Members jimiv Posted February 16, 2010 Members Share Posted February 16, 2010 Looking to form crappy band Part II (Venstucky M-Th, Ventuna on weekends) --------------------------------------------------------------------------------Date: 2010-02-13, 11:50PM PSTReply to: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@craigslist.org [Errors when replying to ads?] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Furthermore, we are in complete agreement with all club owners/managers that bringing clientele into the club is 100% the responsiblility of the band. Therefore we will spend time and our own un-reimbursed money to promote their club - I mean our gig - and see it as only fair that we work for 10% of the total bar sales that were made from the time we started playing until the time we stopped (not including food sales). Any food or drinks consumed by the band will be subtracted at full price from the bands gross pay, which will be paid to the band by check made out to only one band member. (Don't let the club owners know this but they're actually paying us 10% of the bar sales while we were on breaks! Shhhh!) It is a privilege to have a place to bring our friends and family to hear us play the songs we all love so much. We really shouldn't be making money at this at all...It's almost like we're stealing! In fact, if we all could just agree to play for free it would be that much more money that would end up going to the landlords - who are the real heroes here...who so valiantly and selflessly risk their money just so we could have a place to play the songs we all love so much in front of friends and family and so we can have great a way to alleviate our stress after a long hard week of work just to pay our rent or mortgage. Location: Venstucky M-Th, Ventuna on weekends it's NOT ok to contact this poster with services or other commercial interests PostingID: xxxxxxxxxx __________________________________ This post apparently was written in protest of the way Club managers are running their venues now. Case in point: We played Friday night at a local club which has live bands every weekend, but where is the club's draw? We rarely see anyone other than our fanbase. The club does nothing to promote itself....i.e. nothing outside the venue such as a marquee or even signage noting that there is live music. Nothing in the print media. Nothing. He does pay well though and it is close to home...so we play. If you were an original band, then I could see the venue wanting YOU to draw, but a seasoned cover band? C'mon. Then the next night, Saturday, we travel towards L.A. into the S.F. Valley which is about 30 minutes north of Hollywood. We aren't expecting anybody from our fanbase to show and bingo...we walk in to set-up a couple of hours before downbeat and the place is packed? I mean packed and there is a line beginning at the front and it is only 6:30. Now it just so happens that this owner has a Marquee out front listing the bands playing that weekend (and yep, there was our name)...has a reputation for booking only top notch cover bands and up and coming original acts etc. Advertises in the print media, really works it. But we never got any of the...."well how many people can you draw..or we need you to draw a minimum of 25 people etc". Why? Because we are not an original band and are being hired to entertain his crowd who comes there to eat, drink, dance and drink some more. We were paid well, fed and given free drinks all night. They even kept the bar open for us after closing while we were loading out and getting paid. Only one other place we play at that treats us similarly, The remainder, although paying decent, completely depend on the band to promote their venue. I wonder if the pendulum will ever swing back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mineame Posted February 17, 2010 Members Share Posted February 17, 2010 As long as there are bands out there desperate enough to take on the added responsibility of being the bars marketing department, the pendulum will never swing back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Phil Johnson Posted February 17, 2010 Members Share Posted February 17, 2010 I'd love to see the pendulum swing back to venues actually promoting their own business. Comedy clubs still manage to do it. Especially for cover bands. That's a money gig. If you're doing original stuff than those promotions are for building your fan base over the long term, rather than just one gig. That's still no reason to play for pennies though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Austincowbell Posted February 17, 2010 Members Share Posted February 17, 2010 Speaking just for my town: the three best "cover band" venues in the city don't ask about your draw. They only book SOLID tight cover bands and sometimes tribute bands and they are packed every weekend. They also have good to great PA systems and lights. And, they pay double or triple what the other venues pay. the 2nd tier cover band venues do not really have a reputation for those type of bands nor do they pay the type of money those bands make so.... they rely on bands to draw. not justifying it, just explaining why they do what they do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MartinC Posted February 17, 2010 Members Share Posted February 17, 2010 I don't get why people think original bands should have to bring a crowd, but not cover bands. Now, I get that ptp venues book bands based only on draw, or tickets