Piezo bug after all the fancy names are stripped away. I had a Shadow "bridge" xdcr that was attached with a silly-putty kind of stuff. I found that on one guitar behind the bridge sounded better than the recommended treble side of the bridge itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RogueGnome Posted July 23, 2009 Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 I don't think you looked at the link I posted in the OP. This particular K&K pickup is designed to be placed between the top of the guitar and the bottom of the floating bridge---it doesn't attach to a bridge plate, nor is it designed to. My bad. No, I hadn't seen it. Thought it was the standard K&K mini.Apologies for the post.This looks like it would work just fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members S~R~O Posted July 23, 2009 Members Share Posted July 23, 2009 K&K makes some pretty good quality products, with that said I think it would be up to your ears alone to decide. Why not ask a music store to get one so you can A> Sound development can be a lot of work trying to get that decent sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members seagullplayer77 Posted July 24, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 24, 2009 K&K makes some pretty good quality products, with that said I think it would be up to your ears alone to decide. Why not ask a music store to get one so you can A>Sound development can be a lot of work trying to get that decent sound. If anything, I'd probably install it on my Gretsch. That's with the exception of my mandolin, that's the only instrument with a floating bridge I own. If it sounded OK, that'd be super---I'd be able to switch from an electric sound to an acoustic(ish) sound by just switching jacks, and I suppose I could even run both pickups at the same time, which would make for some interesting possibilities. The only thing that's holding me back is that it's a pretty expensive experiment. If I buy the pickup and it sounds like garbage no matter how much I mess with it, then I'm out $120 and I've got a pickup that, essentially, I can't use for anything. The idea of ordering one at a music store to test it wouldn't be a bad idea, though I don't know of any guitar shops around here that carry K&K merchandise. That's why I figured I'd ask around here first to see if anyone had any idea as to how good/bad it would sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twanguero Posted July 24, 2009 Members Share Posted July 24, 2009 I personally love that pickup! I have had it in a gypsy jazz guitar and now on an Eastman archtop and it's fantastic. It's a little boomy and needs some eq, but much warmer and more natural than other piezos I've tried. It doesn't necessarily need a preamp, either. Just eq. It's loud! I haven't tried it in an electric hollowbody. My Silvertone has dowels that connect the floating bridge to the top (and it has 3 f'n rad sounding dearmonds), so I haven't installed it on that. Only one way to find out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members seagullplayer77 Posted July 24, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 24, 2009 I haven't tried it in an electric hollowbody. My Silvertone has dowels that connect the floating bridge to the top (and it has 3 f'n rad sounding dearmonds), so I haven't installed it on that. Only one way to find out! Wouldn't that negate the whole purpose of a floating bridge? If you wouldn't mind putting the K&K (installation isn't that hard, from what I gather, nor is it permanent) on your Silvertone and trying it out, I'd be eternally grateful to hear what your thoughts are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twanguero Posted July 24, 2009 Members Share Posted July 24, 2009 I had some work done on it by a luthier and he found the right spot and locked that sucker in. It's not going anywhere, sorry! It's a new, super adjustable TOM with rolling saddles for the bigsby so I've never had the need to touch it. Order it from Blue Star music here in San Diego. I'm pretty sure they'll take it back if it doesn't work out. Just don't use the sticky tape! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Etienne Rambert Posted July 24, 2009 Members Share Posted July 24, 2009 I think that would be exceptionally ugly when viewed from the front of an arch top guitar. I have an arch top with a floating pick-up. I would never put this kind of pick-up it. What would it sound like on a thinner-body guitar with a floating bridge? #1 - I don't think it would not make a non-acoustic guitar sound like an acoustic. It might make it sound like a duck though. You might hear a quacking noise. #2 - I think it would be ugly. #3 - It wouldn't have that warm, fat, smooth electric sound that floating pick-ups give you.. I've got plenty of acoustic volume with my arch top. What would it sound like if you put it on a thinner-body guitar with a floating bridge & other pick-ups? If your goal is to make it sound like an acoustic - I think you'll fail. I could be wrong. I don't know. I