Rack Preamp/PowerAmp Advice

[Cubed]

Hey folks,

 

I'm interested in building a rack from the ground up. I've looked at a lot of options and I'm really struggling to figure out which preamps would best suit my needs.

 

My band currently covers a variety of bands that fall into Hard Rock, Punk, Rock/Pop. I wanted a preamp that would allow me to dial in settings so that with a midi controller I could change quickly from one unique sound to the next. There's a few preamps out there that I think would probably suit my needs.. Ada MP-1, Marshall JMP-1, Mesa Triaxis. However aside from the Mp1 the JMP and the Triaxis start getting kinda expensive. I've also been looking at stuff like Mesa Studio and Carvin Quad X.. but the Mesa Studio just has two channels and I'm not sure if that would suit my needs. I don't want to have to go back to the rack and adjust knobs.

 

Speaking for poweramps, I've been seeing ppl with Carvin TS100, Mesa Dynawatt 20/20, Mesa 20:50, Marshall EL84/EL34... Probably wont' buy something I can't find for around $500 or less.

 

Basically, I'm trying to find a versatile solution that is priced around 600 to 1000 for both the Preamp and Poweramp. Cheaper the better. My current gear is a Vox AD50VT with some craptastic stompboxes. It does the job for now but it really doesn't sound great.

 

Does anyone know of preamp/poweramps that I might have overlooked that are good buys?

[injected]

damn budget limitations.. id say go triaxis and vht 2/50/2 but its too much.

 

Get yourself a killer preamp like the Engl e530 and a cheaper poweramp(mesa 20/20, carvin stuff)

[XelderX]

The Peavey tube power amps are nice and relatively cheap compared to what you've been looking at.

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Peavey-Classic-50-50-100w-Power-Amp_W0QQitemZ280341978542QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item4145af1dae&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A1%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Peavey-Classic-50-50-100w-stereo-all-tube-power-amp_W0QQitemZ190304914189QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item2c4f0e8b0d&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A1%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

 

I played through one of these before selling it and switching to a Peavey Classic 60/60. The 50/50 is a little more versatile with the resonance and presence adjustment on the front panel compared to the 60/60, but I'm sure you would be happy with either model. I've got a Rocktron Prophesy preamp that I could be persuaded to part with (worth around $400 used). It's pretty versatile with all the built in effects and easily controled via midi. That would easily get you within your budget.

[ambient]

I can vouch for the peavey classic 50/50. got it for less than 500 australian.

could probably find them cheaper.

[jimosity]

+1 on the Peavey 50/50...or a Mesa 50/50 -- both are at good prices.

Are you sticking with tubes? If not, you could get something like the GSP1101 and cover a lot of ground with that for a good price. It sounds as good or better than some of the tube preamps you've listed.

I absolutely LOVE Engl tone, one of my biggest mistakes in gear history was selling my Powerball, but I've had three e530 preamps and hated every one, not sure I agree with that suggestion.

 

I've got several ADAs and while they can be great; they are a bit noisy, so you'll have to factor in a noise gate, plus they are slow to tweak on the fly without having knobs...and you're pretty limited to the type of tone it gives.

Cleans are not so great and with the age of those units these days, reliability should be at least on your radar. (Don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking ADA, I've got a bunch of ADA gear...but I don't know that I would trust any of them as my main and only preamp).

It might be at the top of your price range; but for available modules and tonal options, a Randall RM4 and a couple modules would be a great investment.

[petejt]

 

I can vouch for the peavey classic 50/50. got it for less than 500 australian. could probably find them cheaper.

 

 

That sounds good!

 

 

If I could afford it I'd get that.

 

 

How about a solid-state poweramp? There are some better ones out there, but I can't make any recommendations as I don't have any experience with them.

 

But I have been considering the Crate Powerblock for a bit now. Would that one be worth looking into?

[jimosity]

 

That sounds good! If I could afford it I'd get that. How about a solid-state poweramp? There are some better ones out there, but I can't make any recommendations as I don't have any experience with them. But I have been considering the Crate Powerblock for a bit now. Would that one be worth looking into?

 

 

The Crate PowerBlock is a monster little amp.

I use two of them with my AxeFX rig when I don't want to lug my VHT 2/90/2 and they are awesome.

Just run your preamp into the FX return on the back and it's LOUD and weighs next to nothing.

 

On it's own, when you dime the gain of the PowerBlock, it's silly loud and has a pretty good old school AC/DC sorta tone.

[petejt]

 

The Crate PowerBlock is a monster little amp. I use two of them with my AxeFX rig when I don't want to lug my VHT 2/90/2 and they are awesome. Just run your preamp into the FX return on the back and it's LOUD and weighs next to nothing. On it's own, when you dime the gain of the PowerBlock, it's silly loud and has a pretty good old school AC/DC sorta tone.

