How Many People Here Are Edging Back into Hardware?

[Dave Bryce]

Originally posted by alphajerk i need a killer 88key weighted controller but everyone i look at everyone reviews them as crap. why cant someone make something good?

'ssup, aj...

What's important to you? Feel? Lots of 88s have great feel - that's just a matter of taste. You want onboard sounds? Lots of assignable controllers?

Them CME controllers ain't bad...

dB

[alphajerk]

i heard bad breaky things about the CME [uf series, the VX looks tempting if its sturdy], they were at the top of my list. studiologic seems to be GONE.

yeah, no sounds, pure control [nice weighted feeling like a piano, but other niceties like aftertouch, good modifiable velocity envelopes and so forth... oh and STURDY, can be heavy too... not transporting it]. really i want a master controller thats nice. i probably should rip out the keyboard of a piano and put that moog lightmidi thing on it kidding.

[Dave Bryce]

Actually, if you're not in a hurry, see if you can find a used Kurz MIDIboard. One of the best feeling and coolest (poly aftertouch!) 88 key controllers ever made. Bob Moog worked on that bad boy during his tenure at Kurzweil.

A v3 unit is ideal...

dB

[alphajerk]

i think i will poke about for one of those. sounds exactly like what i want... wooden keys!!! yeah. now if i can just find one.

[Henchman]

I'm super happy with my Nuendo and 4-card UAD-1 set-up. I use it with my laptop, and have a 4 slot magma chassis I've cut down so it's super portable.
Ican get as good, if not better mixes, than I did with analogue gear.

Maybe in the newyear I might think about the Duende.
But first I'll look at getting a new laptop. I'm waiting for the quadcore single processotrs to be released. Be casue I want a quadcore laptop.
I'll never go back to a desktop again.

[Geoff Grace]

Originally posted by Dave Bryce: Originally posted by Geoff Grace: I bought a Receptor. Does that count? I'm considering one for Ivory and a few other things. How're you liking it?

For the most part, I'm happy with Receptor. The latency on it seems as good or better than my Digi 002, except under UniWire. In that case, it's forced to have double the latency of my Digi 002, making that feature useless to me. Depending upon the plug-in, Receptor's polyphony is also sometimes better than on my G5.

The bottom line is that it helps offload some of the work from my computer and, when combined with my Mac, enables me to run more plug-ins at once.

Originally posted by Dave Bryce: Hey, don't you have to get all PC versions of the Mac software that you already have? Receptor doesn't run Mac plugs, does it?

No, it doesn't run Mac plug-ins; but, for a nominal fee, Muse Research will install many of the PC versions for you. I paid the extra fee, and I'm glad I did -- it saved me a lot of time on setup. You still have to authorize the Receptor versions yourself though.

I think that audioMIDI also offers that service when you buy your Receptor from them.

Originally posted by Dave Bryce: 'ssup, aj...

Yeah, it's great to see you here alphajerk!

Best,

Geoff

[philbo]

Originally posted by alphajerk i need a killer 88key weighted controller but everyone i look at everyone reviews them as crap. why cant someone make something good?

 

 

The Kurzweil PC88 has nice key action. It's a bit pricey to use just as a controller.... In similar vein, any keyboard with a MIDI out would be usable as a controller. It's just a matter of price & weight.

[alphajerk]

definately dont want something with sounds... simply a controller.

[Anderton]

Alphajerk is back! Now that's a Christmas present to the forum...great to see you here!

[Mike Martin]

Originally posted by alphajerk definately dont want something with sounds... simply a controller.

Alphajerk,
He has a point about the Kurzweil. They are simply the best controllers available. Although the PC series have built in sounds, that doesn't mean you have to use them. As a controller, any of its physical controllers can easily be assigned to any MIDI CC. If you spent a little more PC2 series has the ability to add a ribbon controller.

[alphajerk]

except i dont really want to pay for sounds... guess that means in NOT edging back into hardware. ironic since i started running nuendo which makes outboard easy, although im looking at inventive hardware like Lexicons MX400 with VST plugin control.

seriously, the midiboard looks exactly like what im looking for... heavy, has enough controls... nice wooden keys. now to find one... hopefulyl in atlanta or nashville that i can drive to pick up.

[Philter]

Originally posted by Anderton You have the computer, the plug-ins, you've mixed in the box...but are you starting to use some of your hardware more than you used to? Particularly Cubase owners, as SX and Cubase 4 make it easier to interface external analog gear with the host program. Or maybe you've dusted off that synth and are playing directly into the audio ins instead of using soft synths? I'm not so much interested in people who continue to use hardware, but those who used hardware, got into software, and are now moving back into using hardware more.

 

 

All these generations of softsynths later and I still reach for the 5080 when I want to play something NOW. The computer stuff is so damn cumbersome sometimes.

