Members Visconti Posted January 3, 2011 Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 Is the Allen & Heath worth an extra $400 dollars? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hibbasc1 Posted January 3, 2011 Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 I just ordered the Soundcraft a little while ago for my smallest rig and I love it. It does everything I need it to do, and has a nice (very clean) sound to it. A definite step up in sound quality over many mixers I've heard or used in this price range. I bought it because it has sub groups, nice internal FX and 2 pre aux mixes - which exactly met what I needed. The biggest advantage the A&H has is 6 auxes - if you need them, well then there's no decision to be made really. In my case 2 was enough for the particular application. When I need more, I have a GL2400. ScottH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BenBroChill Posted January 3, 2011 Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 Yes. And here is why-more aux sends-more preamps-better eq section-better fx selection That's just a few things that really jump out at me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members popgadget Posted January 3, 2011 Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 It depends how many mic pres and axes you need (now and in the reasonable future). This is not as important if you already have a more capable board for jobs that require it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bobby1Note Posted January 3, 2011 Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 The MixWiz also has 16 direct outs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Visconti Posted January 3, 2011 Author Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 Which one of these mixers would be just what is needed for a band with 2 members? A guitar player that sings and plays keyboards and a drummer that sings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bobby1Note Posted January 3, 2011 Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 Do you want to record your performances? Do you want to edit the recordings on individual tracks? If not the latter, go with the Soundcraft. Frankly, I believe the MFX8i would be more than adequate for your needs, UNLESS, you're using an elaborate drum-mic set-up. Drum-mics can quickly eat up 6-10 channels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members heath_eld Posted January 3, 2011 Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 mixwiz would theoretically sound better. But unless you've got relatively high end tops i suspect you would simply not notice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted January 3, 2011 CMS Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 You're comparing a 12-channel mixer with a 16-channel mixer. That's what stands out first. The Mixwizard is a known quantity that's been on the market for years and has a proven track record, the Soundcraft is new and relatively unproven. I never assume that a reputable brand's new products are as good as their older, when the stuff is made in China. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted January 3, 2011 Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 I wouldn't expect any meaningful sound quality difference between the two products. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Audioeast Posted January 3, 2011 Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 In my opinion if you dont need much frequency manipulation and have no need for input pads or 6 aux sends - then the MFX will do you fine, but the clear benifits of the mix wiz are a better EQ and having pads on the channels. I also am not a big fan of global phantom power as input will make loud pops when being plugged in (or out) if the channel is not muted. The Mix Wiz has individual phantoms. All in all the mixwiz is a better mixer but its more money and maybe more than you need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bobby1Note Posted January 3, 2011 Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 the Soundcraft is new and relatively unproven. I dunno CraigV, the Soundcraft MFXi series seems like an evolution of the EFX series, which has been around for a good number of years now. I'm too lazy to look, but it seems to me that they took the EFX, and added HPF's on all mic channels, added an illuminated "mute" switch, and a second aux-send. The MFXi series apparently has a lower noise-floor, and two sub-groups have been added. There might be more. Edit; OK, I just took a closer look, and the MFXi series also added a level control on stereo return, and level control on both aux-sends. Also, the main output LED's are accompanied by a separate set of Solo LED's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Reson8tor Posted January 3, 2011 Members Share Posted January 3, 2011 Which one of these mixers would be just what is needed for a band with 2 members? A guitar player that sings and plays keyboards and a drummer that sings? I would think the MFXi8 would be better than the 12 chan version, unless you have a lot of drum mics? Between that and the MixWiz, it's really down to how many AUX channels you need, any plans for future expansion, and how much kit you want to drag around. We use the MFXi8 for our Celtic trio, which sometimes expands to a 4 or 5-piece group with guest players. That's 5 instrument mics and 2 vocal mics. I thought about getting a MixWiz when putting together our current compact PA, but I wanted to keep the focus on "compact" with this system. The MixWiz is large and heavy enough that I'd want it rack-mounted. The MFXi8 is small and lightweight enough that it travels instead in a padded gig bag, and I just place it on top of our small 4-space processing and wireless rack. I also like having the mic inputs and insert jacks on the top panel, instead of reaching around to the rear like the MixWiz requires. I see the MixWiz as being more practical for larger setups, where it can live in a rack and be pre-patched to gear in rack spaces below the mixer. For the type of "combat audio" that we do, where fast setup and keeping things small and lightweight is important, the MFXi8 is just a better solution for now. YMMV, because every band is different. One final consideration for me, was that if I get something the size of a MixWiz, I'd probably want to be looking at a compact digital board like a StudioLive 16 or Yamaha O1V96 instead. That will be the next step for us, once we really need the capability (and can justify the cost). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted January 4, 2011 CMS Author Share Posted January 4, 2011 I dunno CraigV, the Soundcraft MFXi series seems like an evolution of the EFX series, which has been around for a good number of years now. I'm too lazy to look, but it seems to me that they took the EFX, and added HPF's on all mic channels, added an illuminated "mute" switch, and a second aux-send. The MFXi series apparently has a lower noise-floor, and two sub-groups have been added. There might be more.Edit; OK, I just took a closer look, and the MFXi series also added a level control on stereo return, and level control on both aux-sends. Also, the main output LED's are accompanied by a separate set of Solo LED's I just figured that a different control layout means a different circuit board underneath, and that makes it "new" in terms of manufacturing. The most common failure in mixers seems to be interconnections among the various circuit boards, and if this is different, I'd rather take a wait-and-see stance than be the beta-tester. