Gaga University - Lady Gaga's Lessons for the Music Business (WSJ)

[Thrustin]

I like her so much, I did this a few months back.

[YOUTUBE]v3_aarx5ImA[/YOUTUBE]

[BlueStrat]

Good Lord. What are you, 12?

[Thrustin]

Good Lord. What are you, 12?

Me? Why would you think I'm 12?

[Matximus]

Billy Cool is plugged in!! That was fantastic.

And you sounded a bit like Chris Cornell there in the chorus. Neat.

But seriously, a fella that respects solid popcraft is A-1 okay in my book. Some of these haters just don't get it. And they're too obtuse to realize they they don't get that they don't get it.

[CountRobula]

If you prefer cooked TV dinners over a mother's home made feast, I don't know what to say. It is what it is.

[BlueStrat]

 

Billy Cool is plugged in!! That was fantastic. And you sounded a bit like Chris Cornell there in the chorus. Neat. But seriously, a fella that respects solid popcraft is A-1 okay in my book. Some of these haters just don't get it. And they're too obtuse to realize they they don't get that they don't get it.

 

 

You probably like eating at McDonald's, driving a Buick and buying your clothes at Target.

 

Whatever floats your boat.

 

 

Me? Why would you think I'm 12?

Oh, I don't know. Maybe your sort of creepy devotion to a pop star that is usually only found in adolescents? :poke:

[flatfinger]

Some of what teenagers do is just reject whatever their parents may like out of hand . Rebellion an all that.

The stages are dependency ( baby , young child ) independance ( early adulthood ) and then ; hopefully the realization that no one is an island an ... Interdependancy...



My parents gave me a bunch of old albums and all of the sudden (now that I'm older ) I like some of them.... Would you believe I'm listening to Patsy Cline and Hank Williams now .??

Not too many years ago I wouldn' have believed it !!!




The real question is will music stand the test of time .??

As I indicated in the recent past, I have no issues with stagecraft and showmanship being part of the plan , but if the performers want to be taken seriously , and , they are also the songwriters then they should work on craft and Aim to write classics ... Any songwriter who doesn't aspire to writing a classic must be regarded as a hack.

If that's all there ambition , that's O.K. too . But they won't be remembered in the longhaul as a musical artist so much as an actor-showman/person.

[Thrustin]

Oh, I don't know. Maybe your sort of creepy devotion to a pop star that is usually only found in adolescents? :poke:

 

 

I have no creepy devotion. I think she is a real talent and will be around for a while. The reason I did the cover was because I wanted to take a top 40 hit and make it my own. I believe I accomplished that. It was fun. It only took about 5 hours. Did you listen? I'll bet you didn't. Check it out. I'm not the chump you assume I am.

[BlueStrat]

{censored}ING BRILLIANT!

 

 

Did you listen?

Why? Is she going to get good all of a sudden?

It only took about 5 hours.

 

I'm just jerking your chain. I actually thought your recording was pretty cool.

I don't care about LGG, but I wouldn't say she's not got some talent.

[CountRobula]

I don't really hate Gaga, she just uses whatever aspects of talent she may have for evil.

Hey, Flat, ironically, nobody in my house is really INTO music. My mother casually listens to stuff on a radio she keeps in the kitchen, but I wouldn't call her a music fan in the traditional sense. She doesn't really show any effort into actually involving herself in any of it. She knows a few pop hits that come on and that's about it. And my father? He always liked Country and that's about it, and he sparked my interest in that genre in particular. Everything else I looked into through my own curiosity.

I would've never stumbled upon Marty Robbins (who sounds like a texas outlaw roy orbison to me) and is probably one of my favorite country artists. I wonder if I would've rejected what they listened to? I'm still a young kid, so I doubt I'd rebel just for the sake of it. Besides, I doubt I got into music like I did because of their lack of interest in it, because I used to listen to the same music that I hate today, mainly because everyone else did, but someone gave me an mp3 as a gift with a bunch of novelty pop like "let's do it like they do on the discovery channel" , and a few well-known hits from some unique bands.

Needless to say, I gravitated towards those songs that stood out inparticular and though I didn't "get" them at first, after awhile it finally clicked and I loved 'em. They had something that the others didn't. Couldn't mistake these songs for any other songs. I think it's hard for someone who's used to generic pop chords to sit through a few minutes of shifty time changes and uncommon chords/structures or anything that dares to be really different.

[Thrustin]

She uses her talents for evil?

 

Evil is the spell that has been cast over upstart songwritiers, that have them write songs as if they are lottery tickets. That's evil. If I never hear a song written to "Nashville Standards" it will be too soon.

