Members cl516 Posted October 19, 2007 Members Share Posted October 19, 2007 We'll all miss Joe. I still can't believe all this happened. I think his press conference said it all. On a side note: toronto media automatically has to drag up the whole highest payrolls thing, tie in some aspect of hockey, and they went on to say Torre was the only good thing going for Yankees, whose captain is an over commercialized ladies man. i can just see it now, Joe leaves and let's see how the Yanks handle all the media distractions in years to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Magpel Posted October 19, 2007 Members Share Posted October 19, 2007 If you watched Jeter play everyday, you wouldn't give a damn about his over-commercialization. He's as real as it gets on the field. Dude hit .430 this year with runners is scoring position--not for a series, like the Indians, but for a season. The only better clutch hitter in MLB is Ortiz, and that's 'cause Papi does it with more uumph. For me, it's all about Jeter, Posada, Bernie, O'Neil, Tino, Brosius, Pettitte, Rivera, Cone, El Duque, Nelson, Stanton, even that idiot headcase Wells...The teams onf the '90s had something really special. Nary an MVP or a Cy young in the lot until Clemens arrived. In the Year when McGwire hit 70 and Sosa hits 66, Tino led the Yankees with 28 HRs. That was MY Yankees. It's been a tough fall from there, not so much because they haven't won titles but because the yanks have resorted to the star-studded approach of the dismal '80s. The only difference between Brosius--a free agent off the scrap heap who hit .202 his last year in Oakland--and A-Rod is that, while both would get only three hits in the postseason, Brosius' three would win ballgames... O'Neil? I hated that trade! We swapped, straight up, an up and coming all star centerfielder in Roberto Kelly for a platoon right fielder. Guess Stick Michael knew better than I did. Knoblauch was an established player, but we gave up real value for him: Eric Milton and Christian Guzman among others. Why I remember when Bernie Williams was considered the lesser of thew two prospects named Williams in the farm system--the other being Gerald. Mussina, Giambi, Sheffield, Kevin Brown, Jaret Wright, Carl Pavano, Javier Vasquez, Randy Johnson A-Rod, Damon, Abreu...it is just plain fatiguing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cl516 Posted October 19, 2007 Members Share Posted October 19, 2007 i hear you magpel, i been watching almost every game last couple years.Jeter is awesome. he plays hard, he plays hurt. my point was - i'm just sick of generic media inaccurately portraying the real deal. meanwhile, i'm still trying to let reality sink in about what's happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members KHAN Posted October 19, 2007 Members Share Posted October 19, 2007 12 seasons. 12 post season appearances. 10 division titles. 6 world series appearances. 4 rings. 1 humiliating kick in the crotch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members antematter Posted October 19, 2007 Members Share Posted October 19, 2007 I think it all started with the collapse in 04' against the Sox. George hasn't let that go. It sucks. Torre led some of the best teams ever and should have been given the chance to continue. The Yanks have a bright future over the next 2-5 years, and Torre already has a relationship with some of the nextgen (Cano, Melky, Chamberlain. Hughes etc.). Thanks Joe. See you in Cooperstown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ernest Buckley Posted October 20, 2007 Author Members Share Posted October 20, 2007 My cousin through marriage is a Red Sox fan who grew up in Boston. Several years ago before he moved to NY, he was telling me how over rated Jeter is. He would make fun of him with the Mr. Intangible line. I told him that if he watched this guy play everyday he would realize just how good he is. Now that he has moved to NY and watches many of the games, he admitted to me he was wrong. On to Posada who to me is the backbone of the Yankees. The Yankees must resign this guy because he was not only running the show on the field, but the guy was running the entire pitching staff. No one knows the pitcher like Posada. He is the most underrated Yankee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members philbo Posted October 20, 2007 Members Share Posted October 20, 2007 (finger in throat) (gagging) baseball? Give me a break!! Or at least wake me when it's over... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elsongs Posted October 20, 2007 Members Share Posted October 20, 2007 I love baseball and all, but I could give a rat's ass about the Evil Empire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Magpel Posted October 20, 2007 Members Share Posted October 20, 2007 (finger in throat) (gagging) baseball? Give me a break!! Or at least wake me when it's over... Even though this a practically a clinical demonstration of passive aggressive behavior (threads, after all, are inert unless you open them), I will accept this as Philbo's concern for the larger cultural atmosphere here. Gotta check the growth of sports talk threads. Like luce strife or kudzu, they tend to wipe out bio-diversity. Over at Dave Bryce's keyboard corner at musicplayer.com, we maintain lively NFL, NBA, and, just as of this year, MLB threads. Non-keyboardists welcome. And the football thread is officially on-topic (It's in the charter; see dB's forum description...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lucky #9 Posted October 21, 2007 Members Share Posted October 21, 2007 I have been a Yankee fan since around 1960 and love baseball. (You can have football, basketball, etc. They pale compared to baseball). I have seen many managers come and go in the Bronx. 12 years=12 playoff appearances for Joe. That being said, I would have fired Joe last year , but he survived. He panicked and did a terrible job with his line-ups. strategy, etc., in the playoffs last season. He often fails to play the "little ball" necessay to win one-run games and relies on the 3-run homerun too much, as his lineup is stocked with All-Stars. :lem: (The Earl Weaver Strategy). Plus, he burns out his Pen. However, the Yankees undoing this year was not Joe's fault and he deserved to be offered the dignity of a two year deal with a reasonable salary. Joe got these boys to the playoffs after a horrible start , perhaps his best effort as a manager during the season. His Ace, Wong, pitched like his pants were on fire in two games and gave the Bombers no chance. (By the way, a five-game series in the first round is insufficient: All playoff series should be Best-Of-7). Young stud, Jaba the Hutt, was overwhelmed by hostile Cleveland midges who saboutaged him on the mound, swarming around his face like the little bastards that they are, as he lost his usual pinpoint control. The Men In Blue sucked here...the game should have been stopped until the bug situation was under control. They stop it for rain and other hostile conditions, don't they? This was worse...and it was a more important playoff game. A-Rod was A-Absent once again ; Jeter should have stayed home (hit into 3 DPs, bad throw, etc.); Posada disappeared as he often does in the playoffs; Matsui was a no-show; they got nothing from their first basemen. Only bright spot was Cano with some worthwhile contributions from Abreau, Melky, and Damon. The Rocket was a dud...and they wasted a well-pitched game from Andy. Joe must have needed an incentive clause ! He must not have really wanted to win. The Yankees are taking a beating back here on talk show radio and in the papers . Old Joe deserved better (and this is from a guy who says he has flaws in the way he sometimes manages a game and how he burns out his bullpen every year). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Cry Logic Posted October 21, 2007 Members Share Posted October 21, 2007 This pales into insignificance compared to the West Coast Eagles sacking Ben Cousins based on false information from a few overzealous policemen.. And now the cops have dropped the charges!!!!I'm sorry but I'm with Ben on this one....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cl516 Posted October 21, 2007 Members Share Posted October 21, 2007 lucky #9 , i hear you man, i hear you. on a side note:i wake up this morning, and ... what??a freaking 'statement' from HANK steinbrenner PLUS the stuff about Paul Byrd who happens to be the guy who pitched to us in game 4 recently... wow, i really need a cup of coffee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members philbo Posted October 21, 2007 Members Share Posted October 21, 2007 Even though this a practically a clinical demonstration of passive aggressive behavior (threads, after all, are inert unless you open them), I will accept this as Philbo's concern for the larger cultural atmosphere here. Gotta check the growth of sports talk threads. Like luce strife or kudzu, they tend to wipe out bio-diversity. Over at Dave Bryce's keyboard corner at musicplayer.com, we maintain lively NFL, NBA, and, just as of this year, MLB threads. Non-keyboardists welcome. And the football thread is officially on-topic (It's in the charter; see dB's forum description...) Yep, P-A, that's me alrighty! Actually I don't have anything specific against sports, if they are actually sports rather than corporate profit centers. Give me an afternoon playing anything with friends in the backyard, and I'm there, baby! But staring at a TV screen in a semi-autistic state for 4 hours at a time while boring announcers wade through boring statistics regarding boring players, punctuated by boring commercials just isn't my idea of a good day... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Billster Posted October 22, 2007 Members Share Posted October 22, 2007 . But that's the team they give him. Does he have much choice? He ends up with a guy like Giambi batting sixth or seventh, is he gonna have the guy bunt to keep things moving? Giambi can barely walk after the steroid withdrawal symptoms; his only option to try and hit home runs because anything that stays in the park is going to be an out or a single, and then he's a going to clog up the basepaths if he has to try to run to the next base. :poke: The bullpen gets burned because they go out and get 45 year old pitchers who run out of gas after 5 innings instead of 7 or 8. :poke: And then they compound the pressure on good players who you can visibly see tensing up. Does April A-Rod strike out on three Paul Byrd junkballs? :poke: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Magpel Posted October 22, 2007 Members Share Posted October 22, 2007 Yep, P-A, that's me alrighty! ... of course not... ...But staring at a TV screen in a semi-autistic state for 4 hours at a time while boring announcers wade through boring statistics regarding boring players, punctuated by boring commercials just isn't my idea of a good day... Really sports is just another form of storytelling--improvised play within fixed structures. If the "mythic" aspect doesn't sing to you, it's hard to get really involved. I'm such a fan of team sports that, even though my rooting interestd have weakened or in some cases disappeared entirely, my interest has not flagged at all (for example I am a big fan of the NBA with no favorite team.) I keep or a bass a guitar lying around wjhen I watch games. Sometimes surprising what you come up with when your distracted. Not that I recommend this as a method, or anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Magpel Posted October 22, 2007 Members Share Posted October 22, 2007 This is why being a Yankee fan has become a joyless experience. They trade in reputations rather than developmental prospects, so we rarely get the joy of watching a player stumble, fall, get up, and learn to become a professional (do you REALLY think that Melky is the CF of the future? Do you really think it won't be Torii Hunter or Aaron Rowand or the Oakland guy out there in a season or two?) Imagine what it is like to be a young Rockies fan--goodness graciouos five or six of their starter were Colorado draft picks, and their Mattingly figure, Helton, is there to mentor. Under the current paradigm, it will be a long while before the Yankees will know that kind of organic sports satisfaction again, all becuase of the myth that "you can't rebuild in New York." There may be some holes in the theory, but I am a devoted adherent to the idea that it was George's banishment from baseball that allowed Stick Michael, et al, the freedom and serenity to build the core of the great '90s teams. This is not a story without tension and dissonance, however. It was still George's money that brought in the good free agent pitchers (Key, Cone, Wells, Stanton, Nelson) and that enabled the Yankees to do what K.C. and Pit can not: re-sign their homegrown stars when they are in the height of their money making years. George is an ass, but he is a snetimental ass. Remember, after hardlining it, he finally caved and wouldn't let Bernie go to Boston. They hugged and expressed great devotion to each other, and then the Yanks won two more titles. It takes money, even, to do it the right way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ernest Buckley Posted October 23, 2007 Author Members Share Posted October 23, 2007 I don`t know Levine but it just sounded like Levine has put a lot more $$$ in the Yankees pockets than Torre. Granted, attendance went from 2 to 4 million in Torres tenure but Levine put the Yanks on the global radar from what I understand and this seems to be what the Yankees are about. I don`t think its about winning world series anymore. I think its important that they have these all star line up that draws attention at home and on the road. The thin line here is that if the Yanks are not successful, their global mindshare goes down as well. No one wears apparel of a loser. When was the last time you saw someone wearing a Royals hat? So the Yankees need to continue to put a winning team on the field and continue to dominate the global market. From what we have heard, Levine and Torre did not care for each other so maybe that had something to do with it but if we are looking at this from a pure baseball standpoint, Cashman should have gotten the boot. How much money has this guy thrown away over his tenure? EB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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