CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 16, 2009 CMS Author Share Posted June 16, 2009 "wearing down" is a bit different than digging craters. I call it "expediting". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members catphish Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 I understand how ridiculous it is, but as a result, they will be forced to buy elsewhere, such as local growers, as you say.But do you really think that the local produce supply is going be able to maintain rock bottom prices on fruits and veggies? Rock Bottom prices are just the cheapest option, so in a land of $10 gas, I'd say it's a possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lug Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 Expecting everyone to have a large sustained garden is as ridiculous a notion as lug stating he's forced to buy gas. And if I had actually said that, you'd have a better point. Now if you want to make the excess tax that brings the gas up to $10 a gallon entirely voluntary, I'm with ya! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 16, 2009 CMS Author Share Posted June 16, 2009 Dear catphish, It is abundantly clear that lug disagrees with you. Therefore, you are wrong and should admit your mistake for the good of the forum. Regards, Craig PS: we can't sustain another lug MP3 attack, so please comply as soon as possible. Think of the children. And the kittens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members t3ch Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 Ok, so a guy that runs an electric car company thinks gas should be expensive. Wow, that settles it I guess. For the rest of you that agree with him, what are your reasons? I don't know anything about the subject. Could I get some more info besides "yeah it totally should be" ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lug Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 Dear catphish,It is abundantly clear that lug disagrees with you. Therefore, you are wrong and should admit your mistake for the good of the forum.Regards,CraigPS: we can't sustain another lug MP3 attack, so please comply as soon as possible. Think of the children. And the kittens. Whoa! I'm not the kind of guy to force my opinions (i.e. facts) on other through force of MP3. Catphish is very often correct so in respect of that, I fully support his right to be wrong in this case (i.e. reach an opinion that differs from that of Lug). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members catphish Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 You are forced to pay the tax. If you earn or spend money, there is a tax involved. Whether it is sales tax, income tax, or indirectly through an increased cost of goods because the manufacturer is forced to pay a tax. There is no way to legally live a normal life in this country without being forced to pay taxes. You think people should be allowed to live here and pay no taxes at all?? What are you, an illegal alien? You're not forced to work, or buy things, or own property. If you want you're "normal life" that's all by choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 16, 2009 CMS Author Share Posted June 16, 2009 Ok, so a guy that runs an electric car company thinks gas should be expensive. Wow, that settles it I guess. For the rest of you that agree with him, what are your reasons? I don't know anything about the subject. Could I get some more info besides "yeah it totally should be" ? Catphish clearly stated that it cut his commute time substantially, leaving more time for gardening. Considering how much he posts here, obviously his job is undemanding, so a less stressful commute is an absolute necessity. For balance, you know.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members catphish Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 Catphish clearly stated that it cut his commute time substantially, leaving more time for gardening. Considering how much he posts here, obviously his job is undemanding, so a less stressful commute is an absolute necessity. For balance, you know.... Says the guy with twice as many posts as me in the same amount of time. I LOATHE driving in traffic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chugheshc2 Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 I'd like to see the true cost of automobiles reflected in the costs of licensing them; I am not sure that federal transportation subsidies that go into interstate highways should come out of my families paycheck. (yay trains/buses/etc). I ride a train to work, why should my income tax fix the interstate? Why shouldn't gas taxes fix the roads, after all, if you buy gas you are using the roads, yes? I would also like to see higher fuel costs cause a more rational housing (less sprawl) situation, and I do believe food should be more expensive (how many people do you see that are overweight? do you honestly think there is no relation between the absurdly low cost of food and the epidemic of obesity?) I can't cite the source but I believe I heard Michael Pollan say that food costs in US are 9% of our budget, far less expensive than other countries, this in part due to our government subsidization of monoculture. I'd like some sort of change to the tax structure - take into account how many cars, if you ride motorcycles, walk to work, that sort of thing. Most people tend to do things according to economic pressure (buy a smaller, car, insulate their house, change from electric to gas heat etc) so I think the tax policies should be amended to enhance our chances at survival in the future. I am certain that 10$ a gallon gasoline, if effected very gradually (say, over 6-8 years) would provide some impetus to moving us into alternative energy and lifestyles that are far less fuel hungry. popcorn time C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members catphish Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 And if I had actually said that, you'd have a better point. Explicitly no, you didn't. Are you suggesting it wasn't implied by your comments? