Members Ovid9 Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 I'm off {censored}ing off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Valtiel Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 The overall balance is much better now, although the snare still sounds like... If you hadn't said that the snare was miked top and bottom I would have thought there weren't any close mics at all. Do you know what kind of snare it is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members exafro Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 The snare is kinda St Anger esque. But I'm assuming this is a demo? It's fine for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarbilly74 Posted May 12, 2012 Author Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 The overall balance is much better now, although the snare still sounds like... If you hadn't said that the snare was miked top and bottom I would have thought there weren't any close mics at all. Do you know what kind of snare it is? yeah he used this snare: no honestly, I have no idea, it's the same snare he uses live and it sounds good, so I am pretty it's my fault for mic'ing it wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarbilly74 Posted May 12, 2012 Author Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 The snare is kinda St Anger esque. But I'm assuming this is a demo? It's fine for that. Well, we are are making a full-length cd but yeah we have no intentions of selling it, it's just for us and for whoever wants it for free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mr. moon Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 Hey man, first off, I dig the tune. I like the melodies a lot and it drew me in nicely. Well done!About the only additional critiques I could add would be that the drums sound like they aren't in the same space with one another; not cohesive with one another. What I mean is that the kicks sound like triggered samples, the cymbals sound like they're outside of the drum space entirely, and the snare sound really doesn't fit the tune. The kicks sound like they're eq'd into the higher frequencies to get the click of the transient hit, but the bass doesn't sound like it's been eq'd lower to take their place in the freq spectrum, so the bass gets washed out by the guitars and has lost definition.Here's a link to a post made on the REAPER forum about creating a drum space with before and after samples of the drums from one of our more mellow tunes. While the drum sound I went with probably wouldn't work for your tune, you'll get an idea of what I'm trying to say about a drum space...http://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php?p=734192&postcount=6 I always like to keep in mind that a strong tune will always transcend the recoding quality anyways, so I always take the perspective of writing and arranging properly, and even if the mix falls to {censored} you at least still have a strong tune....Now the real fun will be when you get vox in there, trying to carve out space for them and allow the vocal melodies to ride above the great guitar work you did.(that's why it suck s to be a guitarist and be the one who has to mix the tunes...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarbilly74 Posted May 12, 2012 Author Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 Hey man, first off, I dig the tune. I like the melodies a lot and it drew me in nicely. Well done! About the only additional critiques I could add would be that the drums sound like they aren't in the same space with one another; not cohesive with one another. What I mean is that the kicks sound like triggered samples, the cymbals sound like they're outside of the drum space entirely, and the snare sound really doesn't fit the tune. The kicks sound like they're eq'd into the higher frequencies to get the click of the transient hit, but the bass doesn't sound like it's been eq'd lower to take their place in the freq spectrum, so the bass gets washed out by the guitars and has lost definition. Here's a link to a post made on the REAPER forum about creating a drum space with before and after samples of the drums from one of our more mellow tunes. While the drum sound I went with probably wouldn't work for your tune, you'll get an idea of what I'm trying to say about a drum space... http://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php?p=734192&postcount=6 I always like to keep in mind that a strong tune will always transcend the recoding quality anyways, so I always take the perspective of writing and arranging properly, and even if the mix falls to {censored} you at least still have a strong tune. ...Now the real fun will be when you get vox in there, trying to carve out space for them and allow the vocal melodies to ride above the great guitar work you did. (that's why it suck s to be a guitarist and be the one who has to mix the tunes...) whoa right on man this is great advice and I agree with everything you said. I will check out that link later on tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members draelyc Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 Use SoundCloud, goddammit!!! Guitars are WAAAAAAAAAAY out front, Billy. I mean WAY out front. It's burying everything else. But if you're mixing it, makes sense b/c you're the guitar player. That's the first impression I get. I'm a total mixing n00b as far as the technical aspect of it, but bass and drums need to come up, or guitar drop back. Tone is damned good tho. That. Except I gots no problem with ToneFinder. Great tones, and I dig the composition, too. Will look forward to the full/vox version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members draelyc Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 Hey guys... new mix based on the great suggestions I got here, thanks a lot. I balanced the instruments a bit more, worked on the snare and bass tone, turned guitar down a bit. See, I listen. let me know what you think http://www.tonefinder.com/files/37-MC2.mp3Thanks guys!!! Second version is better balanced ... but man, now that snare is standing out in a way it didn't before... Hmm... Getting beyond my pay grade / level of expertise here ~ dunno how much could be done with eq'ing there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ENdtime Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 I agree, those kicks sound like a trigger.. Which is cool, but they are a little sample.. No balls to em. In fact, the whole song lacks balls.. I'm not sure how far you want to go with this, but I would first and foremost try to get those kicks to have punch.. The bass guitar is lacking as well.. It's just real flat and non existent.. And tbh, that guitar tone is pretty weak too.. I think since it's really the one tone that's out front it's what's driving this mix, and it's just a blah tone man.. Sorry.. I think if you got the kicks and bass doing their job and driving the song and providing the power, the guitars would sound better as well.. The snare isn't as bad a some