Members KCTigerChief Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 But that's the thing, the GT-R isn't a pig. In terms of handling, keeps up with cars weight 800 pounds less. My point exactly...So why does weight matter if it keeps up with them, which in turn puts it in the exact.same.class.of.car... If Nissan wanted to beat those cars, why didn't they engineer it better to weigh less GM put hundreds (if not thousands) of hours into designing the ZR1 out of light weight materials. And as it turns out, that benefited them greatly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members uppercasenoises Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 Wasn't that YOU that actually said that http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showthread.php?2895269-1100hp-2013-Shelby-GT500-What-in-the-world&p=45551285&viewfull=1#post45551285 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members KCTigerChief Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 blah blah blah If cost = performance, then the Ariel Atom 300 is far better than anything listed in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members uppercasenoises Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 My point exactly...So why does weight matter if it keeps up with them, which in turn puts it in the exact.same.class.of.car... But with the ZR1, it isn't in the same class. This has been my point all along. The ZR1 is capable of beating Ferraris, Lambos, and high end Porsches. Why the hell would you guys want to compare it to a GT-R when it can beat cars that are so much faster? Nissan built the GT-R with the intention of beating the ZO6, not the ZR1. The current ZR1 never even existed when they were developing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members uppercasenoises Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 That says nothing about an Atom However, this post by you does: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showthread.php?2895269-1100hp-2013-Shelby-GT500-What-in-the-world&p=45552348&viewfull=1#post45552348 The Atom was my point at demonstrating that any unfair comparison can be made. I didn't say that EOD made that argument, I said that I could make the SAME sort of argument. Re-read post #122. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members KCTigerChief Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 But with the ZR1, it isn't in the same class. This has been my point all along. The ZR1 is capable of beating Ferraris, Lambos, and high end Porsches. Why the hell would you guys want to compare it to a GT-R when it can beat cars that are so much faster? Nissan built the GT-R with the intention of beating the ZO6, not the ZR1. The current ZR1 never even existed when they were developing it. We AREN'T comparing it to the GT-R, just putting it where it belongs in the class...But why the hell would you brag about beating a car that costs 20-30 thousand dollars less (Z06) than a GT-R...The GT-R is a $100,000 dollar car...The ZR1 is a $100,000 dollar car...They post similar times...therefore the GT-R is in the ZR-1's class... And on that note, this is my last post in this thread, because you are out of your mind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members uppercasenoises Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 We AREN'T comparing it to the GT-R Post #100 just putting it where it belongs in the class...But why the hell would you brag about beating a car that costs 20-30 thousand dollars less (Z06) than a GT-R...The GT-R is a $100,000 dollar car...The ZR1 is a $100,000 dollar car... Price doesn't matter when comparing how well a car performs. I could build a car that is faster than a Veyron on a drag strip (and in top speed) for so much cheaper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gspointer Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 Yes, but if the power/weight ratio isn't similar for both cars, the performance comparison wouldn't be fair.If that's the case, I can make the same argument that EdgeOfDarkness made on the previous page by using another unfair comparison. An Ariel Atom would destroy a ZR1. And the Atom does it all with a little Japanese 4 banger. So much for that V8. The atom is a bad-assed car. It is the most impractical street legal car I have ever seen though. I would still like to have one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EdgeOfDarkness Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 What do you disagree with? The ZR1 has around 100hp more than the GT-R, and weighs 500 pounds less. It isn't a fair comparison. A better comparison would be the C6 ZO6 (which still has an 800 pound weight advantage).Don't forget the GT-R is also AWD , it should make up the difference on the track.Yet those RWD cars are still out handling it through the S's and pulling more G's Wait , I forgot, American cars can only go in a straight line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members uppercasenoises Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 Don't forget the GT-R is also AWD , it should make up the difference on the track. On the Ring, not really. The Ring has several long stretches where high speed comes into play. A RWD car will accelerate faster from 60mph than an AWD car. The GT-R may very well beat the C6 ZO6 on a smaller track like Tsukuba. