when are you a pro?

this may be an obvious question, but I wonder when it is that you can officially be considered a "professional"?

Is it when you get your first payday as a drummer? I dont think it is when your able to support yourself as a drummer, as that would mean there are precious few true pros

I tend to think that its like an athlete. When you get paid, that makes you a pro.

Does anybody have the definitive answer?

I think when that is all you have to do to support yourself. A close second indication is when companies begin to pay you to play their gear.

this may be an obvious question, but I wonder when it is that you can officially be considered a "professional"? Is it when you get your first payday as a drummer? I dont think it is when your able to support yourself as a drummer, as that would mean there are precious few true pros I tend to think that its like an athlete. When you get paid, that makes you a pro. Does anybody have the definitive answer?

I think you've hit it...

Someone put it in their signature...

An amatuer practices until he/she gets it right.

A professional practices until he/she can't get it wrong.

That said, someone who suppliments their primary income - semi-pro. A person who does it as their sole source of income - pro. One BIG caveat though - you have ot be able to "live" on what you make...

So, marrying a lawyer, and being a stay at home-type and playing on the weekends for $200/week isn't cutting it!

I agree with jenks.

I thought as soon as you could afford your first pro kit, you was considered a pro.

To me a pro would be someone who has been "successful".. Your definition of success may differ...

Success (according to Bob Dylan).... Is a man who gets up in the morning, and goes to bed at night, and in between, does what he wants to do.. I don't have the exact quote, but theres a lot of answer in that...

Don't you just need some pro model signature sticks?

Yeh,then we can trash your signature sticks here on the forum:lol:

I thought you was considered a pro if you had a pimp?

Pretty sure you need a signature snare with a ridiculous design on the shell.

That PR would need to be replaced with an H!!!

[serious mode]

Well, by strict interpretation, a professional is someone who does something as their profession. So a professional musician would derive his living from playing music.

However, I do believe it is possible to exhibit 'professionalism' in one's conduct, which to me means doing your homework ahead of time, keeping your chops up by practicing as often as necessary, understanding that every other bandmember's opinion is just as valid as yours, etc..

Over the years (well...ok....decades) I've found that musicians who exhibit professionalism in their musical endeavours are the ones who are the most in demand, be they pro, semi-pro or amateur.

[/serious mode]

wow....lot of hot air!

I'm glad you got that out of your system...lol

long day at work....

When you're getting paid to play your songs, not other peoples'.

actual mode,

...obviously when you can make a living. Specifics vary greatly, especially and maybe unfortunately concerning issues of musical competence and acheivement. So when the IRS says you're a pro, you're a pro.

Count on DeeDub to get it right. My opinion coincides pretty closely with this ^.

If you always give yourself at least one or two major {censored}-ups worth of extra time before the gig, you're a pro.

If you have plenty of extra gear for yourself, and maybe even carry stuff you anticipate your bandmates forgetting, you're a pro.

If you make sure you know how to dress for the wedding you've been hired to play, you're a pro.

If you go to bed early the night before, and refrain from yard work and sports the day of, you're a pro.

If you do the leg-work to learn the tunes upfront, so that you're not wasting the studio time, you're a pro.

If you have gas in your car the day before, you're a pro.

If people call you because they know they can count on you, you're a pro.

If your equipment is never a problem, you're a pro.

If you're relaxed and in-control in front of an audience, be they topless chicks or screaming babies, you're a pro.

So... for me... I make enough money as a musician that I have to claim it on my taxes, but it's not near enough that I could live on it. Still, don't try tell me I'm not a professional.

To me, being a "pro" is a set of behaviors, not a money or time-spent threshold.

$.02

/w

very well said Jenks, DW and Willy!!!

I would say in layman's terms, if you get paid to drum = pro. But then that means that terrible drunk drummer in that dive bar band you saw last week is a pro. Also if your friend pays you a dollar to light your farts on fire, does that make you professional flatuence igniter?? So being paid may loosely mean pro.

I think a more legal term would be one who makes their living from drums. Just like you believe that Professional Liquid Drain-O is great because it's the same stuff the plumbers whom you pay big bucks to use.

Like Willy has beautifully stated it takes a professional attitude to start with. It's how an amateur becomes a semi-pro and a semi-pro a full pro. When you fully answer the main two questions that get you any job. 1) Why should we hire you? and 2) Can you show us what you have done before?

I also like Jaysonehm's response, when people pay to hear YOUR songs. That would be a high to me, to know that someone laid down cold hard cash to see or hear me play. And now you know.......my side of the story.

PS. I think this topic was done awhile back as well?

I think you might be a pro drummer if you own the van....

Or a nice pa. If you are a drummer and you own a nice pa, you are the best drummer in the world.

the major difference is semantic.

Willy did a great job describing professionalism. Somebody who does all that is professional (adj.) and there are precious few people like that.

A professional (n.) makes a living doing something.

Brilliant! I would certainly agree with that.

+ gazillion

I "professionally" disagree....

So, that would make, say...the American Idol band not professionals?