Nashville player's and number system

[countrybass]

My present band is preparing to record our first cd. Locally at this time, but with somework and alot of luck and $$$, we're planning on going down to Nashville to do some gig's and possible record as well. From what I here it's quite a tough town as far as actually being the muscian on the cd as oppossed to the producer bringing in a session guy. Although that will probably happen to me as well, I would like to do my best. One thing that I need to not only learn, but become great at is the "Nashville number system." I googled it and did find out some info, but if anyone can add their knowledge, I would appreciate it. Also, from what I understand, is that the're are only a few cats playing bass down there on most of the cd's. Does anyone know names of these guy's.

[PaulyWally]

When you say the Nashville Number system, are you talking about:

 

I ii iii IV V vi vii

 

 

???

 

If so, what do you need to know?

[countrybass]

That's it!! Yeah I heard about it for the first time just the other day from a friend of mine in Poverty neck Hillbillys. So I thought that I'd better find out what it is. What I briefly read is that the numbers are the notes of the scale. I know this stuff but I'm not fast enough to jam off a chart with only the numbers. I would have to practice that. I know that if G is I then C is IV and D is V, but what I guess I'm asking is there a written system to learn this? Also the sysbols. I guess that I need too or would like to see an actual application of what a producer would hand me. I'm going to be nervous enough let alone doing something that I'm not used to.

[PaulyWally]

 

but what I guess I'm asking is there a written system to learn this?

 

 

I really don't know of any "systems" that teach it. You might want to consider picking up a Jazz book that covers the number system. It'll give you all the theory behind it.

 

But learning to play to the numbering system just takes a different mindset, and a lot of practice.

 

 

I know that if G is I then C is IV and D is V

 

 

That's correct. The numbering system is a way of transposing songs on the fly without having to re-write charts and lead sheets.

 

So if you have a chart that has the following:

 

I - V - I - iii

 

The producer might say, "key of C".

 

The numbers basically refer to the scale degree in the chord changes. G is the 5th of C, and E is the 3rd of C, etc. If the numbers are capital, it means the chord is major. If the numbers are lower case, they are minor.

 

In the key of C, you would play C, G, C, and Em respectively.

 

Now let's say the singer is out of his/her range when you play it. The producer might tell you to play it again in the key of A. In that case, you would play:

 

A - E - A - C#min

 

 

When you have become acquainted with doing this, it is much easier to use this system rather than continuously re-charting songs. You just have one chart that never needs to be re-written... no matter how many times you have to cater to a new musician or key change.

 

You can also see things like:

 

I Maj7

ii min9

V7

 

...depending on the genre and what specific types of chords are expected to be played.

[bnyswonger]

It is written. It's just in a language you're not used to seeing.

 

Are you going to be recording music you don't already do? If so and you're having trouble, you can just write the chord names on the chart if that helps you. It's a good idea to learn how the number thing works, but I wouldn't let that flummox you.

[superiorparts]

 

My present band is preparing to record our first cd. Locally at this time, but with somework and alot of luck and $$$, we're planning on going down to Nashville to do some gig's and possible record as well. From what I here it's quite a tough town as far as actually being the muscian on the cd as oppossed to the producer bringing in a session guy. Although that will probably happen to me as well, I would like to do my best. One thing that I need to not only learn, but become great at is the "Nashville number system." I googled it and did find out some info, but if anyone can add their knowledge, I would appreciate it. Also, from what I understand, is that the're are only a few cats playing bass down there on most of the cd's. Does anyone know names of these guy's.

 

 

spencer campbell is a fine studio bassist and also tours with quite of few stars when they need him. met him when he was playing a tour with delbert mcClinton. awesome guy and real friendly. had some great stories to tell.

[Craig Vecchione]

I'm a little confused as to why you think you'd need to learn this system. It's your band, your music, that you're planning to record yourselves, right? If so, you can use whatever key you want, and read your own music if you have any.

 

It's only if you plan to hire session players, or if you plan to attempt to get hired as a session player, that you'd need to use the system.

[PaulyWally]

 

It's only if you plan to hire session players, or if you plan to attempt to get hired as a session player, that you'd need to use the system.

 

 

+1

[Mudbass]

When you say the Nashville Number system, are you talking about: I ii iii IV V vi vii ??? If so, what do you need to know?

 

There are people in Nashville who can count to vii? Who knew!

[Kakona]

There is a chapter on the Nashville Number System and country bass playing in general in The Bass Player Book, a compilation of articles edited by Karl Coryat. From what I recall (the book is not in front of me), there are other symbols besides the roman numerals that are unique to the system. If you intend to record in Nashville I think the best way to learn the system would be to get together with an experienced local guitarist and ask him to take you through it until you know it well.

[Stackabones]

Usually Nashville numbering doesn't use Roman numerals (these are used in trad theory).

 

Just use regular numbers.

 

I -- 1

ii -- 2-, or 2m

etc.

[Jazz Ad]

I use Nashville system all the time for covers. It's a bit simplistic but works fine for maybe 9 songs out of 10, basically for anything that stays within a single key and employs traditional harmonies.

[countrybass]

 

I'm a little confused as to why you think you'd need to learn this system. It's your band, your music, that you're planning to record yourselves, right? If so, you can use whatever key you want, and read your own music if you have any. It's only if you plan to hire session players, or if you plan to attempt to get hired as a session player, that you'd need to use the system.

