Members AcidRock23 Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 I am kind of inclined to agree that a fight is a fight and Martial Arts classes are not the same as back alley/ bar room brawling HOWEVER, I also think that the confidence and discipline that one can learn studying any martial art can't hurt and that whatever art you choose to study WILL make you stronger and better able to 'manage' any sort of conflict situation in which you find yourself, if you study it seriously and discipline yourself to make yourself stronger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members joeinkc2 Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 another point i wanna dispute in your post steve is that anyone who fights in the ufc hasnt studied a little, like you said. The ufc is full of world class atheletes, its no longer the day of the barroom brawler. see tank abbot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rocky101 Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by snakum That's only because you haven't seen the guys who train in 'Gracie' styles or their off-shoots. They don't train like Saturday morning sport judo clubs. They train to hurt folks, and they can. Fighting Germans in bars in Kitzengen and Schweinfurt when I was in the military, I learned most of them weren't big on really going at it and would quit pretty quickly. I was wondering how in the hell THESE people started a World War. They just didn't have the stomach for it. But every now and then you'd get a pro boxer or a JiuJitsu guy who'd clean your clock, and talking to the JJ guys afterward, every single one that could really duke it was a BJJ guy. They train balls out, and they know how to definitely {censored} you up. Trust me ... I learned that one the hard way, too. Watch any of the older UFC videos for the BJJ guys to see what I mean. There are videos of Royce and his brothers tapping out all sorts of brawlers and Karate guys within two or three minutes, including one brave fool who wouldn't tap out and got his wrist broken on camera. Made ME hurt just watching it. These guys can fight. This ain't your father's judo club. Of course ...nothing can compare to ... "Rex Quan Do!" That is my point. UFC is a sport, not the street. To me it is about survival. UFC fighters train for the ring. In the ring there is a referee, they train for months for a fight that they already know where it happens and when it happens. They know that it will be against one opponent with no weapons involved. This teaches a very bad habit of not being aware of your surroundings. You can grapple all you want it does work sometimes. But what are you going to do when your fighting with someone and his three buddies are kicking your head and ribs while you have him in some fancy hold. Do you think the women who bit half a guys face off, who was trying to rape her, used some fancy double leg takedown or triangle choke. More untrained people have survived than trained people. Like I said before it is the fighter not the training or the style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members presa_tito Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by joeinkc2 another point i wanna dispute in your post steve is that anyone who fights in the ufc hasnt studied a little, like you said. The ufc is full of world class atheletes, its no longer the day of the barroom brawler. see tank abbot. tons of MMA guys have been in the olympics, held K1 belts, Abu Dhabi champs etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rushtallica Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by joeinkc2 steve- no disrespect, but i call bull{censored} on your post. name your friend that fights in the ufc. I don't know that Steve would lie, but it's also possible the guy either has fought and not won in the UFC or that the guy trained where Steve did but then went on to train at other places. I agree that if some people were that bad that some of them would likely try and make money and get some popularity by doing it in the UFC and other related contests. I've seen some that've come in saying they trained in tae kwon do or kung fu but didn't fight that way at all, instead relying on jiu-jitsu or some other form of wrestling/grappling, boxing, leg-kicks such as used in tai boxing, and the occasional backfist or rare axe-kick such as used in tae kwon do. Still, it's possible for the guy to have been caught off guard in class by a punch or kick that did some damage. One of my kung fu instructors was a hardcore previous navy Seal, and I caught him with a surprise strike or grapple a couple times out of all the time I trained under him; but he STILL was able to easily recover quickly and find a way to turn things around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nickname009 Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Haven't you seen bruce lee interviews? The best form is NO form to be formless and shapeless like water is the best form there is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members presa_tito Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by Rocky101 That is my point. UFC is a sport, not the street. To me it is about survival. UFC fighters train for the ring. In the ring there is a referee, they train for months for a fight that they already know where it happens and when it happens. They know that it will be against one opponent with no weapons involved. This teaches a very bad habit of not being aware of your surroundings. You can grapple all you want it does work sometimes. But what are you going to do when your fighting with someone and his three buddies are kicking your head and ribs while you have him in some fancy hold. Do you think the women who bit half a guys face off, who was trying to rape her, used some fancy double leg takedown or triangle choke. More untrained people have survived than trained people. Like I said before it is the fighter not the training or the style. I didn't know there was a survey done on untrained vs. trained people who have survived in streetfights. Obviously an MMA fighter would be better than your average Joe and it's stupid not to think so. Most fights aren't to the death getting your face bit off. In that situation anything goes and it's a fight to survive. People are only human and it's not like a good MMA guy can take a vast number of guys on the street at once, unless your name is Fedor. They would sure as hell have a better chance than someone else though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rushtallica Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by nickname009 Haven't you seen bruce lee interviews? The best form is NO form to be formless and shapeless like water is the best form there is! Yeah; I'd simply throw a sack of diarreah at my foe and then possibly some paper towels in the hopes that it would be forgiven to some degree later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members joeinkc2 Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 did you see fedor fight last night? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members presa_tito Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by joeinkc2 did you see fedor fight last night? It was a lame waste of a good fight that could have been. The outcome was just as I expected, Fedor by mauling. It was stopped at 28 seconds about. The Japanese like to see huge freakshows fight sometimes, like Zulu vs. Fedor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members joeinkc2 Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 yeah, thats what i hate about pride, hey st pierre is lookin aweful good, hope he dismantles bj. