How much compromising are you willing to do?

[Zachman]

I have seen so many,

[Zachman]

Originally posted by Zachman I have seen so many,

[Tonemeister87]

I agree that no one amp will do everything perfectly.

[phyrexia]

Sometimes we concentrate too much on what's coming out of an amp, instead of what's going into it.

I do agree with you on the core tone type of thing. Some artists have transcended this though. (I guess most of them end up relying on a pedal for their 'sound').

What do you mean

everything is a spin-off toward a focused specialty.

?

[Zachman]

Originally posted by phyrexia Sometimes we concentrate too much on what's coming out of an amp, instead of what's going into it. I do agree with you on the core tone type of thing. Some artists have transcended this though. (I guess most of them end up relying on a pedal for their 'sound'). What do you mean ?

 

 

I figure, some guys are going for a type of tone or a particular artist's tone, as opposed to discovering what is "their tone" as the basis for their search of the perfect gear.

[danjovi]

for a while I thought I was gonna go insane tryin to find the "perfect" tone and what not.

through my tone search i realized the majority of my favorite tones were all Marshall'ized =] So I went with an amp that had those Marshall type of qualities but its own voicing too

Now that i've got 2 amps that deliver the "Core" tone of what I was looking for. I can dial it in to suit my playing style and what not.

I use some of my favorite artists tones as influence as to how I want my tone to be but at the end of the day I tweak around it after getting a tone close to my favs.

NOW.. as far as im concerned im done with amps and speaker choices ect... There might be TINY things i change up.. maybe cables.. Additional 4x12.. MAYBE PU's

I'm going to let my fingers and writting do the rest of the work cause ultimately the player is gonna "bring the tone" too =]

*i also TRULY believe tone is in the fingers cause i notice i always have a certain sound regardless of the amp with some differences *cause of the amp voicing


*hey zach are you using the framptone amp switcher? you recommended it to me

[Zachman]

Originally posted by danjovi for a while I thought I was gonna go insane tryin to find the "perfect" tone and what not. through my tone search i realized the majority of my favorite tones were all Marshall'ized =] So I went with an amp that had those Marshall type of qualities but its own voicing too Now that i've got 2 amps that deliver the "Core" tone of what I was looking for. I can dial it in to suit my playing style and what not. I use some of my favorite artists tones as influence as to how I want my tone to be but at the end of the day I tweak around it after getting a tone close to my favs. NOW.. as far as im concerned im done with amps and speaker choices ect... There might be TINY things i change up.. maybe cables.. Additional 4x12.. MAYBE PU's I'm going to let my fingers and writting do the rest of the work cause ultimately the player is gonna "bring the tone" too =] *i also TRULY believe tone is in the fingers cause i notice i always have a certain sound regardless of the amp with some differences *cause of the amp voicing *hey zach are you using the framptone amp switcher? you recommended it to me

 

 

Not using the Framptone switcher. I am using a Custom Audio Electronics (4) Amp Switcher. I have used the Framptone switcher before on Vic Masons Rig with the Peacemaker, and it did work well and switch quietly though.

[LaXu]

I've tried what you refer to as the "core tones" and while I like them all for different reasons, I can't get what I want from any of them. I really like the Marshall tone except for two things - they don't sound good at lower volumes and they have a high end sizzle I hate. It's the same thing with the other "core tones" - I like something but it's either how the amps work or something in the tone that bugs me and can't be dialed out.

Hence my quest into the boutique world. Had an amp that did the low volume thing great (thanks to Power Scaling) but had the high end sizzle and didn't have a fast enough response for what I play (hard rock/old school metal). The absurdly expensive Mad Professor amp I tried some time ago actually had what I consider the perfect rock crunch but I couldn't use that same tone for leads..and thank God for that or I'd be saving for one for ages.

The Mesa Lone Star Classic combo I tried was very close to what I think of as my ideal tone. However I felt that amp had a bit too much bottom end and not enough high end on tap and I couldn't seem to dial the boomy bottom out and some more high end in. The control panel layout kinda sucked too (too small miniswitches, reverb controls in the back). I would've been able to live with that though and came very close to buying one. People on this forum (who are mostly now on RigTalk though...) persuaded me to go for the Diezel Einstein combo instead. It ended up cheaper than the Mesa too so that's nice. I should be getting it next week and I truly hope it's what I've been looking for. If not, I may have to pay the seriously inflated European Mesa prices and get the LSC.

I'm not really looking to emulate any specific guitarist's tone (of course I do have my influences whose tones I love) and I'm not looking for the best vintage Fender cleans or something like that. Usually I can get along well with most clean tones and get a good lead tone (distorted or not) from about any amp but it's the distorted rhythm that causes me the most trouble.

[LaXu]

Double post. Damn this forum software to hell!

[-todgemistro-]

Like "danjovi" I also realised my favourite tones were all Marshall-y. So I got myself a Laney GH50L head which has the Marshall-vibe but still its own kinda voicing. I use this for playing almost everything now, rolling down the guitars volume gives a passable gritty clean (not as nice as my Fender though, but this is a rock amp!), volume all the way up gives my main rock rhythm tone, and I boost it with an overdrive for lead or playing metal!

I will be using an A/B switch for going between the Fender and Laney, using Fender for "proper" cleans, and the Laney for anything above clean. When gigging/going to band practise I'll take just the Laney as I use an overdriven sound much more than a clean sound and dont fancy lugging around 2 amps. So I guess my compromise is a perfectly clear clean tone, I find that rolling down the volume is "good enough"

[Loghead]

The compromise I make is to stick with a few basic tones.

[Terje]

Originally posted by phyrexia Sometimes we concentrate too much on what's coming out of an amp, instead of what's going into it.