 

What's evil about Gaga? She's fun. It's all about partying. She stands for partying and equality. What's so evil? Every good rock band was an exhibition of bad decisions and bad taste.

[CountRobula]

Eh, I like to party, I just don't like her music. It doesn't really speak to me. When I'm partying, I'm not paying attention to music. It's in the background, I guess it's good for atmosphere, but music that I actually listen to can provide that as well. The main thing is that it's empty, I couldn't actually listen to the words and derive a meaning or metaphor that could pertain to my life, because there is no meaning there. "Let's all get drunk and party and make out! Woo!" It's great for the age group that she's aiming for, I guess. I'm not at an age where I could even go out and drink, and I probably won't be wild like that. A lot of the rock bands I like seemed to be pretty laid back guys who just wanted to play. They weren't bringing attention to them, I don't care if they had girls around them, it was their personal business.

And some of them had drug addictions, but that wasn't on the forefront (intentionally, anyway), it was their personal issue and had nothing to do with the music they put out, and none of them necessarily promoted drug use or anything negative. I don't judge them for that stuff, they're only human. No correlation in any of that, and they didn't write songs about partying even if they DID have fun. They wrote FUN songs that made me want to go nuts and start dancing, but not really songs that made me want to go out and take advantage of some drunk girl. I'd like to think that most of the songs made me a better person in some way.

Gaga makes mindless pop. She's even said it herself. I find that to be the "evil side".. I don't hate her, I simply don't care for her. You don't have to be offended, I'm not saying my favorite stuff is any better.

[zuzz]

So the Lady Gaga lesson to be learned is to sign with a major label so they get your songs played 24/7 on radio and video shows. lol.

[Thrustin]

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[Poker99]

Nice photoshop

[Blackwatch]

But seriously, a fella that respects solid popcraft is A-1 okay in my book. Some of these haters just don't get it. And they're too obtuse to realize they they don't get that they don't get it.

 

 

Well..............you're right about that..................I really don't get it....

 

She's OK but I really can't figure out what the big gush is all about....She's cute, competent, and new and that's about it for me.............

 

I tend to be more moved by lyrics than melody so maybe that it, but I really don't think she's anything that special........IMO...

[kurdy]

Well..............you're right about that..................I really don't get it.... She's OK but I really can't figure out what the big gush is all about....She's cute, competent, and new and that's about it for me............. I tend to be more moved by lyrics than melody so maybe that it, but I really don't think she's anything that special........IMO...

 

 

People are caught up in the persona. The funny costumes, the stage theatrics. Kinda similar to what David Bowie did 35+ years ago. I admit, it is kind of exciting. It's big. It's a show.

 

The music itself--it's catchy and easy to sing along to. And that's enough for some people.

 

I really don't care one way or the other about her, but I can sorta see why people are into it.

[CountRobula]

People are caught up in the persona. The funny costumes, the stage theatrics. Kinda similar to what David Bowie did 35+ years ago. I admit, it is kind of exciting. It's big. It's a show. The music itself--it's catchy and easy to sing along to. And that's enough for some people. I really don't care one way or the other about her, but I can sorta see why people are into it.

 

 

I much prefer Bowie's dressing up and acting out over Gaga's - Bowie was just a weird guy (in the most positive/coolest way possible) and his weirdness came with substance. Gaga's dressing weird just for the sake of it.

[kurdy]

I much prefer Bowie's dressing up and acting out over Gaga's - Bowie was just a weird guy (in the most positive/coolest way possible) and his weirdness came with substance. Gaga's dressing weird just for the sake of it.

 

 

OK, well how about Barnum & Bailey? Do people go to the circus to find deeper meaning? Or do they go to be entertained? I don't think it's really any big mystery why Lady Gaga is so popular. She's spectacle. The music is secondary. It's the jingle that gets you to pay attention to the product.

 

And I think she's clever at the media game. She figured out it wasn't necessary to make a bunch of controversial statements in interviews, or date high-profile celebrities, or over-indulge in drugs and alcohol. All she had to do was wear funny clothes. I'm sure a lot of other pop starts are kicking themselves wishing they'd have figured it out sooner. Would've saved them so much hassle. Of course it only works once. If they all catch on and start dressing more and more outrageously, then someone will have to come up with something else in order to stand out, and it probably won't be pretty.

[Blackwatch]

OK, well how about Barnum & Bailey? Do people go to the circus to find deeper meaning? Or do they go to be entertained? I don't think it's really any big mystery why Lady Gaga is so popular. She's spectacle. The music is secondary. It's the jingle that gets you to pay attention to the product.