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members joeinkc2 Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 howd you feel about arona and silva? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rocky101 Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by presa_tito Most fights aren't to the death getting your face bit off. If you have that mentality going into a streetfight your already in trouble. Any fight is to the death, one punch can kill. Now if it against a drunk friend or relative, Rex Quon Do will be enough. Seriously though one of the instructors I used to work with had some wannabe MMA fighters come in. Long story short the MMA guy did a take down on my instructor. The instructor bit his chest around the nipple area, the MMA guy jumped off grabbed his chest and said "You can't do that in a fight". We both laughed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members joeinkc2 Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 now tell the part about your friend getting soccer kicked and head stomped... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Trashburg Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by snakum "Southern" Kung Fu is a baseball bat, a beer bottle, or a tire tool. Who you try'n to kid, yankee? No ... because we don't want the boy to git seriously kilt in a real fight. In the beginning i thought he said he was looking to improve his balance, i wasnt sutgesting it for anything else than learning the form.-R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kenny Powers Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by snakum Watch any of the older UFC videos for the BJJ guys to see what I mean. There are videos of Royce and his brothers tapping out all sorts of brawlers and Karate guys within two or three minutes, including one brave fool who wouldn't tap out and got his wrist broken on camera. Made ME hurt just watching it. These guys can fight. I used to be such a huge gracie family fan, until I saw them start gettin their asses handed to them. now you only see them really doing demos there is no one style that will reign supreme, its a combo of lots of styles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members presa_tito Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by joeinkc2 howd you feel about arona and silva? I thought Arona should have won the rematch they had. It was super close. Arona controlled more, however, didn't really show the will to end the fight. Although Silva didn't get anything off, he was pressing a lot. Silva won a split dec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members snakum Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 In the beginning i thought he said he was looking to improve his balance, i wasnt sutgesting it for anything else than learning the form. I know ... I'm just being a smartass. there is no one style that will reign supreme, its a combo of lots of styles. Bull{censored}! Rex Quan Do RULES the Octogon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members joeinkc2 Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 i thought silva won personally, gomis fight was good, overall kind of a boring show. did you hear about heath herrings fight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members prometheus Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 i have been involved in martial arts for many yrs. there is no superior style only superior individuals. each style has its good and bad. having said that i have never "committed" to one style i have taken a number of different styles and took what i wanted from them. as far as dit dar jow i have used it for many yrs but you cant get true dit dar jow anymore as some of the ingredients are ilegal in the U.S. as was mentioned earlier i know Mr.Fong he has been living in Tucson Arizona for many yrs.although i havent been by to see him and Mrs.Fong for about 10 yrs, and that is where i used to get my linament dit dar jow is also used in iron palm and golden bell training. he is not a fan of mma when in his class you use what he has taught you only. i have tried some northern kung fu quite interesting i really like the stances great for leg and tendon training but not very practical for real world applications IMO. i would suggest you try Kempo. great real world training with some traditional flavor. i would also suggest some Chin-na great joint locks. also Ha Rang Do is a very good style. go visit some classes and find one that suits you. just go with your gut find a teacher that you like. but beware of shiesters there are far too many in the martial arts world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Caulk Rocket Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by nvcreations I used to be such a huge gracie family fan, until I saw them start gettin their asses handed to them. now you only see them really doing demosthere is no one style that will reign supreme, its a combo of lots of styles. Sakuraba messed them up really bad. He rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members presa_tito Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by joeinkc2 i thought silva won personally, gomis fight was good, overall kind of a boring show. did you hear about heath herrings fight? Gomi is the man. Here's Heath's kiss of death.http://www.youtube.com/w/Never-kiss-the-guy-durning-a-stare-down?v=v-cbSiD66CY&feature=Views&page=1&t=t&f=b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SteveVHT Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by snakum "Southern" Kung Fu is a baseball bat, a beer bottle, or a tire tool. Who you try'n to kid, yankee? LOL...Thanks for the laugh....I needed that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SteveVHT Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by presa_tito I don't want to get into a flamewar, I totally disagree. Wiping the floor with the best half dozen UFC fighters in under one min. Sure. If lots of traditional martial artists could do that then a lot would try. The excuse that they have too much pride or whatever doesn't count in my books. There's way too much mysticism around a lot of styles. When it comes down to it, a fight is a fight. The tougher, better athlete, with more skills is going to win. The UFC does bring the odd {censored} fighter in, but the top dozen in under 1 min. Give me a break. A 110 lb. fighter would get slammed so hard on his dome right of the bat. No flaming being thrown...I've seen it done a few times in demonstrations.It's not about pride or anything like that.There is a big difference between training to fight in a ring and training from birth to kill. Over 90% of real Shao Lin technique is simply deadly...So there is no use even getting into that.One example that I personally witnessed was Grandmaster Grey being confronted by a MMA/UFC fighter at a seminar to prove his "mystical" death touches...Needless to say, the fighter was immediately dropped like a bag of potatoes. After getting back from the hospital, it was shown that there was severe bruising in the shape of a hand on the mans lung with no external bruising. If I didn't see it, I wouldn't beleive it...As for the 110lb fighter...I know a few small Chinese girls that will seriously change your mind...Ask Royce Gracie...Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SteveVHT Posted January 3, 2006 Members Share Posted January 3, 2006 Originally posted by joeinkc2 steve- no disrespect, but i call bull{censored} on your post. name your friend that fights in the ufc. I went to HS with him and trained with him...Phil Baroni Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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