know it would be ugly on my floating bridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members seagullplayer77 Posted July 24, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 24, 2009 I think that would be exceptionally ugly when viewed from the front of an arch top guitar. I have an arch top with a floating pick-up. I would never put this kind of pick-up it. What would it sound like on a thinner-body guitar with a floating bridge? #1 - I don't think it would not make a non-acoustic guitar sound like an acoustic. It might make it sound like a duck though. You might hear a quacking noise. #2 - I think it would be ugly. #3 - It wouldn't have that warm, fat, smooth electric sound that floating pick-ups give you.. I've got plenty of acoustic volume with my arch top. What would it sound like if you put it on a thinner-body guitar with a floating bridge & other pick-ups? If your goal is to make it sound like an acoustic - I think you'll fail. I could be wrong. I don't know. I know it would be ugly on my floating bridge. On your floating bridge, yes, it would probably look ugly. I have a Bigsby on my Gretsch, though, so that would hide the cables quite well. And it has a black finish, so that would make it even more unobtrusive. And quite honestly, I'm not really concerned with looks as much as I am with sound. Really, I don't think the concept is much different than the one that LR Baggs uses in their bridge transducer models. They sell one for Strat-type guitars and they have another model that fits anything with a Tune-a-Matic bridge, and while they don't make an electric guitar sound like a $3000 Martin, they do produce a passable acoustic-electric sound that gets consistently good reviews. Then again, I could be wrong as well . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members S~R~O Posted July 24, 2009 Members Share Posted July 24, 2009 Don't-cha, just hate having to make decisions like this one.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members seagullplayer77 Posted July 24, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 24, 2009 Don't-cha, just hate having to make decisions like this one.... I was browsing around the K&K website and they said that you could use the Twin Spot Classic for the same purpose. That particular pickup only costs about $65, so it'd be a less costly experiment. And if it didn't work well on my Gretsch, I suppose I could mount it on my mandolin or one of my Seagulls, since it's not designed exclusively for use with floating bridges. Still a tough decision though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jamesp Posted July 24, 2009 Members Share Posted July 24, 2009 http://www.fishman.com/products/details.asp?id=4 One of these might look better, but my experience with their mandolin pickup (an M100) was grim soundwise. OTOH, I haven't heard one of the Fishman archtop pickups, or a word about 'em. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members seagullplayer77 Posted July 24, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 24, 2009 http://www.fishman.com/products/details.asp?id=4One of these might look better, but my experience with their mandolin pickup (an M100) was grim soundwise. OTOH, I haven't heard one of the Fishman archtop pickups, or a word about 'em. Looks nice, but it also looks expensive. And I don't think it would work anyway. My Gretsch has a Tune-a-Matic mounted on the floating bridge, so I don't think the Fishman would cut the mustard in this case. Thanks for the suggestion though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twanguero Posted July 26, 2009 Members Share Posted July 26, 2009 I've tried that fishman pickup a while back. Really horrendous. The K&K is the way to go. If you can tuck the wires under the tailpiece, it doesn't look bad. You just have to be sure there's a good place to stick the output jack. And if it's on near the tailpiece/strapbutton, will the guitar still fit in the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members seagullplayer77 Posted July 26, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 26, 2009 You just have to be sure there's a good place to stick the output jack. And if it's on near the tailpiece/strapbutton, will the guitar still fit in the case. There's supposed to be a full foot of cable, which will be just enough to make it to the end of the Bigsby, I believe. It comes with that Velcro-type stuff, though, and from what I understand, you're supposed to be able to move the jack so that the instrument still fits into a fitted case (which I have). Right now, this particular project isn't on the top of my list of priorities. I still need to get the bridge on my S12 reglued and I need a nice, portable laptop for school this fall. If the K&K gives me a passable acoustic sound with my Gretsch, though, I might be able to sell my Boss acoustic simulator pedal to pay for the pickup. I'm still open to opinions though, so let's hear 'em ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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