of the posters made me think.. It does have a little ring, but I think that can as some flavor and I didn't feel it was distracting.. It also had no body.. Boost in the 150-200hz on the snare.. Make sure your compressor is run after the eq. On drums I like to do this, as it allows more sound shaping abilities.. So when you boost the lows of the snare, get the compressor to tighten the whole sound up.. I'm usually around 7-13ms attack on the snare.. About 35ms on the release.. Also I'd run the whole drum kit into it's own buss and put a compressor (multi band if you have one) and boost the lows of the whole Kit.. I typically do a fairly wideQ starting at around 40hz.. This will give that kick some extra sub energy and should fatten up the floor tom nicely as well.. Doesn't sound like he used it much though.. BUT boost big if you have to, say 7db.. I typically only do 3 or 4, but I find boosting the lows of the kick on the drum buss helps glue everything together some. And since that kick sounds pretty light, you may have to move the low eq up to say 50 or 60hz. I also may boost around 1.5khz to make the snare a bit more up front, while adding some attack to the kick and Toms.. Your cymbals sound bright enough, so I wouldn't boost any high frequency on the buss.. The bass guitar maybe needs a limiter hammering it and adding a little grind.. I barely could make out any distinct bass, so it'shard to say what is do there.. And then mix your guitars in.. Honestly man, they are flat sounding and shouldn't be the main focus of the mix.. I generally don't like exciters, but maybe an exciter on the guitars will help add a little extra sheen.. But as it is, it's a decent demo.. But it sounds like a home grown job, and with the gear and software available to us nowadays, it doesn't have to sound like it.. Good luck.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ENdtime Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 Also for the snare have you tried flipping the phase on one of the mics? That might be why it lacks body.. A lot of timeswhen I use 2 mics on the snare it's necessary to flip the phase of one. Also, I wouldn't be afraid to kill the bottom Mic altogether. Usually the overheads will pick up enough of the snares . I don't know if you caught my live drumjam thread about a week ago, but I just used a top Mic and I think it sounds better sometimes just using that.. Also I did that in my jam room at my house, which is bedroom with only sm and beta 57's and I managed to get the drums sounding big and full.. So the capability is there.. Definitely eq heavy in the drum buss.. Also, if you are compressing in the buss and the cymbals start acting funny, pull them out of the buss and just compress and eq the drums in the buss. Also, you'd be surprised how little overheads you really need.. The hi hat and cymbals were kinda loud, and really you can get away with pulling the overheads and cymbals pretty far down in the mix.. This might allow you to get some real balls into the drums without negatively affecting the cymbals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarbilly74 Posted May 12, 2012 Author Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 thanks again for all the advice, I went out last night but I will be working on it this morning. So from from what I gathered here what I need to work on is: more on punch on the bass and kick eq the snare a bit more get the drums to sound more cohesive more punch on the guitar tone I will apply the suggestions posted here and see what happens Thanks guys I am learning a lot!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members primeholy Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 Two words..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarbilly74 Posted May 12, 2012 Author Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 more cowbell.. why didn't I think of that? One more pass... based on the feedback I got here: http://www.tonefinder.com/files/57-MC3.mp3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Goop Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 One more pass... based on the feedback I got here: Big improvement on the snare. The snare sound is appropriate for this song and much better than the coffee can. I wouldn't go much more brootz on the guitar tone, the Legacy sounds good for this style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarbilly74 Posted May 12, 2012 Author Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 Big improvement on the snare. The snare sound is appropriate for this song and much better than the coffee can. I wouldn't go much more brootz on the guitar tone, the Legacy sounds good for this style. Thanks man. I think I am happy with this one, it should be good enough for what we're trying to do with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ej Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 The last mix is best so far, but I still think over all it lacks punch Still sounds good though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members fretless Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 I dig the tune ! m/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarbilly74 Posted May 12, 2012 Author Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 I dig the tune ! m/ thanks man!!! m/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarbilly74 Posted May 12, 2012 Author Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 Added a little bit more punch to the overall track http://www.tonefinder.com/files/95-MC4.mp3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gspointer Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 I will try to listen later if I get my monitors hooked up, but, I have had great luck with drum tone by micing the shell and adjust up and down to taste. Granted all my experience is for live usage, and I know that almost everyone seems to mic just the top with 1 mic. I did the top for years, then one day tried the shell, much happier, and very little eq needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mr. moon Posted May 12, 2012 Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 I'll also try to listen later, but another piece of advise would be to *not* get too comfortable with the mix until you start incorporating the vox, as EVERYTHING will need to change to get them to sit nicely with everything else! ...Ah, they joys of mixing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarbilly74 Posted May 12, 2012 Author Members Share Posted May 12, 2012 I'll also try to listen later, but another piece of advise would be to *not* get too comfortable with the mix until you start incorporating the vox, as EVERYTHING will need to change to get them to sit nicely with everything else! ...Ah, they joys of mixing! that's true, I will try to do a mix with the guide vocal tracks I have just to see how it fits. Something is telling me I will be back to square one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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