Members Al Poulin Posted February 16, 2007 Members Share Posted February 16, 2007 I e-mailed Carvin today regarding their new LM15A powered speakers. They e-mailed me back with a very impressive price of under 1000$ to my door (including shipping+duty etc..) for a pair which I have to admit is very good for a set of powered 15'' cabs weighing in under 40lbs. What made me laugh was his reply when I asked if they had built-in limiting and if they used a low frequency sweeping filter when the cabinet was pushed to it's limits. I wanted to make sure they were ''blow proof''. Here is the answer I received : ''Yes it has all of that, and they are Neodymium speakers..so no, they will not blow. They will blow you eardrums before they blow. Give me a call if you have any other questions or if you would like to place an order.'' I politely thanked him for the info and explained to him that neodymium speakers are popular because of their lighter weight, but that you can still blow them if they are overpowered and if proper limiting is not in place to protect them. I also described the whys and hows of a sweeping LF filter just in case. He did not reply... Al So should I ask him about the time-aligned drivers???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted February 16, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted February 16, 2007 I e-mailed Carvin today regarding their new LM15A powered speakers. Thet e-mailed me back with a very impressive price of under 1000$ to my door (including shipping+duty etc..) for a pair which I have to admit is very good for a set of powered 15'' cabs weighing in under 40lbs. What made me laugh was his reply when I asked if they had built-in limiting and if they used a low frequency sweeping filter when the cabinet was pushed to it's limits. I wanted to make sure they were ''blow proof''. Here is the answer I received : ''Yes it has all of that, and they are Neodymium speakers..so no, they will not blow. They will blow you eardrums before they blow. Give me a call if you have any other questions or if you would like to place an order.'' I politely thanked him for the info and explained to him that neodymium speakers are popular because of their lighter weight, but that you can still blow them if they are overpowered and if proper limiting is not in place to protect them. I also described the whys and hows of a sweeping LF filter just in case. He did not reply... Al So should I ask him about the time-aligned drivers???? Well, it is good to know that the same qualifications to work at GC or Sam Ash will also get you in the door at Carvin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted February 16, 2007 Members Share Posted February 16, 2007 Do you know what a sweeping LF filter is? Do you know who uses them, and more importantly who doesn't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted February 16, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted February 16, 2007 Do you know what a sweeping LF filter is? Do you know who uses them, and more importantly who doesn't? Who are you asking ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted February 16, 2007 Members Share Posted February 16, 2007 Sorry, I was asking Al. I see an educational opportunity here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted February 16, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted February 16, 2007 Sorry, I was asking Al. I see an educational opportunity here. I think we can all learn about this. Regarding the customer support....what a horrendous response. "I don't have that information at the moment, but will research it and get back to you shortly with the answer" would be so much more professional. I see this more and more...CS reps with no clue who think that by being colloquial they can get by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members death metal jim Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 Do you know what a sweeping LF filter is? Do you know who uses them, and more importantly who doesn't? i dont:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarharv52 Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 I don't know either.But would love to learn.Last week there was a bartender sweeping around my subs as we were loading out.Probably not the same though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dookietwo Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 In regards to a changing LF filter. In general some remove more and more low freq's as the signal is increased to help reduce cone excursion and allow more amp power to be used for the higher freq range. A 15 and a horn may have a built in 50hz lowcut. As the speaker reaches its max output the 50hz filter may raise to 60hz or higher. Reducing the amount of bass the speaker has to reproduce. Some may add a small bass boost above the low cut to compensate for it. Also some speakers also have filters that change the crossover point between the 15 and the horn driver as well.The normal crossover point may be 1.2k as an example but as the speaker is pushed it may raise to 2k or higher. Horns in general can handle more power as the crossover point is raised. The plus is the speaker can reproduce higher power levels. The down side is of course less bass and poor phase response and coverage between the 15 and horn as the freq is changed. Some may hear the freq changes as well. Peavey used to make an outboard controler that used this type of processing. Dynamic System Control Series I believe.Like a limiter. Set up right they are fine. Done wrong it sounds like crap. Dookietwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dookietwo Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 A peavey system controler. http://www.peavey.com/media/pdf/manuals/80300823.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 Dookie has it pretty much nailed, but generally the time constants for detection are pretty long... inversely proportional to the degree of overload. This kind of control, was more popular about 10-20 years ago, when driver performance was pretty limited. Shifting crossover points and HPF's was made "popular" by John Meyer when he introduced the compact high output speakers and was "copied" (in spirit anyway) by R.H., Peavey, EV and others. It'n not so popular these days because of great improvements in driver techniology, including tougher mechanical components and better thermal adhesives. Some implimentations worked pretty good, and others didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarharv52 Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 That is interesting.I did not know that.Not being one to push speakers to the limit if I owned speakers that had them then it was never noticed.Thanks to all you guys for explaining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Al Poulin Posted February 17, 2007 Author Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 Sorry, I was asking Al. I see an educational opportunity here. I have some on my NX55Ps. They seem to work well in preventing woofer