Members Virgman Posted August 15, 2009 Members Share Posted August 15, 2009 Shred. The final frontier. These are the voyages of the...Oops! Got carried away. Ok. In shred you need to marry two techniques. 1) Tremolo picking - rapid, consistent, metronomic alternate picking by right hand2) Legato left handTry this to get an understanding of this concept.On one string only tremolo pick until you can go 16ths at 70-90. Sure you can tremolo pick faster (maybe).Got it?Next, without the right hand play a simple line with your left hand using legato. Use a kind of finger drumming technique like when you drum your fingers on a tabletop.------------------------------------- --10--12--13--12--10--12--13--12--10--etc.----------------------------------------------------------------------------------Maybe you can't do this very fast yet. Not as fast as your tremolo picking. That's ok. Find a speed you can do it comfortably.Once you've got that down, marry your right hand tremolo picking to the finger drumming simple line. You may have to slow down your tremolo hand. But just let that right hand tremolo pick like a machine.Got it? Hmm...do you feel it?Your right hand is tremolo picking away. Your left hand is finger drumming the pattern. Once they sync you are shredding.Now if you can conceptualize that in your head you can see how shredding works.The next step is to get this up to a decent speed like 120bpm quarter note 16ths. This equates to 160bpm triplet 16ths. Syncing the hands!After that you need to learn to do multiple strings. Add another simple line:-----------------------------------------------------------10--12--10--------------------10--12--13-----------------13--12--10--etc.------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------The trick is to have your picking hand picking like a machine. Away it goes.Meanwhile your fretting hand drums away. Low action is helpful so you just have to lightly drum the strings.I hope you get the idea. An analogy would be an escalator. The escalator is the tremolo right hand. It just keeps moving. You sync your body (left hand) when you step onto the escalator. If you don't sync you'll trip or stumble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mosiddiqi Posted August 15, 2009 Members Share Posted August 15, 2009 I always try to walk up the "down" escalator. Maybe that's why I fail at the shred Good stuff. ..but I kind of imagined you had more hair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted August 15, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 15, 2009 Originally Posted by mosiddiqi I always try to walk up the "down" escalator. Maybe that's why I fail at the shred Good stuff. ..but I kind of imagined you had more hair. Don't mock the shred! This is serious stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nuclear arsenal Posted August 15, 2009 Members Share Posted August 15, 2009 i economy pick to a pretty severe degree. does this mean i don't get to call myself a shredder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted August 15, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 15, 2009 Originally Posted by nuclear arsenal i economy pick to a pretty severe degree. does this mean i don't get to call myself a shredder? No problemo. (Spanish...means no problem. I learned Spanish in school.) The only difference is how you change strings. Most shredders use alternate picking however to do this. Remember, shred is only good if it's mind numbing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nuclear arsenal Posted August 15, 2009 Members Share Posted August 15, 2009 oh. i don't know what i do is called, then. i use a lot of hammer-ons and pull-offs and slides. i don't pick every note i play. maybe 2/3rds of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted August 15, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 15, 2009 Originally Posted by nuclear arsenal i don't pick every note i play. That's legato type playing. Nothing wrong with it. Joe Satriani uses legato as does Alan Holdsworth & Eddie Van Halen. They don't pick all their notes. People like Paul Gilbert, Michael Angelo Batio use alternate picking. Frank Gambale is the premier economy picker. Economy picking might require some modification of the note sequences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Alex_DeLarge Posted August 15, 2009 Members Share Posted August 15, 2009 Originally Posted by Virgman No problemo. (Spanish...means no problem. I learned Spanish in school.) That's totally wrong. I speak spanish (I live in Chile). "No hay problema" means no problem. "No problemo" it's kinda funny though, I think of a caveman speaking, like "me want food" or some thing like that. No offense to you of course, but I find it funny when I hear it on TV or in a movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted August 15, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 15, 2009 Originally Posted by Alex_DeLarge That's totally wrong. I speak spanish (I live in Chile). "No hay problema" means no problem. "No problemo" it's kinda funny though, I think of a caveman speaking, like "me want food" or some thing like that. No offense to you of course, but I find it funny when I hear it on TV or in a movie. "No problemo" is the way we speak Spanish in New Jersey. Via condios amigo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nuclear arsenal Posted August 16, 2009 Members Share Posted August 16, 2009 and donde esta el bano to you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members The Burninator Posted August 16, 2009 Members Share Posted August 16, 2009 Vaya con CornholioGood post Virgman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted August 16, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 16, 2009 Si. Bueno.Esta con mia compadres via el guitara.Viva es un el shreddo rapido.Mio el mako thes el espagna uppo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 1001gear Posted August 16, 2009 Members Share Posted August 16, 2009 I'll have a taco and a Pepsi.The shred line leads to less and less music - like car racing. 