 

 

That

 

 

I want more than just entertainment in music. I want it to challenge me and take me places I'm not familiar with. I want the lyrics to be written in multiple levels, I want poetry...

 

And Lady Gaga is entertaining but she's not poetry...........

[Matximus]

Blackwatch you clearly get it.

And that's cool.

Me - and a lot of people - come at music from the other way. I want music that is as mindlessly pleasing as possible. And I think that the creation of a catchy popular song is one of the highest achievements in art.

Gaga and her people shaping up to be masters of this art, which I think is just fantastic. And anyone who thinks that writing a hit song is easy doesn't know {censored}.

[BlueStrat]

 

And anyone who thinks that writing a hit song is easy doesn't know {censored}.

 

 

At least we can agree on that.

[richardmac]

Blackwatch you clearly get it. And that's cool. Me - and a lot of people - come at music from the other way. I want music that is as mindlessly pleasing as possible. And I think that the creation of a catchy popular song is one of the highest achievements in art. Gaga and her people shaping up to be masters of this art, which I think is just fantastic. And anyone who thinks that writing a hit song is easy doesn't know {censored}.

 

 

Easy? Hell no, or, as they say, everyone would be doing it.

 

Catchy pop song as one of the highest achievements in art? That's an interesting take. I really enjoy a catchy song, but...

 

I dunno. I think there are two popular ways to come up with a hit. One is to create something that is so unique and different and great that people just fall in love with it - Nirvana's "Smells Like Teen Spirit" being a good example. Another way is to manufacture it by calculating exactly what flavor the general public wants at the time and essentially giving the public exactly what they want - Black Eyed Peas "I Gotta Feeling" being a good example of that.

 

It is very very difficult to do either one. It is also very very difficult to write a clever jingle for an ad. To me, the calculated pop stuff has more in common with jingle writing. They're very similar - you want to write something very catchy and very popular that will appeal to a great number of people. So if you put it up there as a high artistic achievement, you might have to put jingle writing up there, too. And the poster child for both is Barry Manilow. He wrote some of the most successful jingles ever, and he also wrote some of the top selling pop songs. We listen to him now and cringe. Actually I listened to him in the 70's and cringed, but that was pop music back then.

[kurdy]

It is very very difficult to do either one. It is also very very difficult to write a clever jingle for an ad. To me, the calculated pop stuff has more in common with jingle writing. They're very similar - you want to write something very catchy and very popular that will appeal to a great number of people. So if you put it up there as a high artistic achievement, you might have to put jingle writing up there, too. And the poster child for both is Barry Manilow. He wrote some of the most successful jingles ever, and he also wrote some of the top selling pop songs. We listen to him now and cringe. Actually I listened to him in the 70's and cringed, but that was pop music back then.

 

 

And let's not forget childrens' music. I almost started a thread on this a few weeks ago. My one year old nephew likes to watch Sesame Street videos on YouTube, and I couldn't help noticing how well-written some of those songs were. Rubber Duckie, C is for Cookie, People in Your Neighborhood, Wet Paint (a new-wave style song that's a particular favorite of mine). I think a lot of musician types feel that its "beneath" them to write something simple and catchy that people can sing along to. Yet I believe if you come at it from that angle, you almost can't go wrong.

 

Would I go as far as to say it's the highest artistic achievement? No. I don't think it's hard to write a potential hit song. There are a lot of factors that come into play for making a song a hit than the actual song itself. A lot of it is having the right connections, timing and of course, luck. Last week's issue of Billboard featured an interview with producer Rob Fusari who was instrumental in getting Lady Gaga's career off the ground, and developing her sound. They ran into so many roadblocks along the way from label people, and she changed her sound about 2 or 3 times (she was originally a rock act, believe it or not), before someone finally took a chance on it. It isn't like she just wrote "Poker Face", and an exec suddenly said "That's it! I'm signing you to a 7 album deal!"

 

But do I believe that writing a simple catchy, relatable song a perfectly valid goal? I'd say yes. And you don't have to veer into Barry Manilow territory to do it. In my opinion, music is something that's supposed to connect people, not alienate them. I would rather write a song that many people can relate to, than something so obscure and off the beaten path that only 3 or 4 people get it.

[BlueStrat]

 

But do I believe that writing a simple catchy, relatable song a perfectly valid goal? I'd say yes.

 

 

My problem with LGG isn't the music, though it isn't my cup of tea and I find much of it utterly forgetable. I just think her schtick is going to get tiresome quickly and has a short shelf life. I put her in the same category as Boy George.