Members gadzooka Posted March 6, 2007 Members Share Posted March 6, 2007 Actually, I first got wind of the SA2200 by reading about it on the LP forum, where someone was extolling it in comparison to a 335. That person got flamed to a crisp for that opinion, if I recall correctly. I simply posted the tenon picture in one or two threads on that topic, but I have not gotten much response. Of course, if I start saying that people ought to choose a Yamaha in lieu of a Gibson, then the firestorm would come my way I'm sure!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RockNote Posted March 6, 2007 Members Share Posted March 6, 2007 Yeah, that's what I thought might happen, from what I hear around here. I have no gripe with Gibson, but nor do I have one of their guitars - and with prices in Denmark being approximately 40% above the US market, it is not really an option for me, the way I look at it. Not unless I immigrate or something. Some of us SA people are gassing for the Yamaha SG2000. Do you have an opinion about that guitar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gadzooka Posted March 6, 2007 Members Share Posted March 6, 2007 Some of us SA people are gassing for the Yamaha SG2000. Do you have an opinion about that guitar? I have never played one. I do think they're beautiful, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jkater Posted March 7, 2007 Members Share Posted March 7, 2007 Curiosity is a good reason! What did the Gibby people reply when you told them of the benefits of a Yamaha (assuming you did)? I think real Gibson players are good at finding the good Gibsons and they own fabulous guitars that fit the bill for them. They don't need to discover the insider tip that the Yamaha SA2200 is simply because they have found guitars that are not only as good as or better than the SA2200 but also have what they are looking for (the "right" shape, the nitro finish, and, as Gibson fans, the name on the headstock). I always posted about my SA2200 for the benefit of those wishing to find a good semi for less than $1500. I also find that Yamaha is a misunderstood company and they deserve to be better known in regards to their top models. But I don't fool myself into thinking that I'll convince Bbreaker to look upon the SA2200 as a terrific alternative to Gibsons! (though I'd love to know what he'd think of it if he tried one. I once asked him and he replied that he had limited experience with Yamahas). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RockNote Posted March 7, 2007 Members Share Posted March 7, 2007 I think real Gibson players are good at finding the good Gibsons and they own fabulous guitars that fit the bill for them. They don't need to discover the insider tip that the Yamaha SA2200 is simply because they have found guitars that are not only as good as or better than the SA2200 but also have what they are looking for (the "right" shape, the nitro finish, and, as Gibson fans, the name on the headstock). I always posted about my SA2200 for the benefit of those wishing to find a good semi for less than $1500. I also find that Yamaha is a misunderstood company and they deserve to be better known in regards to their top models. But I don't fool myself into thinking that I'll convince Bbreaker to look upon the SA2200 as a terrific alternative to Gibsons! (though I'd love to know what he'd think of it if he tried one. I once asked him and he replied that he had limited experience with Yamahas). That makes perfect sense. I can appreciate why Americans want to stick with Gibson (or Fender) through thick and thin. But for me, we are talking about overseas import either way. While I fully acknowledge that the SA2200 is a smashing deal, especially in Europe, I may one day sell mine nevertheless. Okay, I am keeping it for now, but when I come across an ideal LP alternative - solid body, TOM, 24.75" scale, woody/throaty tone with bite, anatomically pleasing to play (meaning a horn on the bass side) at a reasonable price - that's when I may sell it. The thing is, it does not ravish my soul, and that is what I want in a guitar - the unfailing ability to ravish my soul each time I pick it up. My bolt-on HSS Kramer does that for me. Tonewise it is nowhere near the Yamaha, but there is something about it that is magical to me. On top of that, it is probably not a real Kramer, but rather something ESP put together around the time of the demise of the company (it has no serial number). The city where I lived at the time ( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dcindc Posted March 7, 2007 Members Share Posted March 7, 2007 Thanks for this thread. I'd just like to say that the keaggy video was removed. and that Yamaha makes awesome instruments, not just guitars. In fact, everything they make is pretty damn good in it's market. Pie-anners, motor sickles, you name it. oh, and thanks for the GAS! Yamaha is something to aspire to, when I decide to spend more than $200 on another git. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jkater Posted March 7, 2007 Members Share Posted March 7, 2007 That makes perfect sense. I can appreciate why Americans want to stick with Gibson (or Fender) through thick and thin. But for me, we are talking about overseas import either way. While I fully acknowledge that the SA2200 is a smashing deal, especially in Europe, I may one day sell mine nevertheless. Okay, I am keeping it for now, but when I come across an ideal LP alternative - solid body, TOM, 24.75" scale, woody/throaty tone with bite, anatomically pleasing to play (meaning a horn on the bass side) at a reasonable price - that's when I may sell it. The thing is, it does not ravish my soul, and that is what I want in a guitar - the unfailing ability to ravish my soul each time I pick it up. My bolt-on HSS Kramer does that for me. Tonewise it is nowhere near the Yamaha, but there is something about it that is magical to me. On top of that, it is probably not a real Kramer, but rather something ESP put together around the time of the demise of the company (it has no serial number). The city where I lived at the time ( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RockNote Posted March 7, 2007 Members Share Posted March 7, 2007 The SA2200, being a semi, is not the guitar perfectly designed for shred and I always meant to ask you how it behaves being tuned down to Eb. Your use of it has helped me to expand my understanding of how people push the limit of what a guitar can do. But I am not as bold as you are and I tend to use the guitar that most directly fits the sound I need it for. When, on rare occasion, I need a