Harnessing the power of geezers

[AVisme]

I don't consider anyone under 40 a geezer. Early 30s is still young to me.

When I jokingly referred to "geezers", I was speaking of the music-buying public, the 45+ consumers in the article. But still, singers of the 1980s (30s and 40s) were much older than most of the kids who are being pushed nowadays. They were the cutting edge of music and the chart-toppers.

 

 

 

I didn't say "new" directions, I just said directions. Things are sort of adrift right now, much like the were in the in mid 70s and the mid 80s. But when something does head off in anew direction, it won't be guys in their 40s and 50s making it happen.

I don't see why it can't be. As I pointed out earlier, older guys are capable of doing it and have in the past. Today's young artists aren't choosing their own directions anyway, they are being led by their older managers and producers, or they are treading ground trailblazed by older artists. Many of them, Miley with "Every Rose..." and this Glee phenomenon, are just unabashedly redoing old material. Rappers are sampling 80s and 90s music (Nu Shooz' "I Can't Wait", Annie Lennox's "No More I Love You's").

 

 

 

Maybe, but business has always followed trends in the past, never led them.

Glam metal, grunge, gangsta rap all started with a small core of groups. The labels recognized the talent there and signed them, and the trend followed after their success. The trend was the result of the labels trying to replicate what sold.

 

But the trend can't happen until the labels roll the dice, until they choose a damn spot on the roulette table to place their bet. If this article has any truth in it, indications are that music appealing to older demos are a good bet.

 

 

 

Yes, but those things have nothing to do with the music biz. In fact, you sort of made my point for me- the stuff we geezers spend our money on is not in trying to emulate our musical heroes. We're more apt to buy something for the house, a vacation, whatever. Dressing like Akon or Lil Wayne or a 200 dollar haircut to look like the guy in Muse? Not so much. Do you really think buying a couple of wine glasses is the same as identifying your lifestyle with your music idols?

Wine glasses fall into the "accessories" category you mentioned. Sammy's Cabo Wabo Cantina is a vacation destination and he's tapped into that.

 

Oprah and Martha were examples of what is possible. They are at the apex of branding and selling to older demographics. Most older musicians haven't ventured into that...I'm saying that's the direction they should be going towards. Why are older folks spending money on their house and on vacations? Because those are the sorts of things that have been sold to them (Home Depot and Sandals commercials on the news stations). If older musicians start marketing their products effectively, they will buy those too. Of course, part of the marketing is actually getting back some of the mainstream music share. Celebs of all types and ages are selling clothing and hairstyles (that's what QVC is profiting from)...no reason older musicians can't do it. Paula Abdul?

[richardmac]

It is funny to be called a geezer at 45. In anything else, 45 is middle aged and geezer starts at more like 50. Regarding geezer purchasing habits... Looking back at 2010, I don't think I bought any music at all that was made by someone over 35. Kind of interesting.

 

Side note - there have been some studies which suggest that people do indeed get less creative when they get to be geezers. It has something to do with the connections in your brain having already been made or something. I didn't pay any attention because I thought it was BS, but you never know.

 

This thread has brought up some very interesting points. Geezers buying the most music, especially, because we don't buy that much. However, the young folks steal it all, so there you go - we don't steal in as high numbers. Geezers not being as likely to create the next new hot sound... yeah, in theory, it does seem like geezers ought to be able to do it just because of all of their experience, but in reality the 20 somethings drive the new hot sounds and trends. And the other point I liked was the idea that the new hot sounds are usually just recycled old sounds, and that's always been the case.

[BlueStrat]

 

Today's young artists aren't choosing their own directions anyway, they are being led by their older managers and producers,

 

 

I guess you weren't anywhere near Seattle in the early 90s or Athens, GA in the 80s. Those movements sprung up out of a handful of bands doing music their way. By the time the majors got ahold of them, they had already started changing music. As always, major labels were late to the party, and the schwag merchants even later. There's a great documentary called HYPE! wherein the guys being interviewed were founders of the grunge movement in Seattle. I suggest you watch it if you can get it. Major labels may have amplified grunge and made it mainstream, but it was a movement among the youth long before then. And it's always been that way.