0 - 350 mph in under 5 seconds if you use 8,000 HP and leave out the turns.So I'll stick with just getting faster at what I'm doing.On a peripheral note, Michael Batio may have justified his work as a guitarist by lending his signature to a very rockin' and affordable overdrive. Look it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SadMachine82 Posted August 16, 2009 Members Share Posted August 16, 2009 Originally Posted by Virgman 1) Tremolo picking - rapid, consistent, metronomic alternate picking by right hand 2) Legato left hand Try this to get an understanding of this concept. [/img] I recently bought Batio's Speed Kills dvd, and a big part of the obstacle he says for shredding (which I'm finding to be true I think....) is when you have an upstroke on a new string. Any advice on that? I think it's difficult as well because your new string will not always be on an upstroke...do you just have to get to a point where you're not even thinking about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted August 16, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 16, 2009 Originally Posted by SadMachine82 you just have to get to a point where you're not even thinking about it? Yes. Just do it a million times. Or maybe two million. -------------------------------------------- ---------------10--12--10------------------ --10--12--13-----------------13--12--10--etc. ------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jasco Posted August 16, 2009 Members Share Posted August 16, 2009 You know Virg, sometimes I worry about you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted August 16, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 16, 2009 Originally Posted by Jasco You know Virg, sometimes I worry about you. Don't mock the shred! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SadMachine82 Posted August 18, 2009 Members Share Posted August 18, 2009 Originally Posted by Virgman Yes. Just do it a million times. Or maybe two million. -------------------------------------------- ---------------10--12--10------------------ --10--12--13-----------------13--12--10--etc. ------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------ I'm sure I'll get there eventually - and I'm playing the batio speed exercises as well and making some up in other scales - anyway can you recommend a good practice regimen? Say at 2hr/day training, as someone just beginning to learn how to shred, should I stick to one tempo for that time? Gradually increase? Call in sick and play guitar all day? It seems that if I warm up at 80bpm 16ths for 10 minutes, I can do 100bpm pretty well to give an idea of where I'm at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted August 18, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 18, 2009 The Batio stuff is good. It's scales. Key of D in the original videos from the late 80's.I think if you just take a scale shape, or a fragment of a scale (as in the previous example) and just beat it to death, be creative, make up variations, you will discover things yourself.Take a rest when you get tired. But here's an example of creativity using the G major scale:----------------------------------------------------------------------7-8------------------------------------------------7-9------------------------------------------------7-7-7------7-9-10---------------------7-7-7-----------9-9-9---------------10------------------10-10-10--------10-10-10-------10-10-10------------------------------------------------------------continued..Gmaj7 arpeggio *-----------------------------------------------------------------8-8-8------------------------------7-7-7--------------------------9-9-9-----------------10-10-10---------------------------------------------------------------more...string skipping *-----------------------------7-7-7-----------8-8-8---------------------------------------------------------------------9-9-9------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------10-10-10--------10-10-10--------10-10-10---cont...