 

 

From speaking to close friend's of mine who ares signed and recording in Nashville, for the most part, the songs are not their original's. A Nashville writer or writer's write the song, the producer plays the song for you, hands you a chart with the number system on it and you only have a few times to do it correctly. If you can't ,the producer then brings in a session guy to do it for you. At least that's what I v'e been told. If that is the case, I'll probably be benched anyways but I'd like to at least go in with a chance.

[Craig Vecchione]

 

From speaking to close friend's of mine who ares signed and recording in Nashville, for the most part, the songs are not their original's. A Nashville writer or writer's write the song, the producer plays the song for you, hands you a chart with the number system on it and you only have a few times to do it correctly. If you can't ,the producer then brings in a session guy to do it for you. At least that's what I v'e been told. If that is the case, I'll probably be benched anyways but I'd like to at least go in with a chance.

 

 

 

Ok, so you're not doing your own music. Yup, you're screwed....gotta learn the system:D. Your friend describes exactly what I've read many times about how session work goes.

[catphish]

 

Usually Nashville numbering doesn't use Roman numerals (these are used in trad theory). Just use regular numbers. I -- 1 ii -- 2-, or 2m etc.

 

 

yep.

[countrybass]

Ok, so you're not doing your own music. Yup, you're screwed....gotta learn the system:D. Your friend describes exactly what I've read many times about how session work goes.

 

Thanks!! I feel alot better now!! :lol:

[Les_Izzmor]

I'm not sure how this is a short-cut.

 

I always think of songs in that way. I to IV to V etc. That way it's easy to transpose. I don't think in terms of chord names.

 

When most people play a song that goes from A to D to E, I thought the first thing they thought was I - IV -V. Is that all the numbering system is?

[MrJoshua]

It works very well for most rock, country, and similar music. You basically just assign the number 1 to the root of the song, then every other chord is assigned a number based on its position in the root's scale. There are some symbols that go along with it. For example, a minor chord is usually denoted by a -, so in the key of G, A minor would be 2-. When you have chord changes within a measure, they're often grouped together by parenthesis. So if the above song had a full measure of G, then two beats each of D and C, it would be written out:

 

1 (5 4)

 

Then there are symbols for repeating bars, etc, the standard sort of stuff you need in any music notation system.

[pbass_groovin]

Jackie Street is one phat cat bass player. I think he's out of Nashville.

[Hi-Fi]

Nashville Number System

 

by Shawn Burrell

 

The Nashville Number system is simple to learn and is a must for any working bassist.

 

The way it works:

Each note in a scale is given a number. For example the root note of a major scale would be given the number one. In the key of G, the one chord is G major. The two chord is A minor 7, the three chord is B minor 7, the four chord is C major, the five chord is D major 3 or a dom 7, the six chord is a E minor 7, the seven chord is a F# minor 7 flat 5, the octave or root is major.

 

Example:

 

In Major Keys

I

ii

iii

IV

V

vi

vii

VIII

chord- major

chord- minor 7

chord- minor 7

chord- major

chord- dom 7

chord- min

chord- min 7 flat5

octave- major

In Minor Keys

i

ii

III

iv

V

VI

vii

VIII

chord- minor 7

chord- minor 7/flat5

chord- major

chord- minor 7

chord- minor 7

chord- major

chord- dom 7

octave- minor 7

 

Why is the number system useful?

It is very useful, because the players can change keys without having to write new charts. The singer will be able to try the song in different keys and the players wont have to write new charts if they are using the number system.

[Hi-Fi]

As far as your concern for a producer bringing in session players, that most likely not happen. Session musicians are typically called for when backing "stars." If you are paying a producer to record your music, you will be playing. Just make sure you guys are tight. If you have not been to Nashville, you are in for a humbling experience. I lived there for seven years and I swear whenever I was feeling good about my playing abilities I would take a stroll along Broadway and feel like a complete amateur. Absolutely amazing amount of talent there. Go to any bar along Broadway and 4th and you will see. IMO, there is no better city for music. Best of luck with the recording!

[Bassius]

14 11 44 11 54 11

 

HAH!

 

that's it...

 

by a show of hands, who's brain is fried....

[ezstep]

I have never used anything else in the studio, but I also have never seen it written in Roman numerals.

 

Some killer bassists in Nashville?

 

Michael Rhodes.

 

Keith Horne.

 

Dave Roe.

 

all killers.

[MrJoshua]

 

14 11 44 11 54 11 HAH! that's it... by a show of hands, who's brain is fried....

 

 

Yeah, you get that a lot too, where people say them as double-digit numbers. "This tune is fourteen fifty-one. Cake, man."

[catsandstrats]

Originally from Nashville, and a former professional musician.

 

They won't kick out the band members unless...

1. You are signed to a development deal, and they are paying for the studio time...

2. They cannot get a cut from a particular musician...

 

Here are the positives....

1. Studio cats are better than you....I guarantee it. Let them play it, things will go smoother and you will probably learn a better bassline than the one you wrote.

2. Studio cats have better equipment than you, so you will sound awesome.

3. If you can play, you will be on the record.

 

Each studio has their own A list...these are first call musicians. Usually they do not tour. I dont know any of them, but they play on most of the country music that you hear. Even some great bands use these guys...Brooks and Dunn, LoneStar, and others who are in their own right, great bands use these musicians.

 

B-listers play on minor stars and still tour some, and play at the Opry.

 

C-listers are people who play on demos for people who are paying their own way.

 

Hope this helps