 

 

Glam metal, grunge, gangsta rap all started with a small core of groups. The labels recognized the talent there and signed them

 

 

 

the trend followed after their success. The trend was the result of the labels trying to replicate what sold.

 

 

Isn't that what I just said before? The trends didn't start with 40 and 50 year old guys, didn't start with corporations, it started with youth. I don't know why you're arguing about this. You just agreed with me.

 

 

 

Wine glasses fall into the "accessories" category you mentioned. Sammy's Cabo Wabo Cantina is a vacation destination and he's tapped into that.

You stall aren't getting what I'm saying. If you think geezers spend as much on lifestyle identification with their favorite music as youth does, I don't know what else to tell you. I guess all those marketing research firms are waste of money for corporations spending millions on ad dollars. But let me ask you this: who's more likely to dress and wear their hair like their favorite bands, a 16-25 year old, or his/her parents?

 

 

Why are older folks spending money on their house and on vacations? Because those are the sorts of things that have been sold to them (Home Depot and Sandals commercials on the news stations).

 

 

With all due respect, that's crap. Do you even own a home? It costs a lot of money to buy it and maintain it, and it becomes the main source of an adult's identity and the biggest investment of their life. Younger people don't generally own homes, so marketing isn't directed toward them as homeowners. Once again, by your logic, it is advertising that creates home ownership and maintenance. You have it exactly backwards. I don't buy stuff for my house because Marthsa Stewart or Oprah tells me I need it to be hip. I buy it because we like to always be updating, and would buy stuff regardless of who ism selling it.

 

And vacations? People my age take them because we have to spend so much time working to pay for the house, the kids' college, cars, taxes, and everything else we pay for. That a relatively few adults may want to go check out Cabo Wabo to relive their youth for a week is nowhere near anything like the millions of kids who make a lifestyle out of looking like they're members of Arcade Fire or (insert favorite youth band here). And for what it's worth, I've never been to Cabo Wabo but the friends I have who have been there told me it's mostly people between 25 and 35 who party there.

 

Look, I don't want to nitpick details here. If you want to believe that older folks are going to be instrumental in determining the next new thing in music, go ahead. I just think you're kidding yourself. But I could be wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.

[flatfinger]

It is funny to be called a geezer at 45.

Ya , freek'in hilarious !!!






If you don't mind ; I prefer DINOSAUR over GEEZER:lol:

[Cliftonb]

Alright - this has nothing to do with music, but I gotta say it. Who the {censored} references lolcats in 2011?

[AVisme]

Look, I don't want to nitpick details here. If you want to believe that older folks are going to be instrumental in determining the next new thing in music, go ahead. I just think you're kidding yourself. But I could be wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.

It's not what I believe will happen, it's what I'd like to see happen and what I think would be more profitable, not to mention better for our culture overall.

[flatfinger]

Alright - this has nothing to do with music, but I gotta say it. Who the {censored} references lolcats in 2011?

 

 

GEEZERS:wave:

[Poker99]

That's absolutely true for me. I've opened my mind to more music that I never even considered when I was younger.

 

 

Me too, I'm much more open minded, but I don't think its true for the majority. Most people over 25 settle down musically and just want to listen to the same crap they liked years ago over and over again.

[flatfinger]

. Most people over 25 settle down musically and just want to listen to the same crap they liked years ago over and over again.

 

 

Division of energies:

 

Log on to real time gaming ....couple of hour gone

 

get on facebook ... half hour gone

 

 

LISTEN TO MUSIC .........i GET AROUND TO IT LATER

(and it won't be whilst not doing anything else ....thats why they invented earbuds!)

 

 

 

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[Matximus]

It's not what I believe will happen, it's what I'd like to see happen and what I think would be more profitable, not to mention better for our culture overall.

 

 

Come on.. You want to know the last time older record buyers moved the needle in music? The contribution older record buyers give to the music arts? This is not a difficult question: Susan Boyle. Yes - Susan Boyle. Who the hell do you think gave her a top 10 record a couple years ago? The older Demographic. Go back a few years earlier: Rod Stewart's American Songbook series. Josh Groban - Andrea whatshisface that blind dude.