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members willsellout Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 We see how Catphish does with a $50 pack of smokes:eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 16, 2009 CMS Author Share Posted June 16, 2009 You're not forced to work, or buy things, or own property. If you want you're "normal life" that's all by choice. How about "any" life? You can't eat if you don't buy groceries, unless you grow your own food, which you can't do unless you own land, which would require money to purchase, and that real-estate taxes be paid upon. You need clothing, which costs money, so again there's that ugly income and taxation thing. Shelter requires land and materials. Again, all taxed. Please map out a life in the US that costs nothing and can be achieved without paying any tax, whether directly or indirectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members catphish Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 Figures you'd cherry-pick "normal life". I can't pick them unless you put them out there. You ignored my question. You expect to live here and pay no taxes at all? I doubt it. I'm sure you're aware of groups of people who live almost entirely off the grid and pay virtually no taxes. Is it a life I'd choose? Hell no. I've spent enough time in this absurd hypothetical now about $9 lettuce, and need to get back to my undemanding job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lug Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 Explicitly no, you didn't. Are you suggesting it wasn't implied by your comments?I'm suggesting that I didn't want be forced to "pay $10 a gallon for gas to "encourage" something." I thought it was pretty clear by the fact that I typed it that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members t3ch Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 I'd like to see the true cost of automobiles reflected in the costs of licensing them; I am not sure that federal transportation subsidies that go into interstate highways should come out of my families paycheck. (yay trains/buses/etc). I ride a train to work, why should my income tax fix the interstate? Why shouldn't gas taxes fix the roads, after all, if you buy gas you are using the roads, yes? I really hope you don't have kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members brake Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 Yeah, gas rising to the point where I couldn't afford to get to work would be {censored}ing awesome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members catphish Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 I'm suggesting that I didn't want be forced to "pay $10 a gallon for gas to "encourage" something." I thought it was pretty clear by the fact that I typed it that way. Which implies someone could be forced to buy (or pay an amount for...) gas. No wonder your beard i so scruffy looking, it's full of split hairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 16, 2009 CMS Author Share Posted June 16, 2009 I've spent enough time in this absurd hypothetical now about $9 lettuce, and need to get back to my undemanding job. The hypothetical isn't about the exact cost (I already stated this) but about artificially increasing costs substantially. You've shown no benefit to this scheme, aside from making your commute easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 16, 2009 CMS Author Share Posted June 16, 2009 Says the guy with twice as many posts as me in the same amount of time. I LOATHE driving in traffic. Don't hate me because I'm more efficient!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chugheshc2 Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 I really hope you don't have kids. I don't follow... Actually I already have children, they are pretty much grown up. more info? C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members zachoff Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 Yeah, gas rising to the point where I couldn't afford to get to work would be {censored}ing awesome We're talking $10 gas in the US, not Canada... Yours would be like $11.35. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members collinwho Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 I ride a train to work, why should my income tax fix the interstate? Why shouldn't gas taxes fix the roads, after all, if you buy gas you are using the roads, yes? Because it is pretty damn likely that the infrastructure money that is supposed to be spent fixing the interstate is actually paying for your train. There are plenty people who don't ride that train who are paying for it. Why should their income pay for your travel? With a little research you'll find that the operating cost of the vast majority of public transportation far exceeds their budget, and as such is highly subsidized by those who don't use it. I would also like to see higher fuel costs cause a more rational housing (less sprawl) situation, and I do believe food should be more expensive (how many people do you see that are overweight? do you honestly think there is no relation between the absurdly low cost of food and the epidemic of obesity?) Considering the cheapest food is generally the least healthy, and that more expensive food would likely only deepen the gap in prices between the cheapest foods and the healthy foods, I think you would find that more expensive food could lead to an even bigger obesity problem. I'd like some sort of change to the tax structure - take into account how many cars, if you ride motorcycles, walk to work, that sort of thing. Most people tend to do things according to economic pressure (buy a smaller, car, insulate their house, change from electric to gas heat etc) so I think the tax policies should be amended to enhance our chances at survival in the future. The tax structure does take into account how many cars you have. It also takes into account if you ride a motorcycle instead. How can you enhance our chances at survival in the future? Can you see the future? I am certain that 10$ a gallon gasoline, if effected very gradually (say, over 6-8 years) would provide some impetus to moving us into alternative energy and lifestyles that are far less fuel hungry. What alternative? Currently the alternatives are less efficient (aka require more power, therefore more fuel, just relocated to a different part of the process). It seems most people championing "alternative energy" are never offering actual long-term large-scale alternatives that are efficient enough to actually use. Consumer demand proved the impetus to move to more efficient forms of fuel. A ridiculous tax only steers us to something different, not to something better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lug Posted June 16, 2009 Members Share Posted June 16, 2009 Which implies someone could be forced to buy (or pay an amount for... ) gas. No wonder your beard i so scruffy looking, it's full of split hairs. Sorry, it just "implies" that I don't want to be forced to "pay 10 dollars a gallon for someone's agenda". I would love to be forced to pay $1 a gallon! Go ahead! Force me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted June 16, 2009 Moderators Share Posted June 16, 2009 I've been saying I'd like to see $10 gas for years.+1 Now that you've stolen my mantra, I'll have to bump mine to $20. I really enjoyed the behavioral changes I witnessed last summer with just a modest increase in gas pricing.I'd also like to see it be winter year round in Chicago rather than deal with the behavioral changes that summer brings. That concept isn't usually any more popular either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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