Moderators ThudMaker Posted March 12, 2008 Moderators Share Posted March 12, 2008 I'd be more concerned about paying for their pensions. I have to pay for my own retirement. I'm not sure what makes teachers and their union think I should pay theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ec437 Posted March 12, 2008 Members Share Posted March 12, 2008 That's what she said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jugghaid Posted March 12, 2008 Members Share Posted March 12, 2008 False. Disallowing the right to collective bargaining is just as wrong as disallowing the right to work (requiring union membership), and a real free-market simply does not work. Period. It's always willing to sacrifice the long term general good for short non-general gain, and allows destructive actions to be taken which simply cannot be recovered from later (this is more in context of what a free market allows in terms of long-term environmental damage, which I know you don't believe in despite the evidence, but it applies here, too). The teachers union, like many unions, has outgrown itself, it's usefulness, and what it was put in place for initially. I, as an employer, am under no obligation to allow collective bargaining. If I am not treating my employees well, or compensating them well, they will go to my competition. While I agree there is no such thing as a pure free-market system (just as there is no pure democracy or capitalism either) the more you sway to that side the better IMO. Just because you lean towards a free market enterprise doesn't mean you have to be destructive either. It's not an A or B choice. And I do believe there is long term environmental damage that has been done by many industries. The "global warming" scare is a big friggin hoax, but there is plenty of actual damage done by polluting out water tables, streams rivers and lakes, soil, etc etc etc. Massive clear cutting is also very irresponsible IMO. There are a ton of abuses and travesties that mankind commits against our environment on a daily basis. That's one of the reason the whole "global warming" thing pisses me off so much. People are spending so much time, energy, and money on a myth, they are missing what's right in front of their faces. The obvious and wanton destruction of ecosystems by arrogant pricks who have no concept of the impact they are having. :2c: I have never said that environmental crimes are not committed daily. Far from it. And I would rather see these things addressed than the nonsense that some of these dip{censored}s put out on a daily basis that, day by day, is being debunked more and more. Hell, some of the most prominent players in the Global Warming scam have flat out admitted that they have lied and exxagerated to "draw attention" to the issue. An issue they can't even back up without hyperbole and fear-mongering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jugghaid Posted March 12, 2008 Members Share Posted March 12, 2008 Indeed...In a true free market, people are allowed to organize however they see fit. Whether that organization is a corporation (collective management) or a union (collective employees)...Such organizational structures are neither compelled nor prohibited...It's ironic that you say they're not "required by law", because in a real free market there are no regulatory laws at all...Laws and regulation is what moves it away from being "free"Any restriction on the manner in which people conduct their business is a move away from the free market.... That pretty much sums up my point. I never said ban unions. i personally don't see the need for them in a competitive environment. And personally I wouldn't want to tie myself to one when my performance will be judages as a collective and not as an individual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jugghaid Posted March 12, 2008 Members Share Posted March 12, 2008 I didn't say otherwise The old idea is that the "Free market" is necessarily the "most competitive market"...However, history has shown us otherwise. I definitely recognize the place for governmental regulation. Much like rules allow a sporting match to take place, government regulation, when done properly, can increase competition within the market... Competition is almost always a positive. It's competition that ensures the best products, it's competition that rewards innovation and effort. The Free market & government regulations are only beneficial if they increase competition... While I am against over-regulation, you are correct. There does need to be some measure of regulation, just based on the fact that without it, human nature runs rampant. and competition does breed excellence. One of the many reasons I want the teachers union out of educating our kids. The teachers....fine, if they are good (and in that case have no need for a union) but the union itself has become a destructive force to education. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.