Arrggh! Another crappy mix at a high$$$ concert

[Bobby1Note]

 

My first ass raping for bad sound (considering ticket pricing, $60 in 1991 for cheapies) was the Rolling Stones. I've never heard anything so hilariously bad in my life. Badly calibrated delay stacks (every note 4 times), hell I didn't even recognize Satisfaction. A few years later I saw Pink Floyd in pretty much the same seat. It was religious.

 

 

I was there for the Stones' Steel Wheels Tour concerts. All 3 shows, at the Big "Owe".(Montreals' Olympic Stadium) That sound was indeed pretty horrid, especially if you got up in the rafters, just horrible. At one point, I was dead center, maybe 20 rows back, and the sound there was fantastic.

 

Do you remember who opened for the Stones? It was Vernon Ried's "In Living Colour". When I first walked into that cavernous stadium, In Living Colour was already playing, but they were on a small stage, and you really couldn't hear them at all. Then, when the Stones came out, it was like someone had thrown a switch on a nuclear reactor. Huuuuuuge stage, and devastating sound. Visually, it was stunning to say the least.

 

If I remember correctly, they used something like 30 semi-trailers to haul their gear from show to show, and they actually had two sets of equipment, each with 30 semi-trailers. They would leap-frog each other to the next couple of towns. Awesome show.

[Unalaska]

I remember EV had some monstrous rig they were promoting on tour with the stones. I think it was the MTH4/MTL4 rig or the earliest of XArray, can't remember though.

[IsildursBane]

 

Do you remember who opened for the Stones? It was Vernon Ried's "In Living Colour". When I first walked into that cavernous stadium, In Living Colour was already playing, but they were on a small stage, and you really couldn't hear them at all. Then, when the Stones came out, it was like someone had thrown a switch on a nuclear reactor. Huuuuuuge stage, and devastating sound. Visually, it was stunning to say the least.

 

 

At the last AES, I was at a semi-private party hosted by API, where they had Dave Natale (FOH Rolling Stones) mixing for Sonny Landreth and Bob Weir. (Sonny Landreth is the f'in man, btw) The first set was loud, but enjoyable and great sounding (if a bit on the bright side). The intermission was really long, so by the time the 2nd set rolled around, the place had emptied out quite a bit. When Sonny came back out, there were only 1-200 of us left, but the volume went WAY up. It was punishing. We were all looking at each other wondering, "WTF?"

 

-Dan.

[jwlussow]

I saw Mayer in Chicago 2 years ago and he had a Venue system that sounded incredible.

[karlw]

 

At the last AES, I was at a semi-private party hosted by API, where they had Dave Natale (FOH Rolling Stones) mixing for Sonny Landreth and Bob Weir. (Sonny Landreth is the f'in man, btw) The first set was loud, but enjoyable and great sounding (if a bit on the bright side). The intermission was really long, so by the time the 2nd set rolled around, the place had emptied out quite a bit. When Sonny came back out, there were only 1-200 of us left, but the volume went WAY up. It was punishing. We were all looking at each other wondering, "WTF?" -Dan.

 

 

I was at that party, too. Thought the same thing.

 

The whole bad sound/too loud/crappy mix thing has been a pet peeve of mine for many many years and I've even written articles about it or mentioned it in some of my pieces in Live Sound magazine.

 

I really think it mostly comes down to the operators, because the equipment is usually not the problem. How the equipment is spec'd, set up and run is the problem. Too many people out there running this stuff that A) don't know how to mix and B) can't hear the difference.

 

http://www.prosoundweb.com/article/seven_things_you_should_never_do_while_mixing/

 

http://www.prosoundweb.com/article/steps_you_can_take_to_improve_your_mix_right_now/

 

http://www.prosoundweb.com/article/top_10_reasons_for_bad_sound_and_what_you_can_do_about_it/

[RoadRanger]

IME the typical small club band that hires sound does so because they want to be stoopid loud "rock stars". They expect to be able to wander off a stage running 115dba+ and hear the same sound level out front. Their ears are so compressed from the stage volume (plus whatever permanent hearing loss they have) that a lesser level sounds "muffled" to them. The audience members that advise them are usually other "rock stars" or groupies that hang out at their stoopid loud practices and have seriously impaired hearing themselves.

 

So, the soundguys that work enough to "move up" are the ones that cater to that.

 

The stoopid "hot sub" sound comes from the typical car stereo these days - the younger crowd listens to music that way and expects it in the clubs.

[Rezrover]

 

The stoopid "hot sub" sound comes from the typical car stereo these days - the younger crowd listens to music that way and expects it in the clubs.

 

 

I've always noticed that the guys that want that sound are pushing their subs way too hard and what they think sounds good just sounds terrible.

[RoadRanger]

I've always noticed that the guys that want that sound are pushing their subs way too hard and what they think sounds good just sounds terrible.

Not always. I know a young guy with 8 lab subs and I don't think you could ever push them too hard even in a largish club and live to tell about it . I think he did 2500 with HipHop one time and was kinda gettin' towards the building's structural limits . But yah, them guys running a bridged 2450 (or more) into a pair of 1x18 300w Yammie Clubs/PV118's/Carvin's are gonna sound like arse .

[Rezrover]

In a car?

[IsildursBane]

 

IME the typical small club band that hires sound does so because they want to be stoopid loud "rock stars". They expect to be able to wander off a stage running 115dba+ and hear the same sound level out front. Their ears are so compressed from the stage volume (plus whatever permanent hearing loss they have) that a lesser level sounds "muffled" to them. The audience members that advise them are usually other "rock stars" or groupies that hang out at their stoopid loud practices and have seriously impaired hearing themselves.

 

 

I don't know if you can just blame the bands - there's plenty of blame to go around. I've been in plenty of bars that are perfectly enjoyable around 4-6pm, but once the evening crowd starts pouring in, the staff just starts turning up the music to unbearable levels. No band, no dj, no focus on or advertisement of the music whatsoever - just the bartender's ipod being used as background "ambiance" and ratcheted up as loud as it'll go. I don't know why people tolerate this, much less enjoy/prefer it.

 

-Dan.

[RoadRanger]

I don't know if you can just blame the bands - there's plenty of blame to go around. I've been in plenty of bars that are perfectly enjoyable around 4-6pm, but once the evening crowd starts pouring in, the staff just starts turning up the music to unbearable levels. No band, no dj, no focus on or advertisement of the music whatsoever - just the bartender's ipod being used as background "ambiance" and ratcheted up as loud as it'll go. I don't know why people tolerate this, much less enjoy/prefer it.

Yah, it's a mystery for sure. I finished up at a bar a while back and the staff put the juke box back on and cranked it up louder than the band had been - and this 20 minutes before closing when you'd think they'd be trying to get people out of there. Maybe that was their way of flushing the place. I had to load out with earplugs in . The owner - who had hired the band and me specifically because most bands drive his customers away with being too loud - had left a couple hours earlier.