Oh yes... we're all guilty of that mistake

[Dark Angel]

A man who compromises has nothing he believes in.

Really though, when does an all-in-one amp have any value?

1. Live.... but who can tell at those volumes? Nobody. Maybe one amp is easier to carry, but in that case any old 3-4 channel amp is more than enough.

2. Recording.... Ever been to recording studio without the prototypical amps? probably not. Plus you can always rent what you need.

So, either be a whore, and just grab anything you like (me), or if you have limited funds go for the one tone most important, and allow one or two "OK at best" channels to come with the package.

{censored}, a one channel beast with an effects loop and a POD XT with a switcher is plenty for anyone in the bedroom or live.

[STEEL KAGE]

I dont know if Compromise is an accurate term Bro... Some of us are no where near as discerning as others... Dont get me wrong, I really care about tone, Im just not OCD about it.

My Herbert is just about where I need it to be and before long, Ill have it doing whatever I want and thouroghly enjoy playing through it. Will it have glorious Blackface cleans? Nope but close enough...

Ive always been more of an guitar guy than an amp guy. I can find good tones( for me) in a variety of amps but Im really picky about my guitars , thats where Im alot more discerning. The same can be said about several different types of stompboxes that Im into..

Kage

[JLeurck]

I find a big difference between the live version of "close is good enough" and the studio version of "close is good enough". Live I could function with a clean amp, a dirty amp, a boost pedal and a stereo volume pedal to pan between clean and dirty (or a good channel switcher). Maybe throw in delay and wah, but I can function without it. Those notes go flying off in space never to be heard again, so the big thing would be to nail the parts and get close as possible to the tones so its not distracting you from chasing the part. Studio "close is good enough" is where I'd end up chasing my tail, and why it takes me so long to finish projects (even then, thinking "dammit, why didn't I use this....." etc.).

I think a well-rehearsed player can sound pretty good (even great) using modest gear, but a guy who doesn't have his game plan together playing-wise won't necessarily be helped by playing through great gear. For me, there is a point where "close is good enough" and the performance matters more than the gear it is coming through. I really think great players are made in the woodshed. A great players' hands can manipulate a basic, functional core sound into something great.

[starsnuffer]

I compromise live. For a while, I had a really elaborate rig that involved head switching and all kinds of nonsense, but it was just too much to lug around.

The truth is, that unless you're playing shred or cookie monster music to a room full of sweaty cheeto-eating guys, then your audience cares less about your tone and more about your presence and music.

So, I settle. I recently bought a H&K mkII which does a lot of tones really really well. It does fender, vox, 2 flavors of marshall, and a boogie tone. Because I use a wide variety of tones live, it makes sense to use this one amp.

I can get a more crushing rhythym sound out of my dual recto, but the leads sound sterile and the clean is abysmal. My XTC 101B is my all time favorite amp for singing leads and is by far the most dynamicaly sensitive amp I've played, but it doesn't do crushing rhythym well enough for my bandmates to approve.

Everyone likes the H&K. It sits well in the mix, it has great tone, and everyone who hears it compliments my tone. It isn't MY favorite amp for any one thing, but unless I want to bring 3 amps along, it does the job I need to do the best.

When I record, I still will lug out my favorite amp for any particular tone The compromise comes to live playing.

-W

[Zachman]

Originally posted by STEEL KAGE I dont know if Compromise is an accurate term Bro... Some of us are no where near as discerning as others... Dont get me wrong, I really care about tone, Im just not OCD about it. My Herbert is just about where I need it to be and before long, Ill have it doing whatever I want and thouroghly enjoy playing through it. Will it have glorious Blackface cleans? Nope but close enough... Ive always been more of an guitar guy than an amp guy. I can find good tones( for me) in a variety of amps but Im really picky about my guitars , thats where Im alot more discerning. The same can be said about several different types of stompboxes that Im into.. Kage

 

 

I hear ya bro. The reason I chose to say compromise, is because guys here seem to discuss "this vs that" aspects of muli-channel amps. ex. Lame clean ch, vs great gain channel.

 

 

BTW the OCD comment had me spit out my pepsi, dang it. LOL

[Zachman]

Originally posted by JLeurck I find a big difference between the live version of "close is good enough" and the studio version of "close is good enough". Live I could function with a clean amp, a dirty amp, a boost pedal and a stereo volume pedal to pan between clean and dirty (or a good channel switcher). Maybe throw in delay and wah, but I can function without it. Those notes go flying off in space never to be heard again, so the big thing would be to nail the parts and get close as possible to the tones so its not distracting you from chasing the part. Studio "close is good enough" is where I'd end up chasing my tail, and why it takes me so long to finish projects (even then, thinking "dammit, why didn't I use this....." etc.). I think a well-rehearsed player can sound pretty good (even great) using modest gear, but a guy who doesn't have his game plan together playing-wise won't necessarily be helped by playing through great gear. For me, there is a point where "close is good enough" and the performance matters more than the gear it is coming through. I really think great players are made in the woodshed. A great players' hands can manipulate a basic, functional core sound into something great.

 

 

I agree, mostly with what you're saying. Live the tone variables and FX variables and switching variables are different than the studio. Usually in the Studio, you can add all the cool stuff to the straight unaffected guitar tone. Live, to reproduce the studio tones, the setup is usually insane and over the top, or it's a compromise to get close enough.

 

As far as the using modest gear to sound great, yes but depending again on the type of modest gear, a great player will play appropriately to what the amp is geared toward. If the same great player needed to get a Marshall High gain tone and all he had available to him was a Roland JC120... He'd probably postpone that session and get the appropriate tool for the job, and secure a Marshall or Whatever...

[Zachman]

Originally posted by Zachman I have seen so many,

[Zachman]

Originally posted by Zachman I have seen so many,