Project guitar question: is it possible to strip a new finish down to the old finish?

[DeuceII]

I just picked up this Carvin Ultra V project guitar. Someone previously refinished it with this black paint that has silver flecks in it, and included a silly little Felix the cat graphic. They also stripped the neck and covered the Carvin logo. It looks like the original paint is still under there as seen in the pickup/control routes. I'm wondering if it's possible to strip down the new finish to the old finish instead of just completely stripping it and refinishing it. The new finish is well done, I just don't need the graphics and would like the logo back. Sorry about the crappy pics, it's what was posted on craigslist and I haven't had a chance to take new ones.

[WRGKMC]

Highly unlikely plus you're assuming there is an original finish under there. They may have stripped it to the wood as they should have refinishing. Sometimes they just take it down to the primer. If its lacquer paint over lacquer then the new lacquer melts into the old

 

If it was poly they painted over then you may be able to get most of it off, sand it super smooth and re clear coat the base color. Its hard to know unless you scrape it down to see what was done. Theres so many ding bats who dont know how to refinish you juet wont know what you may find. If the new paint chips away it may be lacquer, if it peels away it may have been painted with enamil. Stripper will remove oil and achohol based finishes and leave poly. I couldnt find much on carvin finishes. I believe the necks are poly finishes so you may be able to sand the paint off if they painted over the poly. Its unlikely the logo will survive. Maybe pull the neck off and sand the heel down and see whet shows. If its a good job then you have to decide if the removal is worth the refinish that will have to occur.

[michaell]

You need a really thin razor blade and steady hands!

 

just kidding

 

Pretty sure that might be an impossible task

[aclarke]

Yes, but it's not easy - and there's no guarantee of success. You don't know what's under the current finish until you get there.

 

Go out and buy a sanding block, a couple of erasers (small sanding blocks), and a couple sheets of 600, 800, 1000, 1500 and 2000 grit wet dry paper.

 

Start with the six (wet) and go at it until you see the original finish. Then work up from there, using a light touch. Finish with polishing compound.

[Gas Hed]

A lot depends on how thick the original finish is. Typically, we're only talking a few thousands of an inch here. Likelyhood of sanding into the original finish and damaging it or cutting to the wood is very high.

 

It is possible though, just a very LONG process. You'd have to go with a very high grit abrasive and sand, and sand, and sand and be careful once you hit your point.

 

Hey - worse comes to worse, you try it, doesn't work, and you just go to the wood and refinish.

[DeuceII]

In looking over the Carvin Museum website, the online scans of the catalogs from 1987 says they were using poly finishes on all their guitars. I'm going to try sanding through a small patch on the back somewhere, then go from there. So I start with wet/dry 600 grit, wet? Would you recommend I do it by hand or use a hand held sander?

[DaleH]

 

In looking over the Carvin Museum website, the online scans of the catalogs from 1987 says they were using poly finishes on all their guitars. I'm going to try sanding through a small patch on the back somewhere, then go from there. So I start with wet/dry 600 grit, wet? Would you recommend I do it by hand or use a hand held sander?

 

 

No power sander. I would try 300 on a sanding block. Just untill I could start to see a change then maybe go to finer grit depending how fast it is cutting through.

[HanSolo]

Chances are pretty good the refin is lacquer. The original finish, if still intact s a catalyzed urthane. Try some lacquer thinner. It will take off the refinish and not harm the original. In all likelihood, whoever refinished it sanded the original finish to allow the refin to adhere. It may be intackt but could be sanded through here and there. If intact, you could recoat with clear lacquer.

[aclarke]

 

In looking over the Carvin Museum website, the online scans of the catalogs from 1987 says they were using poly finishes on all their guitars. I'm going to try sanding through a small patch on the back somewhere, then go from there. So I start with wet/dry 600 grit, wet? Would you recommend I do it by hand or use a hand held sander?

 

 

 

I would start at 600, wet, with a little bit of dish soap added to the water for lubricant. Keep rinsing the paper so that it doesn't load up. And use a block so you don't sand finger grooves into the piece.

 

As soon as you start seeing the original colour coat, switch up to 800. Remember: don't skip grades - as you work to finer grades, you're removing the scratches of the previous one. Wet sand up to 2000 grit, and then you can switch to polishing compound.

 

You might get away with starting at 400 (wet) - but I'd be worried about removing too much of the original finish. Maybe start at 400 to knock down the existing finish, and move up to 600 to expose the original?

[axegrinder]

If they did a decent job on the new finish they at least (AT LEAST) broke down the surface of the original finish to give the new paint a surface it can "grab" onto. I would not even attempt to try unless fully prepared to do a complete refinish.

 

Having said all that, I personally think the graphics are done tastefully enough and go well with the style of the guitar.

 

As for the headstock, do you have a close up? It MIGHT be worth trying to sand it smooth to see if the Carvin logo is intact...may be worth redoing the clear coat without a huge headache.

[thick_mike]

I really think trying to sand to the original finish and then polish the original lacquer is next to impossible (unless you have the Zen patience of Meandi).

 

You might be able to do it starting with a fine grit paper (e.g. 320/400) and then wet sand by hand until you see the colour you want. Then you should apply a few lacquer coats and then polish from there...however...there is about a 95% chance of failure...and...you would probably get a better finish much quicker by applying a new finish (the same colour as the old one you like) to the guitar as it exists. If you want the original logo, you can probably get a water slide decal.

[scott944]

I was able to remove an amateur refin over a factory finish with chemical stripper. The stripper rapidly ate the rattle can refin but didn't have much, if any, affect on the very hard (likely poly) factory finish underneath. Might be worth a try on a small area of the back. I guess the real question is, if you go through with it, regardless of the method(s), and it isn't successful - then what?

[guitarcapo]

If the original finish was poly and not sanded down to bare wood (highly likely) and the overspray NOT (also highly likely)...then a chemical stripper would work great.

 

If the refin involved sanding down to bare wood, I'd probably finish OVER what was already done to avoid pore filling.

[HanSolo]

Just use the lacquer thinner and a bunch of paper towels. It wont even touch the original urethane and the refinish will wipe right off. Forget the sanding method unless you have nothing better to do for the next 2 weeks.

[cratz2]

Man, my arms got tired just reading this thread.