Do DAW plug-ins address their own RAM, or do they pull it from the host?

[144dB]

Hey all,

 

I'm getting ready to buy a new PC DAW (for the first time in ~9 years), and while I'll be running Win7 x64 with 16 GB of RAM, I'm not quite ready to run Cubase 6.5 as a full 64 bit application. Uptime and robustness are very important to me, and until some of the plug-in manufacturers get on the 64 bit bandwagon, I would prefer not to use the VST bit bridge or jBridge. It just sounds like a lot of hassle and potential problems. I can switch over to true 64 bit operation a year from now, etc.

 

My question is this:

 

From the reading I've done, it would appear that a 32 bit application in a 64 bit OS can address somewhere between 2 GB and 4 GB of RAM. So for this context, let's say that Cubase x32 can address up to 4 GB. When plug-ins and virtual instruments are used, do they draw from the memory allocation in Cubase, or do they pull their own memory from the system? In other words, could HALion address another 4 GB (on top of the 4 GB that Cubase is using)? Could a soft synth address even more memory on top of that? Or do plug-ins always pull their resources from the host app?

 

Any clarification or insight is appreciated. Thanks in advance.

 

Todd

[Lex.Luthier]

 

Or do plug-ins always pull their resources from the host app?

 

 

I've always presumed that the plug-ins pulled their resources from the host app as when you open process manager the plug-ins do not appear as seperate processes, just Cubase.

[144dB]

Good point Lex...

 

Thanks.

[MattMayfield]

My understanding is that most plugins use the host application's RAM, but a few (such as Kontakt, Logic's EXS24, and some others - mostly sampler - that I don't recall at the moment) reserve their own RAM from the OS.

[144dB]

Thanks Matt -

 

Samplers are really the key... I use Steven Slate drums with Kontakt Player, and if that can run with it's own RAM allocation, that would definitely help. I'm curious if HALion 4 follows this model.

 

Todd

[WRGKMC]

Some high end plugins UAD use cards that excelerate the plugins and eleviate the load

on the OS ram, but they are the only ones I can think of. They were nessasary for

running low end computers, but I believe that company is switching over at this point.

Computers are so powerful now, noones wanting to spend a couple of grand for a

single plugin that requires a board to run. Doesnt matter how good they are at this

point. PCI is being phased out for PCI express so those boards will be obsolite soon.

[CME]

 

My understanding is that most plugins use the host application's RAM, but a few (such as Kontakt, Logic's EXS24, and some others - mostly sampler - that I don't recall at the moment) reserve their own RAM from the OS.

 

 

This is my understanding also. It's mainly some VI's that use a memory server to get by the Host DAW's Ram limits. However I think you'll have to research and see if your uses one or not. And it may be something you have to set-up in the VI's options menus.

[Lee Flier]

 

Some high end plugins UAD use cards that excelerate the plugins and eleviate the load on the OS ram, but they are the only ones I can think of. They were nessasary for running low end computers, but I believe that company is switching over at this point. Computers are so powerful now, noones wanting to spend a couple of grand for a single plugin that requires a board to run.

 

 

Huh? Switching over to what, native plugins? No, UAD isn't doing that.

 

And you don't pay a couple of grand for a single plugin. You pay around $1500 for the card, which includes a whole bunch of plugins with it, and then you can buy more plugins that work with it, which range from around $100-500 each.

 

UAD has a Firewire version of their DSP card, called the Satellite, as well as the PCIe card, and now they are introducing the Apollo which is a complete recording interface that can also host their plugins. But they have no plans to phase out the PCIe card that I know of.

 

UAD's plugs sound really, really good, and at least part of the reason why is they don't need to worry so much about using a lot of the computer's CPU. Some of their plugs are major CPU hogs, but that's how they can get such complex, rich, detailed sound.

[Phil O'Keefe]

 

This is my understanding also. It's mainly some VI's that use a memory server to get by the Host DAW's Ram limits. However I think you'll have to research and see if your uses one or not. And it may be something you have to set-up in the VI's options menus.

 

 

That's my understanding as well. Most basic VST or RTAS EQ and compressor plugins are going to be running off the DAW program's RAM, and everything - including samplers and plugins that reserve their own RAM - is limited by the OS RAM limits. For Windows x32, that's a bit over 3GB total, depending on the system's overhead. I'd call it 3.2GB, give or take. Remember, some of that has to be utilized by the system too, so you can't expect all of it to be dedicated to the DAW or the plugins.

 

It's normally not a huge limitation for me because I tend to record more "real" stuff than virtual instruments. Not that I don't use them - I do - but rarely more than a handful at once, which my system can generally handle just fine... but I can understand why 64 bit systems with gobs of RAM are of interest to the people who do use a ton of VIs.