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted January 4, 2011 Members Share Posted January 4, 2011 I just figured that a different control layout means a different circuit board underneath, and that makes it "new" in terms of manufacturing. The most common failure in mixers seems to be interconnections among the various circuit boards, and if this is different, I'd rather take a wait-and-see stance than be the beta-tester. ... and possibly a new contract vendor/manufacturer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bobby1Note Posted January 4, 2011 Members Share Posted January 4, 2011 That's a lot of negative speculation, considering such a well-established manufacturer, with a very long track record for quality products and support. Plus, the MFXi series has been around for quite a while now, and I'm not seeing any issues reported anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted January 4, 2011 Members Share Posted January 4, 2011 That's a lot of negative speculation, considering such a well-established manufacturer, with a very long track record for quality products and support. Plus, the MFXi series has been around for quite a while now, and I'm not seeing any issues reported anywhere. Every manufacturer is (or should be) concerned about a new (or even revised) product release... if they are not, they are too cavalier in their attitiude IMO. That attitude WILL come back to bite them, it always does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bobby1Note Posted January 4, 2011 Members Share Posted January 4, 2011 Every manufacturer is (or should be) concerned about a new (or even revised) product release... if they are not, they are too cavalier in their attitiude IMO. That attitude WILL come back to bite them, it always does. Why would you say they are being cavalier? The product has been around for quite a while now, and everybody I've seen who've reviewed them, seems to really like these boards. I've not seen any negative comments whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Reson8tor Posted January 4, 2011 Members Share Posted January 4, 2011 ... and possibly a new contract vendor/manufacturer. Why would a company like Soundcraft constantly change subcontractors? Or if they did that, why would the default assumption be a lack of quality control? FWIW, we upgraded to our MFXi8 from an EFX8, and it seems to have the same construction quality and general "feel" as the earlier one. Nothing to hang any proof on, regarding whatever subcontractors they're using in China... just an observation. I think of companies like Soundcraft and Allen & Heath as the "good guys" for gear at this price point, when we're trying to avoid the bottom of the barrel stuff. I don't see any reason to knock their current production, unless we actually do get a history of failures. Our MFXi8 has been going strong for the last 8 months or so, since I bought it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted January 4, 2011 CMS Author Share Posted January 4, 2011 Guys, hang on a sec. It's not "negative speculation". I was responding to a question comparing two specific mixers. In any case where a product is new, I'm going to take a wait and see stance. That's not speculation, it's caution. Once bitten, twice shy, and all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bobby1Note Posted January 4, 2011 Members Share Posted January 4, 2011 Guys, hang on a sec.It's not "negative speculation". I was responding to a question comparing two specific mixers. In any case where a product is new, I'm going to take a wait and see stance. That's not speculation, it's caution. Once bitten, twice shy, and all that. I agree that in general, this is a good strategy. Actually, I tend to use the same approach. Problem I see here though, is that the MFXi series is not that new, They've been around for well over a year I believe(going on two??), and the predecessor EFX series has been around for much longer than that. I bought my EFX-8 at roughly the same time I bought my MixWiz,,, and that's probably three years ago. From what I gathered back then, the EFX series had also been around for a good while. Obviously, the MixWiz is a much more elaborate board in terms of i/o capability and control, (different league actually) but that lil' EFX-8 doesn't give up much in terms of sound-quality and overall musicality. I continue to be impressed with the performance of this little board. As I recall, it cost something like $349. back then, and it certainly has exceeded my expectations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted January 4, 2011 Members Share Posted January 4, 2011 Why? Because any time any product is changed, upgraded, modified or massaged, there exists many opportunities for errors and mistakes to creep into the build. I didn't knock their production, I mentioned some ofthe possible problems that can occur during any model change or update. Vendors change, suppliers change, countries of manufacture change (not saying the did change, just that they can change). This is the way manufacturing works period. It's up to the company to do everything possible to insure seamless continuity, proper build quality and intense followup to insure that the product is built as intended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted January 4, 2011 CMS Author Share Posted January 4, 2011 I agree that in general, this is a good strategy. Actually, I tend to use the same approach. Problem I see here though, is that the MFXi series is not that new, They've been around for well over a year I believe(going on two??), and the predecessor EFX series has been around for much longer than that. I bought my EFX-8 at roughly the same time I bought my MixWiz,,, and that's probably three years ago. From what I gathered back then, the EFX series had also been around for a good while.Obviously, the MixWiz is a much more elaborate board in terms of i/o capability and control, (different league actually) but that lil' EFX-8 doesn't give up much in terms of sound-quality and overall musicality. I continue to be impressed with the performance of this little board. As I recall, it cost something like $349. back then, and it certainly has exceeded my expectations. I'd rather not go circular in this discussion; the MFXi is not the same mixer as the EFX. My comparison was the MFXi being on the market a year or two vs. 5+ years for the MW3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Reson8tor Posted January 4, 2011 Members Share Posted January 4, 2011 Vendors change, suppliers change, countries of manufacture change (not saying the did change, just that they can change). This is the way manufacturing works period. It's up to the company to do everything possible to insure seamless continuity, proper build quality and intense followup to insure that the product is built as intended. Okay, sure... but the same vendor changes can happen under the hood, during the production life of a single product, and be essentially invisible to anyone but a repair tech. Someone would have to look closely at the "made in Italy" label on my old Mackie SRM450's to know they weren't the same 450's being sold at the end of that product's run. At the end of the day, I think it's reasonable to look at the overall history of a company, and how reliable their output has been over time.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted January 4, 2011 CMS Author Share Posted January 4, 2011 Okay, sure... but the same vendor changes can happen under the hood, during the production life of a single product, and be essentially invisible to anyone but a repair tech. Someone would have to look closely at the "made in Italy" label on my old Mackie SRM450's to know they weren't the same 450's being sold at the end of that product's run. At the end of the day, I think it's reasonable to look at the overall history of a company, and how reliable their output has been over time.. The fact that a change *might* occur during production doesn't diminish the possibility that an entirely new product could have problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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