over-excursion and in getting an increase in overall volume (mids/vocals mostly)- if needed, once the woofer has attained it's lower freq output capability. However, it does affect the overall sound quality of the cabinet (contrary to what Yorkville says) as the more signal you give the cab, the less bass there is (the more it filters out the lows). Too much limiting affects sound quality and overally dynamics of the music and makes the system sound stressed IMO. Some active cabinets, such as the Samson DB500 advertise that they don't use these filters and so you get all the bass, all the time. It doesn't really affect me that much however. When I think I'll need more sound than they can put out, I bring my LS700P and engage the 100hz cutoffs on the NX55Ps. I rarely see the limit lights go on and have never actually seen the clip light either. But I am very very careful and do baby my gear a lot... Al From the NX55Ps description : ''We've also found an opportunity to tweak the electronics for maximum overall speaker performance and protection. Borrowing some ideas from our powerful and popular TX Series PA systems, the limiters used in the input and crossover stages are a complex combination of gain reduction and sweeping filters. As the NX55P is being pushed to its maximum input / output levels, it''s advanced filtering begins rolling off unnecessary subsonic frequencies. The filter has remarkable response times (less than 70ms), allowing the system to constantly be returning itself to make sure the output is as clean, as loud and as clear as possible at any given moment. This is achieved without negatively affecting the overall sonic quality of the cabinet. This ensures that the essential part of any mix, like the vocals or solo instruments, comes out clean and clear at the extremes of power and woofer excursion. Extremely fast and accurate limiting is in place to protect the speaker components.'' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members W. M. Hellinger Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 ''Yes it has all of that, and they are Neodymium speakers..so no, theywill not blow. They will blow you eardrums before they blow. Give me acall if you have any other questions or if you would like to place anorder.'' I'm guessing that a personal injury lawyer would have a field day with this statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Al Poulin Posted February 17, 2007 Author Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 Dear Carvin, I got my speakers today. My sound friends say that they blow, but you said they would not...because they are Neo gymnasium speakers. What gives? Also, after putting my ears in front of the speakers for 8 hours straight at full volume, I've blown my eardrums. I can no longer hear if my speakers are working or not. How does this affect my warranty? Just having a little fun.... I really would like to hear these cabs though. They look very nice and are extremely light weight. http://www.carvin.com/products/single.php?ItemNumber=LM15A&CID=LM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Smitty-PNS Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 So Al, Let me know how you like them.... I am thinking about about buying 4 of the non-powered LM15s. Or maybe 2 of the LM12s and 2 LM15s. Still thinking about the configuration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DJ Swydez Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 I really would like to hear these cabs though. They look very nice and are extremely light weight. Those Carvin cabs do look very nice, but I would be very wary about those specs... they seem almost too good to be true... well for $1000 powered from Carvin anyway... I think you should talk to Don about trusting Carvin's specs... I believe he said awhile back that most have absolutely no idea how a company such as Carvin determines their specs without a professional anechoic sound chamber and a full line of licensed engineers using one of the recognised methods (EIA RS-426A or AES Standard 2-1984) for determining speaker specs... http://peavey.com/support/technotes/concepts/THE_LOUDSPEAKER_SPEC_SHEET_GAME_2005.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DJ Swydez Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 They e-mailed me back with a very impressive price of under 1000$ to my door (including shipping+duty etc..) for a pair which I have to admit is very good for a set of powered 15'' cabs weighing in under 40lbs. They are only $430/pc direct from Carvin with only $30/pc shipping costs on their website... They can't honestly be charging you $140 for shipping on those things and calling it a deal... THEY ARE RIPPING YOU OFF!!! Many online dealers will ship to the lower 48 states and Canada for free or virtually nothing... Not much of a discount but rather a RIP OFF from Carvin IMO with $70/speaker in shipping costs when it says in plain text "Shipping: $29.99"... Your total price should be more around $920 before they begin to discount... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dookietwo Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 They are only $430/pc direct from Carvin with only $30/pc shipping costs on their website... They can't honestly be charging you $140 for shipping on those things and calling it a deal... THEY ARE RIPPING YOU OFF!!! Many online dealers will ship to the lower 48 states and Canada for free or virtually nothing... Not much of a discount but rather a RIP OFF from Carvin IMO with $70/speaker in shipping costs when it says in plain text "Shipping: $29.99"... Your total price should be more around $920 before they begin to discount... He lives in Canada which charges duties,gst etc. to what you buy out of country. Living just 10 miles or so from Canada I feel his pain...Dookietwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sharnrock Posted February 17, 2007 Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 It's ok. Just drown those sorrows in a jar of Mayo. You'll feel better in the morning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Al Poulin Posted February 17, 2007 Author Members Share Posted February 17, 2007 So Al, Let me know how you like them.... I am thinking about about buying 4 of the non-powered LM15s. Or maybe 2 of the LM12s and 2 LM15s. Still thinking about the configuration. I just asked my brother to order 1 LM15A for me. He owes me some money because the electonic drum set he ordered on EBay (birthday present from my wife+family) never came in. I usually wouldn't risk my money on Carvin, but since this is a birthday gift from December, I will give them a try. I will test it out as soon as I get it and let you guys know. I`m curious to see how they will perform vs. my NX55Ps which are two times the price. If I like it, I will order another. If not, it's going back and I lose a little $$$ because of shipping. What the hell, let's see what happens. I've been curious about Carvin for a few years. Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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