meaty, real fat crunchy sound, I don't bother with the SA, I just grab my Les Paul. Those two guitars cover everything for me. My third electric (Lag) is no cheapo but it is sadly ignored most of the time. I don't sell it because it's very unique and it has memories attached to it. Well, I may have some affinity with shred, but I am first and last a blues-rock-metal guitarist. After writing the above, I realized I forgot to say that I got the SA2200 in the first place because I was momentarily sick and tired of my Kramer tone. I have often wondered if the Kramer had no soul. Why? Because it has always done what I asked of it, instantly and without putting up a fight. All other guitars I've owned have fought me on certain things. When playing the SA2200 I am fighting it vigorously. But the tone is so worth it! I am fighting the smaller frets, the feedback, the lack of screaming overtones, the lacking whammy, the fact that it doesn't stay in a fixed position so that I have to keep pressing the body with the lower part of my picking arm. I have tried the SA2200 with both 9-42 (std. tuning: E) and 10-46 (E, Eb, D, Db, open Gb, open G, and other alt. tunings). For me a 10-46 set suits it better, to a large degree because it lends itself to tuning down to Eb or open Gb, which hit a soft spot. Tuning down to Db and playing though a half-cocked open Crybaby gives a surprisingly pleasing result: you are in death/doom metal territory yet with an undead and woody tone. But needless to say feedback will haunt you, cf. above. The SA2200 plays jazz in ways the Kramer cannot even hope to follow, but then this isn't really my thing. This is one of the things that I have learnt about myself. I had thought that by this time - I am now 38 - I should be getting into T-Bone Walker and John Scofield - I had a dream up being in a T-Bone Walker jam band. While I do like this music with its humorous lyrics, I must admit it doesn't turn me on the way the music I have always loved still does - Van Halen, AC/DC etc. In recent years, what has impressed me the most is Bruce Dickinson's Chemical Wedding. This is what I now aspire to. I want to get into song writing in that vein, writing both lyrics and music. I have never bothered with lyrics before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gadzooka Posted March 7, 2007 Members Share Posted March 7, 2007 The more I play my SA2200, the more I realize that I would be crazy to sell it. In my case, this guitar is delivering exactly the tone and feel that I want in a semi-hollow. I am really curious to go to a nearby store like Mandolin Brothers or Lark Street where I might compare it with a vintage Gibson. Maybe I'm deluded, but I think it would give them a run for their money. Heh, maybe I just haven't heard enought PAF Gibsons! DCinDC, I ought to check out Yamaha for their "pie-anners and motor sickles" . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jkater Posted March 7, 2007 Members Share Posted March 7, 2007 Yesterday, I got curious about what the Gibson LP forum crowd might hear or say about the SA2200 and I went into "the other Gibsons" forum and used the search button. I found that, even there, a few people really had praise for it. They met with the occasionnal sceptical comment but it made me realise that the SA2200 is maybe better known than I thought. Gadzooka was one of the brave ones who dared speaking of it to this sometimes one-minded crowd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jkater Posted March 7, 2007 Members Share Posted March 7, 2007 But take a look at the neck tenon in my SA2200. Definitely more like the older Gibson version. Also of note is the size of the hole that the pickup wire passes through. It is barely wider than the wire itself. Gibson-Memphis removes a large chunk of the maple block, ostensibly to make it easire to deal with the wiring. In the 70's, sometimes the block actually consisted of two uncontinuous blocks, one of mahogany, the other of maple. I guess Yamaha tried to go back closer to the original Gibby recipe. If they ever decide to use nitro finish, they'd probably really get the Gibby fans' notice. Here are a few pics of Gibson 335 tenons. what transpires is that being tight is not an absolute requisite for solidity. My guess is that those Gibson tenons do the job correctly in spite of big gaps. (they look pretty messy though compared to that of the SA2200): Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gadzooka Posted March 8, 2007 Members Share Posted March 8, 2007 JKater, I assume those are all vintage and/or Historic ES-335 examples. The SA2200 is certainly most like these with regard to the tenon size and the minimal routing for pickup wires. In my mind, the SA is more like a Historic 335 (355 actually) than a regular issue one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Berndt111 Posted March 8, 2007 Author Members Share Posted March 8, 2007 What strikes me is the Yamahas cavity does not have the deeper whole on the side of the cavity (for the pick-ups side adjusting screws). Is the yamaha's cavity deeper? I agree that it looks very cleanly made not withstanding that small gap on the side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jkater Posted March 8, 2007 Members Share Posted March 8, 2007 What strikes me is the Yamahas cavity does not have the deeper whole on the side of the cavity (for the pick-ups side adjusting screws). Is the yamaha's cavity deeper? I presume you meant to type "deeper holes" SA2200 owners, take notice: If you ever intend to change the pups in your SA (not necessarily advisable), be aware that the cavity is SHALLOWER that that of Gibsons and the Gibson pups WON'T FIT!!! I made the mistake of putting Gibson pups in mine (for the stupid story on how I ended up getting 490/498 in it instead of 57 classics, I'd have to search the thread where I told it but I won't type it again... ). Anyway, the Gibson pick-ups "legs" had to be shortened and rebent to fit in . Not a good idea if you want to sell them after finding out the Yammie pups were just as good... I will either put the stock ones back or find something real sweet and have the cavities carefully routed to create the room for the new pups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GreatestGains Posted March 18, 2007 Members Share Posted March 18, 2007 Here's a guy who can show you what the AES1500 is cabaple of...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WH8EbI89xgE Guitar by YamahaClothes by Kmart Freddy Kruger Collection Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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