 

I wish that I could have the best of both worlds sometimes- for example, I wish BFD was a rackmount sound module instead of software... software is unstable, slow, always getting upgraded, dependent on your computer, etc etc etc. Hardware generally you plug it in and you're moving, you know how many voices you get, there's less latency, etc.

 

Now we get into the situation of running second computers just to offload virtual stuff onto... Right now I'm thinking about a second computer just to run BFD on... does that count as hardware or what?

[MikeRivers]

 

Originally posted by alphajerk except i dont really want to pay for sounds...[/QB]

The "But I don't want to pay for . . . ." syndrome strikes again. People who want a digital I/O sound card don't want to pay for one with analog I/O. People who want Mackie mic preamps don't want a mixer (OK, so Mackie gave us the Onyx 800R that costs as much as their Onyx mixer with 8 mic inputs - so now you can say "I don't want built-in A/D converters") and so on. If you said you wanted the Kurzweil sounds but didn't want the keyboard, that's one thing (and I expect that Kurzweil offers what you want), but the keyboard is the expensive part of the PC88. The rest of it is cheap. You might as well take it.[QB]

seriously, the midiboard looks exactly like what im looking for... heavy, has enough controls... nice wooden keys. now to find one... hopefulyl in atlanta or nashville that i can drive to pick up.

I don't think I've seen one for sale. There weren't that many made. Good luck.

 

Is the Yamaha KT88 (I think that's it) still considered a good controller? That was the top of the line when I was playing with MDII many years ago. I always wanted one but I couldn't afford it, and couldn't justify it anyway because I don't play keys. It would be for the studio visitors - most of whom brought their own synths anyway.

[Phil O'Keefe]

Originally posted by Anderton You have the computer, the plug-ins, you've mixed in the box...but are you starting to use some of your hardware more than you used to? Particularly Cubase owners, as SX and Cubase 4 make it easier to interface external analog gear with the host program. Or maybe you've dusted off that synth and are playing directly into the audio ins instead of using soft synths? I'm not so much interested in people who continue to use hardware, but those who used hardware, got into software, and are now moving back into using hardware more.

Well, I've never really stopped using hardware, so I guess I shouldn't respond... but I will anyway, and hope that the moderator doesn't ban me.

I rarely do ITB mixes. I am currently using a hybrid approach, using PT as a recorder, editing block and automation sequencer, and I use a Yamaha digital board with it. A nice analog board would be nice, but I don't like the thought of the added electrical bill for the juice to power it and the AC to keep it cool... and besides, I'm always working on multiple projects simultaneously, so I really need and appreciate the complete recall my system gives me. That little Yamaha has served me very well, and it even has some cool effects processors onboard.

I'm pretty happy with some of the EQ and compression plug ins I've used, especially for mixdowns. I still use hardware when tracking (but rarely EQ - but I DO need a good outboard EQ for tracking, and unless you want to spend a fortune, there's just not a lot of choices available out there right now - I'm open to suggestions! ), but over on my forum, I recently posted a thread regarding the relative lack of good modulation type plug ins. I've been using what I have a lot, but It just seems like I nearly always prefer the sound when I go out to my hardware boxes for modulation type stuff, and sometimes for reverbs and delays too, although I'm generally more satisfied by some of the available plug in products in those categories. But for modulation, I still generally prefer hardware, and for that very reason, a good outboard processor is on my "buy" list for Q1 2007. It's going to be a bit more of a hassle, since I'll have to set up MIDI for sysex and automation for the outboard efx processors, deal with the latency, etc. but I really see myself using more hardware for those sorts of things in the coming year as opposed to less.

[tucktronix]

Originally posted by MikeRivers Is the Yamaha KT88 (I think that's it) still considered a good controller? That was the top of the line when I was playing with MDII many years ago. I always wanted one but I couldn't afford it, and couldn't justify it anyway because I don't play keys. It would be for the studio visitors - most of whom brought their own synths anyway.

 

 

That would be the KX88

[alphajerk]

Originally posted by MikeRivers The "But I don't want to pay for . . . ." syndrome strikes again. People who want a digital I/O sound card don't want to pay for one with analog I/O..

 

 

thats loaded... but why should you pay for analog I/O when all you want is digital?!? id LOVE motu to put out their 308 again with 96k compatibility. its sucks i only have 4 channels of AES via my 2 1296's.

 

id rather have a controller that was built AS A CONTROLLER than one that was built as a synth. money put into the mechanism over the sound module side, and YES... you CAN get just the sounds... its called the RACK version.

 

why should i WASTE money on something i dont need. im sure there has to be a good market for controlling all these softsynths/samplers being made now... last time i checked mentalMIDI hasnt come to fruition. why are all these companies putting out TOYS for controllers?

