Members Poker99 Posted January 11, 2011 Members Share Posted January 11, 2011 Yeah. Obviously the business side of music, the environment for music has changed quite drastically since you joined Stone Sour, and Slipknot started to take off. What’s your take on the way that music has changed in the beginning of the digital age, the way that it’s become devalued in many people’s eyes, almost throwaway?Oh yeah. It absolutely has become that, it’s almost reminiscent of when rock ‘n’ roll first started getting spun in the fifties. Everything was single-based, nobody cared about records until bands like The Beatles, The Who and Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd too of course, started experimenting with making full-length records. It’s kind of a weird evolution, because in some ways we’ve been seeing things going down the toilet. It makes it harder because it trickles down to everything: it doesn’t just effect record labels and bands, it effects the people who drive buses for bands, the hotels that the bands book into, it effects the entire economy of the music industry. It’s already started effecting touring, the only place a band can make any money at all anymore is by touring. That’s part of the reason that I haven’t come off the road in the last 11 years. And now you’re going to have every band in the world, even if they’re successful on radio or successful in the pop world, having to hit the road in order to make money. They’re not making any money from publishing, and they’re not making any money from selling records, so they have no choice. And what you’ll see from that is such an over-saturation of every band, y’know, touring bands might be playing in your city on any given night, all fighting to pay their mortgages, I guess! (laughs). You can certainly see it that way. It goes pretty deep, and it’s not just that… The culture of buying an album on CD or vinyl has gone out of the window. A lot of kids don’t really understand that, they just hop onto Limewire, or find a bit torrent, or even just go onto ITunes if they’re going to pay for something. It’s just right there, there’s no searching about. No talking to the old crusty guy who runs the mom and pa record shop, ‘if you like this, this guy played guitar on this album, at this time…’. There’s no studying the album artwork, or finding out where it was recorded at, who produced it, or how the album artwork was put together. There are many different artforms that are just being lost because the whole digital revolution has homogenised everything, turned it all into Wal-Mart (laughs). It’s a little bit sad.Yeah. It’ll be interesting to see how the music itself evolves as a result. I mean, there could well be a further shift towards providing instant gratification, quick thrills, if you like.It’ll be really difficult to find anything that’s new and valid. Especially with technology evolving the way that it’s evolving. I mean, I just got an email from Native Instruments, who’re doing this thing called The Mouth: basically it can take anything or turn it into a loop or a sequence. You don’t even need to play an instrument, you just basically say what you want to do and it’ll either turn it into a drum pattern or a loop, and you can arrange them however you like… next thing you know you’ve got a song. There are people making all kinds of music with that and then uploading it to ITunes from their Garage Band or whatever. You might go see this person live and they don’t have a band, it’s just them there singing along with their computer. From that to the people who really take recording seriously, write and arrange music, you’ll have everything in between. It’s going to be difficult, in some ways it’s like, well now they’ve just got to go out and search for new music in the digital world, rather than walking half a mile from their house to the record shop.Nobody really knows how it’s going to go from here.No, in some ways it’s kind of like the Wild West out there. But all I know is that, I’ve watched it evolve, have been on the road every year since ’99, and you can definitely see the impact of it, talking to people at record labels, other bands, the people who work for bands, the guitar techs, the stage managers and all that stuff, it’s definitely something that people are kind of freaked out about.It seems that making a livelihood from music is becoming increasingly difficult, that the weekend job at Wal-Mart is increasingly necessary.Well that’s probably what’ll end up happening: a load of really good musicians who can’t afford to be in bands, who have to have day jobs, you know what I mean? And then that’s when you start losing a lot of the live touring bands. Unless the digital realm gets to the point where people can sit in their bedrooms and broadcast a show somewhere (laughs). OUCH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sventvkg Posted January 11, 2011 Members Share Posted January 11, 2011 Everything that was will fall. Something new will arise out of the ashes but none of us knows what that will be just yet. Oh, and as always someone will be making money from it and they need TALENT for that to happen. So there WILL be musicians when it's all said and done, who will make some money. The superstar status of the past however, is unlikely to return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators daddymack Posted January 11, 2011 Moderators Share Posted January 11, 2011 actually, he is just confirming what we surmised here ages ago. And people do sit in their bedrooms and broadcast shows every day, sad to say...that doesn't mean they should, or that they will succeed by doing that, but they can do it, and so they do it...that has been happening since the advent of the webcam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sventvkg Posted January 11, 2011 Members Share Posted January 11, 2011 actually, he is just confirming what we surmised here ages ago. And