 

I mean.. adult contemporary. Yawn.... It's great. It's important ... but come on.

 

This all goes back to Youth. There's no conspiracy going on here- the youth demograhpic is by far the most important and profitable niche to win in marketing: If you win them, you have a chance to win them for life. And when young people buy stuff, everybody tends to start buying that stuff too. People get grumpy about this and don't want to admit this - but if you are 45 and have a Facebook page or own and iPod... you can thank Teenagers and college kids that launched those products. Those things would not be the cultural behemoths they are today had they been aimed at.... Geezers.

 

This is the way things work and they're that way for a reason. You don't even want to know about the level of science that goes into what's going to be sold to whom in the field of consumer products - which music is. It's not a blind art.

[flatfinger]

It's not a blind art.

Not an exact science either though; ???

[Surrealistic]

Most people over 25 settle down musically and just want to listen to the same crap they liked years ago over and over again.

That's true, but it isn't just an age thing. I think there are plenty of people under 25 who are closed minded too.

[flatfinger]

That's true, but it isn't just an age thing. I think there are plenty of people under 25 who are closed minded too.

 

 

In a way that ties in nicely with Matximus's theory about mass marketing to the YUTES ( youths) . They are much more likey to engage is group think . Teens will be peer pressured into listening/liking whatever their peers are into . So really the only trick in that niche is to get the ball rolling !!!! GEEZERS should be a little more Independent thinkers by the time the achieve geezerhood. So if your music isn't watered down , lowest common denominator fare ( and you want to be payed for it !) , then you should have more success marketing to the geezer block ....

 

Of course if you can appeal to BOTH , you are cooking !!!!!!!!

[Matximus]

. So if your music isn't watered down , lowest common denominator fare ( and you want to be payed for it !) , then you should have more success marketing to the geezer block .... Of course if you can appeal to BOTH , you are cooking !!!!!!!!

 

 

And this is not my theory for crying out loud! What the hell do I know about marketing? I read this stuff. Pick up a freaking book about marketing. They go over this {censored} in like the first chapter. Why is the youth demographic so important? There's no mystery here - all this stuff is well mapped out.

 

And yes - marketing is a hard science and it's becoming a spookily more focused one thanks to Google and Facebook and the like. Gotta Facebook page? They're only too happy to put Nike ads in front of your face after you mentioned on their Web site that your favorite sport is Jogging or whatever. There's nothing malicious about any of this - nobody's twisting your arm to share that valuable bit of information about yourself online, but someone is going to pass it along.

 

Marketing stuff is fascinating. There's like an arms race going on to capture younger and younger consumers - television shows and marketing campaigns and {censored} targeting toddlers and whatnot. Toy Cell Phones. Pre-paid Credit cards to tweens. You never saw any of that {censored} a few years ago, but they realize the younger they get you the more money they can make.

 

Remember G.I. Joe? My Little Pony? {censored} like that? Those TV shows on Saturday morning? They had to ban that stuff years ago because they realized it was crooked to make half-hour commercials for children masquarading as cartoons. They'd come up with a toy, make a TV show, and broadcast it. Kids went nuts - buying that stuff like it was going out of style because they can't tell the difference between ads and shows.

 

They stopped all that blatent pandering, but the people in the business of selling stuff are just as tenacious and even trickier than they were 20 years ago.

 

But Geezers just ain't going to be duped the same way - their tricky tricks don't work as well with Geezers.

[daddymack]

hey you kids..get off my lawn!

Now, where did I leave my walkman with the Dead's greatest hits ?

Dang...

[flatfinger]

http://sethgodin.typepad.com/seths_blog/2009/05/is-marketing-an-art-or-a-science.html

 

 

 

Is marketing an art or a science? It's both, and that's the problem.

 

 

 

Some marketers are scientists. They test and measure. They do the math. They understand the impact of that spend in that market at that time with that message. They can understand the analytics and find the truth. This sort of marketing works when it works, but it usually doesn't. That's because we're dealing with humans, the wild card in the system.