Members fanuvbrak Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 Our singer isn't working out. He has moments of brilliance but he's very inconsistent. On top of that, it's pretty clear that he has an alcohol/substance problem. Anyway, the band talked last night and we want to let him go. Somehow I got the honor of letting him know. Do I tell him why, or do I just say we talked and he's out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Z_Zoquis Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 ...Somehow I got the honor of letting him know. this came as a surprise to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Wolfgang2049 Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 Yup, tell him why. It probably won't matter to him (ie he will flip out anyway), but it is the right thing to do. It may help him down the line too depending on his personal psychology. If he has stuff in the practice space, do it in person next time shows up. Make sure he doesn't take anything that isn't his. If he doesn't have anything in the practice space, do it over the phone. We have done this multiple times. For us, the actual firing is not the worst part of it. It is the craziness that ensues afterwords from the unstable band member that is most unpleasant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ned911 Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 You say - I break with thee, I break with thee, I break with thee Then you dump dog poop on his shoes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SpaceNorman Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 Firing somebody is never fun. Do it as humanely as possible - but don't soften your delivery to the point that you not being clear that this is the end of his involvement and that his termination is non-negotiable. There those who will tell you that you need to provide your singer an explanation of why he's being fired. While I agree that anybody being fired has a right know why - I'm of the opinion that telling him at the time you're firing him isn't the right time. Out of fairness - he should have been made aware of his performance issues as well as what he was expected to do to correct them long before you decided to fire him. The actually act of firing him should be like the little explanation they give a prisoner right before they execute him. Detailed examination and explanation of the specific performance issue should have taken place way before that. My typical speech typically goes something like this ... "Jack, as you know we have had concerns about your ______ (insert major issue(s) here). We talked to you about it several times - however it's still a problem. We have decided we're going to move in a different direction ... without you. We've enjoyed working with you, we're sorry this didn't work out, and wish you the best in your future projects." Then I stick my hand out and the execution is over. As others have pointed out - timing is important. When I quit a band - I always do it after my gear is loaded. I do my damnedest to fire guys after they've packed up their gear. Location is important too. We typically rehearse at somebody's home - and want to avoid having an to deal with an angry ex-bandmate when he gets the news just in case he goes bonehead in reaction. I typically try to meet them somewhere else to break the news - and then offer to deliver any gear he may have at the rehearsal space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members boxorox Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 It's always easier if he knows why he's being fired in the first place. Performance inconsistancies, substance abuse, this should have been discussed with him & the band earlier, with a caveat that he improves or he's fired. This way you don't have to explain, and it avoids the worst of whiney attempts at negotiation, which is embarrassing for everybody. You may still have to deal with rage though. It's not easy and you never get used to it. Just neccessary sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members urca Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 Easy: You - "Knock knock"Him - Who's there?"You - "Not you anymore, you're fired." End of discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jeff42 Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 what spacenorman said. perfect. don't beat around the issue. tell him honestly why he's being let go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members fanuvbrak Posted October 9, 2009 Author Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 I called him. He was fine with it. He said he knew he was trashed last night and he was getting trashed because he wasn't having any fun. So that's it. Thanks for the advice. Being up front and honest is the way to go in this situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jeff42 Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 so you both agreed to part ways? that is the best ending to something like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Echoes22 Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 Something similar happened to me a little over a month ago... our singer had moments of brilliance as well, but the alcohol abuse was getting ridiculously annoying for everyone else involved. In our case she flipped out on her own when we refused to show up to a bar gig 3 hours in advance because we didn't care to go drink ourselves silly and watch a subpar grateful dead cover band we were paired up with. She ended up going to the gig early on her own, we showed up 30 minutes before we went on, setup, played one of the worst gigs ever, parted ways and didn't hear from her for a month. She came back begging to be let back in the band after then, and I told her I no longer felt comfortable relying on her to sing lead due to her drinking. Haven't heard from her since. A damn shame really, because she had the talent but couldn't bring it after a few drinks... and unfortunately always had a drink in her hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jeff42 Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 back in the mid 90s I was in a band with a very talented singer. We were writing some good tunes and things were going great. But the guy drank & smoked weed... alot. Not just 1 or 2 beers and a joint now and then. HE DRANK TO GET STOOPID. He was a great vocalist and a great lyric writer but the rest of his life was a mess. when he drank too much (which was almost daily) he would get pretty hostile with our lead guitar player... no one else in the band, just him. then one day the singer dissapeared for weeks and that was the end of that. We never had to fire him. It irritates me when I see wasted talent. Something I see often with musicians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ForgetMeNacht Posted October 9, 2009 Members Share Posted October 9, 2009 Good thing that it's a mutual parting. Having been a recently fired, I can say that it's better to be honest and upfront about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mr3lions Posted October 10, 2009 Members Share Posted October 10, 2009 I know the deeds already been done but really you said it best Your not working out. You have moments of brilliance but your very inconsistent. On top of that, it's pretty clear that you have an alcohol/substance problem. Anyway, the band talked last night and we want to let you go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twostone Posted October 10, 2009 Members Share Posted October 10, 2009 YOUR FIREDas Donald Trump would put it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Fireatwillrocks Posted October 10, 2009 Members Share Posted October 10, 2009 just say NO MORE LSD!!!(lead singer disease)We already have a new singer so dont come to practice or you will get you ass kicked! See that was easy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Scott Powell Posted October 10, 2009 Members Share Posted October 10, 2009 I called him. He was fine with it. He said he knew he was trashed last night and he was getting trashed because he wasn't having any fun. So that's it.Thanks for the advice. Being up front and honest is the way to go in this situation. It sounds like he wanted to be fired. This is a situation i have run in to several times with people. rather than quit they want to be fired. some do it because they dont have the balsl to quit,and some do it so they can be the 'wounded party' and tell thier friends ' these pricks fired me'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RadiationNation Posted October 10, 2009 Members Share Posted October 10, 2009 At your next band meeting, say, "Everyone who's in (Your Band's name) raise your hand!" When he goes to raise his hand, look at him and say "not so fast..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rog951 Posted October 11, 2009 Members Share Posted October 11, 2009 At your next band meeting, say, "Everyone who's in (Your Band's name) raise your hand!"When he goes to raise his hand, look at him and say "not so fast..." Or, have everyone in the band stand side-by-side and say "will the ex-lead singer please step forward"...then everyone else take a step back...then, before he can figure out what happened, smack him across the face with a large trout and tell him to GTFO! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members babalugats85 Posted October 12, 2009 Members Share Posted October 12, 2009 Easy:You - "Knock knock"Him - Who's there?"You - "Not you anymore, you're fired."End of discussion. That's good but I've found this one to be a little better: You: Knock knock Him: Who's there? You: The band. Him: The band who? You: The band without you. Him: Door slams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GCDEF Posted October 12, 2009 Members Share Posted October 12, 2009 I know it's all over now, but in most cases I disagree with telling him why unless he pushes it. Telling him why just gives him the opportunity to rebut what you're saying, or to argue that he'll improve and it makes it even more personal. I'd leave it at we decided it wasn't working out and don't offer any more than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Janx Posted October 12, 2009 Members Share Posted October 12, 2009 well, like Norman said, he should have had "the talk" about the problems, long before he was fired. Before you let things get so bad you have to fire him, the Boss should have a discussion about the problems, telling him he needs to correct it. Letting a dude get so far out of whack WITHOUT taking corrective action is how you burn through employees. Yes, it's a shame that an employee doesn't know how to behave, however, you are wasting resources if you dont' attempt to get him in line. Think about how much time you spend getting him ramped up. And if you never tell him he's out of line, he's going to assume he can do whatver he wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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