 

oh well... i found a kurzweil midiboard on ebay for $200 yesterday. they are out there. im just looking closer to home [atlanta/nashville] to go pick it up, its only 77lbs!

 

 

wassup craig ya rockstar! geoff! bryce... had to put that surround system on hold for a bit, getting a [another] new company off the ground right now.

[Phil O'Keefe]

Hey AJ, how the heck have you been doing? What's new in your world - a new company? Cool! Good to see you stranger.

[MikeRivers]

Originally posted by alphajerk thats loaded... but why should you pay for analog I/O when all you want is digital?!? id LOVE motu to put out their 308 again with 96k compatibility. its sucks i only have 4 channels of AES via my 2 1296's.

They can only have so many products in the product line, and they build what their market research tells them most people want, or what fewest people want. If, according to their research, there were more people like you, that's what they'd build. You tend to find more of what you really want from a small company that doesn't need to build in lots of multi-thousand in order to make a profit.

id rather have a controller that was built AS A CONTROLLER than one that was built as a synth.

There have been some, but they just aren't very popular. But hardware these days is always the tail behind the software dog. Perhaps now that soft synths are the way that a lot of people make music (though not necessarily perform music) we'll start to see more "silent" synth controllers. But the pendulum tends to swing pretty wide, and we might find it hard to buy a live performance keyboard with good quality sounds because the keyboard manufacturers have come to expect that everyone will get the sounds elsewhere.

why should i WASTE money on something i dont need.

Because it's the only way to get what you DO need. It would cost the manufacturer to take that $10 synth or analog input off than to leave it in.

im sure there has to be a good market for controlling all these softsynths/samplers being made now...

So start a market research firm and bring some numbers to the vendors you'd like to see make what you've found has a good market.

... i found a kurzweil midiboard on ebay for $200 yesterday. they are out there. im just looking closer to home [atlanta/nashville] to go pick it up, its only 77lbs!

That's a great value, if it's in good working condition. A friend of mine who contributed to the development of that keyboard built a torture tester and went through a lot of mechanisms that broke too quickly. But they could all be beat up.

[UstadKhanAli]

I've always had hardware, such as compressors. But when I made tehe transition to computer DAWs, I immediately noticed the huge CPU load that reverb plug-ins had. I picked up a TC Electronic M300 (S/PDIF) and all is good. I'm also using an analog delay as a "plug-in (I have it patched in to Pro Tools - sounds great, and no update issues... ).

[NYCCane]

new company off the ground right now.

 

 

its just like how cable TV packages give you 700 channels, when u only want the 100 good ones.....b/c they can charge you for it and to get those few good ones you have to pay for the lot of them....brilliant business....i despise it, but its smart.

[Cry Logic]

It's hard to imagine going back to hardware synths when there are such

gems as Albino, Blue, Cameleon etc etc

Automatic syncing of sequences, arpeggiator and FX to BPM is another

thing I would miss.......

I can plugin an instance of the Kjaerhus Classic Phaser, for example,

and have the phasing speed perfectly in sync with the tune at 16ths, 8ths,

Quarters, right up to a whole measure.... whatever...... not easy to do with an external unit.....

And that's a free VST for those who aren't familiar with it....

 

Another trend is to use Muse Receptor to host the VST(i)s.

Would that be classed as "going back to hardware"?

[alphajerk]

its just like how cable TV packages give you 700 channels, when u only want the 100 good ones.....b/c they can charge you for it and to get those few good ones you have to pay for the lot of them....brilliant business....i despise it, but its smart.

 

 

except they dont realize they could most likely charge me almost the same and give me only the channels i WANT... especially considering that i want the best channels that would probably cost the most a la carte.

 

this used to be a pain but now i have only channels i watch show up on the list now through programmable favorites. sucks though when nothing is STILL on despite 100 channels.

[D Charles]

 

except they dont realize they could most likely charge me almost the same and give me only the channels i WANT... especially considering that i want the best channels that would probably cost the most a la carte. this used to be a pain but now i have only channels i watch show up on the list now through programmable favorites. sucks though when nothing is STILL on despite 100 channels.

 

 

 

I've heard that most of what you're paying for is the sports channels as they charge the cable co. the most. Wish I could get a package without the sports channels for way less as the few sports I watch are on network anyway.

[alphajerk]

i dont get any sports on mine... thats a whole other package. i do however have every other package available. basic/extended/kids/premium movie channels. plus VOD and DVR, commercials are a thing of the past now, or even being dictated what time to watch a show.

i also just switched to cable telephone. saved me so much over the telco i upgraded my isp to 10MbD/1MbU service.... and came out paying LESS than before the cross/upgrade. and i can call canada now for free... so all you canadians. "eh! wassup!"