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EdgeOfDarkness Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 On the Ring, not really. The Ring has several long stretches where high speed comes into play. A RWD car will accelerate faster from 60mph than an AWD car.The GT-R may very well beat the C6 ZO6 on a smaller track like Tsukuba. The AWD will also put more power to the ground quicker.My point was the vette and viper have no problems keeping up or cornering as good, if not better, than a lot of import cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members uppercasenoises Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 The AWD will also put more power to the ground quicker. For a very short period. After a certain speed, RWD cars become superior. That's why AWD cars are not considered good while racing from a roll, but good from a standstill. Last I checked, there weren't any stop signs on Nurburgring. On a side-note, the GT-R beats the ZR1 on Tsukuba by 2 seconds, which is a large margin on such a short track. 2 seconds on the Ring is very small considering it's a 13 mile course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EdgeOfDarkness Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 For a very short period. After a certain speed, RWD cars become superior. That's why AWD cars are not considered good while racing from a roll, but good from a standstill. Last I checked, there weren't any stop signs on Nurburgring.On a side-note, the GT-R beats the ZR1 on Tsukuba by 2 seconds, which is a large margin on such a short track. 2 seconds on the Ring is very small considering it's a 13 mile course. An AWD car SHOULD be able to take corners faster than an RWD car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members uppercasenoises Posted April 5, 2012 Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 An AWD car SHOULD be able to take corners faster than an RWD car. But immediately after coming out of the turn, a RWD car of similar power/weight ratio will be superior. Here is a good example of why AWD is inferior while accelerating from a roll. Both cars have similar HP and weight figures, but the Lambo is AWD and the Vette is RWD. You'll notice that right when the race starts, the Lambo gains a short lead due to AWD, but the Vette eventually wins. This same concept will play out when leaving a turn and accelerating onto a straight portion of the track. A car with AWD simply isn't going to do as good on a high speed course like Nurburgring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EdgeOfDarkness Posted April 6, 2012 Members Share Posted April 6, 2012 this is what made me what could possibly be involved in a $150k performance enhancement? Alpha 10 Packages Starting at $63,999.95(Labor Not Included)The AMS Alpha 10 Package for the Nissan GT-R combines the stock-like driveability of the Nissan GT-R with 1100+ horsepower. http://alphagtr.com/alpha/models/alpha-10-package/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members pink freud Posted April 6, 2012 Members Share Posted April 6, 2012 ZR1 has far more power, so it'll post faster lap times around road course. A better comparison in terms of power/weight ratio* would be C6 ZO6 vs. GT-R. The C6 ZO6 is only 2 seconds better on the Ring, despite weighing nearly 1,000 pounds less (a HUGE difference). It's not that the ZO6 should be faster, it's just that the GT-R (given it's weight) handles incredibly well. It's able to keep up with a car that has a massive weight advantage.*when comparing the performance of two cars, power/weight ratio is the only statistic that matters. Cost is irrelevant. If you want to compare the cost of two cars, then obviously the cost is relevent. How much a car costs has no bearing on how well it performs. If cost = performance, then the Ariel Atom 300 is far better than anything listed in this thread. The Ariel Atom is better than anything listed in this thread anyway. "Open" wheels are just that cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EdgeOfDarkness Posted April 6, 2012 Members Share Posted April 6, 2012 The Ariel Atom is better than anything listed in this thread anyway. "Open" wheels are just that cool. Its illegal here to run cars without fenders, don'tmost of those gocarts have fenders ?I would have killed this guy yesterday if he pulled in front of me. I was hoping we would pass a cop so they would take his jeep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members pink freud Posted April 6, 2012 Members Share Posted April 6, 2012 Its illegal here to run cars without fenders, don'tmost of those gocarts have fenders ? I would have killed this guy yesterday if he pulled in front of me. I was hoping we would pass a cop so they would take his jeep. That's why I put the quotes around Open. You can see here: that the wheels do have fenders, they just move with the wheel, giving the same feel as a fenderless car. The first car I ever got to drive was a 1929 Ford roadster. Being able to see the wheels as you turn them is an awesome experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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