people do sit in their bedrooms and broadcast shows every day, sad to say...that doesn't mean they should, or that they will succeed by doing that, but they can do it, and so they do it...that has been happening since the advent of the webcam. So true! However, I know some really talented artists who are doing that and who SHOULD...Same as always in any profession The vast majority are average or {censored} and there is a smaller percentage who has the goods. It has always been and will always be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dancebass Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 These developments pave the way for an increase in what I've been seeing lately. I hate to say it but many of the touring acts that I've run across recently are fueled by trust funds. Little Josh can operate at a loss for as long as he likes. Mommy and Daddy want their special little snowflake to show the world his greatness. It's bad news all around when playing rock music becomes a leisure pursuit of wealthy kids. Kind of like sailing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Poker99 Posted January 13, 2011 Author Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 I hate to say it but many of the touring acts that I've run across recently are fueled by trust funds. Little Josh can operate at a loss for as long as he likes. Mommy and Daddy want their special little snowflake to show the world his greatness. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 I dunno, I see it as bleak for now, but most transitions are just before the re-emergence of new life. It's how I choose to look at it, anyway. I think any economy, when left alone, will find it's equilibrium. Yes, there will be swings up and down, like water sloshing in a bucket, but eventually it finds a level again. The thing that upsets markets is tinkering. We enjoyed a bull market in the music business for 50 years ( a relatively short time in the history of music, a mere blip on a time line) but that bull market was a manipulated one. It was controlled by record companies, and artificially was inflated by regulating who got signed, and if, when, and how many records they released. Suits decided what got recorded, how it was arranged, promoted, and distributed, and whether or not it got airplay. All of this of course was very good for the suits, and worked out quite well for those relatively few bands and personalities who had all the elements to make money for them. But along comes the digital revolution, and the companies have lost their control over the product, much like unions have lost control over labor markets. Now anyone and everyone can do it, and are. It will be decades, I believe, before it sorts itself out again and a new profit hierarchy emerges, if one does at all. Perhaps someone will figure out a way to make it an exclusionary business again, and regulate distribution, which is what it will take to make it profitable again. Maybe it won't. Maybe in the history of music, the 20th century was an aberration, never to be seen again. The point is, we are in the transition period of one thing dying and the new thing still germinating. In short, we are in a music business winter. How long it will last is anyone's guess, but I would guess we are here for awhile. Much like any winter, we still have a few holdovers from last season hanging on, the pop sensations who are more a brand than musical acts, and and dinosaur bands still packing arenas. We have a few new shoots here and there popping up, but nothing sustainable, really. It'll be interesting to see what happens. I just hope I live to see it, if nothing else just to satisfy my curiosity. As far as touring goes, it too will reach a point of equilibrium. Those committed to the hardcore lifestyle it requires will continue to do it, and those who are forced to get jobs and make touring a part time affair will eventually realize that the return for them on their investment of time and energy isn't paying off and it isn't for them. That's the way it's always worked, really, it's just that now there are more people touring looking to compensate for sales losses. The one thing I've gotten out of any of it is that it isn't personal. Whether I'm good enough to 'make it' or not is not an issue for me, because I realize now that it has always been a subjective exercise. When I saw that Danny Gatton wasn't good enough to 'make it' but Justin Beiber is, that told me all I need to know. It ain't personal, it's just business. That's been a huge paradigm shift for me, and a huge relief. Today, I'm content to stay in my little niche in my little neck of the (literal) woods and make the few thousand dollars I make a year playing for my few fans and live my life in peace and comfort and just grow old gracefully. The striving is over for me, and it's okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DevilRaysFan Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 I just dont even care anymore.......In a few years, I am making plans on doing an original act (Ill be in my late 40s) and seeing where it goes in the Urban Blues market...I dont have any expectations of it nor do I want any...........Im going to be doing this for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dancebass Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 Bluestrat, I think that's why I've tried to keep my goals as realistic as possible. If I boil everything down to it's basic elements, the truth is I love playing live. For some reason that I can not explain the more people I play in front of the more I enjoy it. That's my starting point. That gives me a reason to be pro-active with everything. A reason that's grounded and at the same time ties into all the work I do as a whole. The harder I work the more it becomes a reality for me to get great shows. That's enough for me. Are there remnants of an old industry that still have the ability to make