sales, etc. But clubs could use the same standards that top cover band venues use to book original bands. IOW, hire great bands, pay a guarantee, promote, please your clients. There is a public that wants to see good original music, just as there is a public that just wants to dance to hits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Austincowbell Posted February 17, 2010 Members Share Posted February 17, 2010 I don't get why people think original bands should have to bring a crowd, but not cover bands. Now, I get that ptp venues book bands based only on draw, or tickets sales, etc. But clubs could use the same standards that top cover band venues use to book original bands. IOW, hire great bands, pay a guarantee, promote, please your clients. There is a public that wants to see good original music, just as there is a public that just wants to dance to hits. I can only say this within my peer group and people I know but I think it's a just not as cool to go hear original music anymore... at least not like it was in the 80s and early 90s. Now there are a ton of DJs who can actually draw better than musicians and in all honesty, its really really tough for an original music venue to draw a crowd who wants to hear new music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members fanuvbrak Posted February 17, 2010 Members Share Posted February 17, 2010 There's a bar near me that have live cover bands 4 nights a week. This is how they do it: You play a Tuesday for $200. This is essentially you're audition. They have a built in crowd that usually leaves around 11:00. The bar judges you based on this built in crowd. If you drive them out by 10, you are not asked back, or they'll give you another weekday tryout some time in the future. If you keep them until 11:00, then you're okay and they'll get you booked for a Thursday night, that has a built in crowd that leaves around midnight. If you keep them until midnight, you're doing great and will get a Thursday night gig ($400) and a future Saturday ($600). If you get the built in crowd to stay till 1:00 AM or later, you're golden. You'll go straight to Saturday with a future Friday ($600 plus a bar %). The reason Fridays are so desired are they have an acoustic act that is a HUGE draw. This crowd has to be thrown out at closing time, so if you play a Friday and lose that crowd, you aren't asked back. I like the way they do it. They've been around forever, they know they're clientele, and they give new bands a shot. Everybody wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members toneforhire Posted February 17, 2010 Members Share Posted February 17, 2010 All I gotta say is why are there so many negative lawyer and politician jokes and not any bar-owner jokes?? If I had to lump people together based on their jobs and pick the sleaziest low life {censored} bunch, it would definitely be club/bar owners... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Crüsty Posted February 17, 2010 Members Share Posted February 17, 2010 Yea, and I would love to see a government that's more in line with what the founding fathers had in mind, but until every one of our lazy asses make it up off the couch and do something about it, THAT ain't gonna happen either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members newmaxnew Posted February 17, 2010 Members Share Posted February 17, 2010 Yea, and I would love to see a government that's more in line with what the founding fathers had in mind, but until every one of our lazy asses make it up off the couch and do something about it, THAT ain't gonna happen either. If only someone actually knew exactly what they had in mind. No one knows for sure, and if you read what they wrote it is pretty clear that many of them had different ideas. Or do you mean you want to see a government based on what you think they may have had in mind? Max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted February 18, 2010 Members Share Posted February 18, 2010 If only someone actually knew exactly what they had in mind. We do. It's called then Constitution and the Declaration of Independence. Thankfully, they wrote it all down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members paste Posted February 19, 2010 Members Share Posted February 19, 2010 There's a bar near me that have live cover bands 4 nights a week. This is how they do it:You play a Tuesday for $200. This is essentially you're audition. They have a built in crowd that usually leaves around 11:00. The bar judges you based on this built in crowd.If you drive them out by 10, you are not asked back, or they'll give you another weekday tryout some time in the future.If you keep them until 11:00, then you're okay and they'll get you booked for a Thursday night, that has a built in crowd that leaves around midnight.If you keep them until midnight, you're doing great and will get a Thursday night gig ($400) and a future Saturday ($600).If you get the built in crowd to stay till 1:00 AM or later, you're golden. You'll go straight to Saturday with a future Friday ($600 plus a bar %).The reason Fridays are so desired are they have an acoustic act that is a HUGE draw. This crowd has to be thrown out at closing time, so if you play a Friday and lose that crowd, you aren't asked back.I like the way they do it. They've been around forever, they know they're clientele, and they give new bands a shot. Everybody wins. That is actually a pretty cool way to do it and the Tuesday night pay isn't that much lower than what some of the Clintonville area clubs pay for a weekend. Which club is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members toneforhire Posted February 19, 2010 Members Share Posted February 19, 2010 We do. It's called then Constitution and the Declaration of Independence. Thankfully, they wrote it all down. glory glory allelujah, glory glory allelujah, glory glory allelujah...the poor fight and die for the rich...applauds...our fore fathers had some good idears but they were aristocrats who needed a {censored} load of peasants and farmers to continue to fight the British, possibly the French, and any other empire keen on taking control of the newly free America...the constitution represented the freedom and liberty these people were supposed to be willing to fight and die for... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MusicalSchizo Posted February 19, 2010 Members Share Posted February 19, 2010 We do. It's called then Constitution and the Declaration of Independence. Thankfully, they wrote it all down. And words never change their meaning, and are never open for interpretation, which is why there's universal agreement on what those documents say. Oh, and only one sect of Christianity. Oh, wait... Brian V. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members newmaxnew Posted February 19, 2010 Members Share Posted February 19, 2010 We do. It's called then Constitution and the Declaration of Independence. Thankfully, they wrote it all down. I think if it was all that straight forward we would not have so much disagreement over what was intended by the right to bear arms and other issues that seem to be debated over and over. Max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dancebass Posted February 19, 2010 Members Share Posted February 19, 2010 I think if it was all that straight forward we would not have so much disagreement over what was intended by the right to bear arms and other issues that seem to be debated over and over.Max Actually it is that straight forward. We have arguments over it because some people think they know better than men who just risked their lives and faced public hanging in order to free themselves from the most powerful empire on the face of the Earth. Those people are fools who never risked anything for anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members vanlatte Posted February 19, 2010 Members Share Posted February 19, 2010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MusicalSchizo Posted February 19, 2010 Members Share Posted February 19, 2010 Actually it is that straight forward. No it isn't. You couldn't possibly be more wrong. Every interpretation of words is filtered through the person who reads it, therefore the only interpretation that is truly valid is that of the people who wrote the words, and if those people are dead, we can only truly guess what they meant based on what else they said at the time, and what the common usage/meanings of the words they used were at the time. That's just reality, unfortunately. We have arguments over it because some people think they know better than men who just risked their lives and faced public hanging in order to free themselves from the most powerful empire on the face of the Earth.Those people are fools who never risked anything for anyone. Really? EVERYONE who has a dispute about what something in those documents mean and dares to say, "I think it means this" is a person who never risked anything for anyone? That's pretty {censored}ed up logic, my friend.Brian V. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MusicalSchizo Posted February 19, 2010 Members Share Posted February 19, 2010 One more thing: The Declaration of Independence has no real bearing on our system of law, except in spirit. It was a specific missive directed at our former government declaring our independence. Nothing in it establishes any sort of "rules" for the way our government functions, and it was not even considered during the deliberations that gave rise to our Constitution. Look it up. Just saying...Brian V. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members boxorox Posted February 21, 2010 Members Share Posted February 21, 2010 No offense, but you could think about continuing the off topic discussion down in the political forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted February 21, 2010 Members Share Posted February 21, 2010 : The Declaration of Independence has no real bearing on our system of law, except in spirit. This statement was beyond radical at the time, and could have gotten them killed fr writing it: We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. The prevailing seniment at the time was the Divine Right of Kings, who it was believed were agents of God and who were placed on earth to make law. This is why going agains the Crown was taken so seriously. The idea of rights being innate and from God himself without a human agent was a completely unique one. It is what the constitution and all of our laws are supposed to be based on. That gives one a pretty good start in determining what they had in mind. Is our understanding perfect? No. But could we read the founders and get anywhere from their writings or the constitution itself that the federal government should have all power to run everything? Not in a million years, no matter how you interpret it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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