------------------------------8-----8---8----8---8----8--------9----7----------------------------------10---9---7-------------------------------------10------------------------Etc. There's nothing magical here.Just get your picking hand hand moving up and down and use a metronome.Go as fast as you can but if you lose control slow down a bit. *Using triplets is good because it makes you use an inside or outside stroke when changing strings which is essential if you alternate pick. You need to be able to play these type of triplet patterns at 160-200 bpm or better, three notes per beat.Batio gives you a specific scale in his video that you can use and move around. You can play music with it.Eddy Gaz has some really good vids on his youtube site:http://www.youtube.com/user/GaryEddyEdwards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SadMachine82 Posted August 18, 2009 Members Share Posted August 18, 2009 Originally Posted by Virgman The Batio stuff is good. It's scales. Key of D in the original videos from the late 80's. I think if you just take a scale shape, or a fragment of a scale (as in the previous example) and just beat it to death, be creative, make up variations, you will discover things yourself. Take a rest when you get tired. But here's an example of creativity using the G major scale: ----------------------------------------------------- -----------------7-8----------------------------------- -------------7-9------------------------------------------------7-7-7- -----7-9-10---------------------7-7-7-----------9-9-9------------- --10------------------10-10-10--------10-10-10-------10-10-10------ ------------------------------------------------------ continued.. Gmaj7 arpeggio * -------------------------------------- ---------------------------8-8-8---------- --------------------7-7-7-------------- ------------9-9-9---------------- -10-10-10-------------------------- ------------------------------------- more... string skipping * -----------------------------7-7-7-----------8-8-8 --------------------------------------------------------- ------------9-9-9-------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------- --10-10-10--------10-10-10--------10-10-10--- cont... ---------------------------- --8-----8---8----8---8----8--- -----9----7-------------------- --------------10---9---7-------- -----------------------------10 ------------------------ Etc. There's nothing magical here. Just get your picking hand hand moving up and down and use a metronome. Go as fast as you can but if you lose control slow down a bit. *Using triplets is good because it makes you use an inside or outside stroke when changing strings which is essential if you alternate pick. You need to be able to play these type of triplet patterns at 160-200 bpm or better, three notes per beat. Batio gives you a specific scale in his video that you can use and move around. You can play music with it. Eddy Gaz has some really good vids on his youtube site: http://www.youtube.com/user/GaryEddyEdwards I'll try this out tonight - and yes, I'm using the first batio dvd speed kills 1 when he introduces himself as "from the band Nitro". Good times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SadMachine82 Posted August 21, 2009 Members Share Posted August 21, 2009 btw...I checked out some Eddy Gaz, and I'll definitely use his vids. But in his tremolo video, he shows his "shred" position with the hand basically making a fist - but then I watched one of batio's vids where he's playing "Hands Without Shadows" and is not really doing the fist (that I can tell) and is going in between shredding and chords with ease. Any advantages over one or the other? Personally, I don't like the fist method because I can't easily go back to chords....thoughts? Comments? Snide remarks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted August 21, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 21, 2009 Originally Posted by SadMachine82 btw...I checked out some Eddy Gaz, and I'll definitely use his vids. But in his tremolo video, he shows his "shred" position with the hand basically making a fist - but then I watched one of batio's vids where he's playing "Hands Without Shadows" and is not really doing the fist (that I can tell) and is going in between shredding and chords with ease. Any advantages over one or the other? Personally, I don't like the fist method because I can't easily go back to chords....thoughts? Comments? Snide remarks? Batio has a totally unique way of picking. It is unique to him. Unorthodox. Eddy is pretty much standard technique. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 1001gear Posted August 21, 2009 Members Share Posted August 21, 2009 Originally Posted by SadMachine82 btw...I checked out some Eddy Gaz, and I'll definitely use his vids. But in his tremolo video, he shows his "shred" position with the hand basically making a fist - but then I watched one of batio's vids where he's playing "Hands Without Shadows" and is not really doing the fist (that I can tell) and is going in between shredding and chords with ease. Any advantages over one or the other? Personally, I don't like the fist method because I can't easily go back to chords....thoughts? Comments? Snide remarks? Uh, well having gotten a look at Buckethead I think that you could just learn to switch where appropriate. Whatever move works right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SadMachine82 Posted August 21, 2009 Members Share Posted August 21, 2009 Word. I dunno...I think the only unique thing about Batio is the way he's pretty much anchoring all of his fingers I think...cuz of the whole "I'm lefthanded playing on righthanded" thing. Definitely unorthodox.... ...will have to watch Buckethead's technique. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted November 12, 2012 Author Members Share Posted November 12, 2012 I can't believe I really wrote all this stuff.I must have written this before I got alzheimers.What's weird is I stumbled upon this thread while searching on Google. It's like I'm part of something bigger than myself. I AM SOMEBODY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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