that job significantly easier for me? Sure. Do I have time to keep my eye on what they're doing? Not really. I'll just do my thing and be happy with the people I meet and the places I get to see along the way. That's enough to keep going for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Poker99 Posted January 13, 2011 Author Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 The one thing I've gotten out of any of it is that it isn't personal. Whether I'm good enough to 'make it' or not is not an issue for me, because I realize now that it has always been a subjective exercise. When I saw that Danny Gatton wasn't good enough to 'make it' but Justin Beiber is, that told me all I need to know. It ain't personal, it's just business. That's been a huge paradigm shift for me, and a huge relief. Today, I'm content to stay in my little niche in my little neck of the (literal) woods and make the few thousand dollars I make a year playing for my few fans and live my life in peace and comfort and just grow old gracefully. The striving is over for me, and it's okay. Welcome to my world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators daddymack Posted January 13, 2011 Moderators Share Posted January 13, 2011 I just dont even care anymore.......In a few years, I am making plans on doing an original act (Ill be in my late 40s) and seeing where it goes in the Urban Blues market...I dont have any expectations of it nor do I want any...........Im going to be doing this for me funny, that is what I did at that age a dozen years ago...it went okay for along time...but, much like BlueStrat, I have had my chances, achieved some pretty good goals, and am now looking toward a quieter and simpler musical experience. Unless, of course, someone comes up and offers me a pile of money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members richardmac Posted January 14, 2011 Members Share Posted January 14, 2011 Great post, BlueStrat. The new music biz gurus tell us that it's a great time to be doing music because in the past, no one could hear you, and now because of the Internet, everyone can hear you and so you need to do something different, stand out, attract a crap load of attention, and convert some of that attention to fans who will buy a ticket to your show, buy the gold deluxe autographed version of your CD as well as all of your merch (BlueStrat condoms, perhaps, that glow in the dark.) They would say that this is how things will be from now on. And they'd say again that we're better off. No more gate keepers standing between us and worldwide distribution. But I agree with you - it is winter. So the question you posed is important - are the shoots popping up showing us the way to the future, or did we all move to the north pole? And we don't know. One other thing to add. It is true that it's just business and it always has been. For you, that gives you some comfort. Me too. But for the young kid who is putting his first original band together, it sort of makes them a promise - sort of like "Hey, look, you too can be famous even though you're not the best musician or singer around." And it's an empty promise, because those pop stars are pure product - very carefully crafted by committee. I'm almost at the "at peace" stage, but what I really want is fans. And that's ego driven. I want a group of people who will be excited when I come out with new music, outside of family and friends and "fellow musicians who give each other compliments and encouragement." I don't care about the money (thank God.) For Dancebass it's playing live. For me, it's knowing that someone has my music and is listening to it and likes it. I like playing live, too, actually. My problem, with my last CD, was that it was folk - music for people my age and older. And they don't go online to discover new music. I'm really itching to do either a prog rock CD or a jazz/rock CD next. So yeah, it's good that I don't need to make any money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DevilRaysFan Posted January 14, 2011 Members Share Posted January 14, 2011 These developments pave the way for an increase in what I've been seeing lately. I hate to say it but many of the touring acts that I've run across recently are fueled by trust funds. Little Josh can operate at a loss for as long as he likes. Mommy and Daddy want their special little snowflake to show the world his greatness. It's bad news all around when playing rock music becomes a leisure pursuit of wealthy kids. Kind of like sailing. This, unfortunately, has been the case for a long long time - even during the days of recording contracts and albums/CDs. I do know (personally) one band that is definitely the case for, and there is a high probability that they may not be where they are now if it wasnt for that comfort cushion that they had....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sventvkg Posted January 14, 2011 Members Share Posted January 14, 2011 Welcome to my world PLEASE PLEASE, I BEG you, could you explain to me out to quote sections instead of the entire post? I must be retarded... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted January 14, 2011 Members Share Posted January 14, 2011 I must be retarded... No you aren't! Right click section or phrase Highlight and copyPaste to new message window. Right click and highlightclick on quote icon, far right at tophave a beer, you're done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members richardmac Posted January 15, 2011 Members Share Posted January 15, 2011 Which button do you click to get the beer? And do you hold down the shift key to make it a lite beer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators daddymack Posted January 15, 2011 Moderators Share Posted January 15, 2011 we will serve no lite beer in here. I think the B button at the top if you hold shift+ctrl will get teh beer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.