 

 

Sounds good!!

 

I like the part too that it has the older AC/DC type tone. I prefer the tone of TNT to their later albums.

 

I've been thinking of getting one as a second poweramp, to run a second single from my MarkIV.

[mohowski]

For preamps, i've got an ADA MP-1 and a Rocktron Piranha and a Peavey Classic 50/50 for the power.

 

The peavey classic 50/50 is a great no-frills tube power amp. I've been using one for 6 years and love it for hard rock/punk/metal.

 

For preamps, the ADA Mp-1 is great for Marshall-y classic rock and early thrash sounding stuff, and the clean channel is awesome too. I use one pretty regularly for lower gain stuff, and they're pretty versatile. Lots of mods available if you want to change the voicing to something with more gain or less gain or a more agressive modern sound.

 

If you're looking for a more modern distortion in a MIDI controllable tube preamp, I highly recommend the Rocktron Piranha. In addition to a good clean channel it has 2 channels of OD tones - a "classic" OD which sounds kinda marshally and similar to the Mp-1 to me, and then a "modern" mode which gets really gainy and heavy when you really need over-the-top distortion. The EQ also has a mid-frequency knob so you can change the mids level which makes the EQ much more versatile than the MP-1's in my opinion. I've seen piranhas on the 'Bay for $250-$300.

 

My $0.02 on teh subject

[thermionic geek]

There are a ton (pun intended) of inexpensive solid state guitar power amps around. I would recommend the Mosvalve 1130 or 962 power amps. The Digitech/Hafler amps are also good.

 

For preamps, I have an upgraded 2112 to 2120 preamp and like it very much. effects may not be your thing but you can get a Digitech 2112 or 2120 pretty cheap these days and the tube distortion sounds pretty good. I also gig with a Rocktron voodoo valve. It was simply the best sounding preamp I tried. I tried the prophesy, the JMP1, and the triaxis and the voodoo valve just had the tone I wanted.

 

I generally run the preamp into the effects loop return on one of my marshall heads rather than use a rack power amp. I also like the look of the half stack on stage and I can hide the rack behind it.

[mohowski]

OOOoooooh, if you're shooting for cheap-cheap, there are the Rocktron Pro-Gap and Pro-Gap ultra preamps that are solid state, midi controllable, and dirt cheap. I snagged a pro-gap for 30 bucks last year, and a pro-gap Ultra for 100. The pro-gap ultra is an awesome preamp for clean stuff and heavy stuff, but the distortion isn't as smooth as either the MP-1 or piranha. They're really good if you want good cleans, and good balls-to-the-wall abrasive heavy stuff. The in-between stuff is OK but not stellar.

[ripper6192003]

How do you place these units in the correct and optimal order in a rack system??

 

Furman Power Conditioner

Sonic Maximizer

EQ

Noise gate

Berhinger VAmp

 

I want to use the Vamp for my delays/echo and reverb. I want to use my Digitech RP500 for my detuner,stomps,amp sims,cab sims. How do I hook all this up correctly??

[Cubed]

Hey guys, thanks for all the suggestions. I ended up finding a great deal on a JMP-1 so I took it. I'm still kinda figuring out what power amp to pair with it. Initially I was thinking one of the Marshall amps to go along with the theme but I've heard ppl have reliability issues with them breaking down a lot... I don't know the validity on that though. I really like the way they look though haha. I think I would really like a VHT 2:50 but damn those are expensive. I'm in no hurry to finish this build as I want to make sure what I buy is absolutely what I am going to be happy with and at a good price.

 

So considering I have a JMP on the way.. what would some power amp recommendations be to have that preamp sing? I also want to keep in mind speaker selections as well. For the music i'm playing, am I looking at Greenbacks or something else more appropriate?

[petejt]

 

I want to use the Vamp for my delays/echo and reverb. I want to use my Digitech RP500 for my detuner,stomps,amp sims,cab sims. How do I hook all this up correctly??

 

 

 

 

Furman Power Conditioner -> In the top of the rack, to provide power for the rack units

 

Berhinger VAmp -> Second from top, the first thing to process the signal. Connect the following items in its effects loop, if it has one

 

EQ -> In between the VAmp & Noise gate

 

Noise gate -> After the EQ

 

Digitech RP500 -> After the noise gate, before the fx return of the VAmp.

 

Sonic Maximizer -> IN THE BIN

[petejt]

I generally run the preamp into the effects loop return on one of my marshall heads rather than use a rack power amp. I also like the look of the half stack on stage and I can hide the rack behind it.

 

Good idea!!

[jimosity]

Be careful with the gate after the V-Amp if it's providing your delay/verb...the gate could kill your repeats.

I'd definitely agree about the Sonic Maximizer in the bin though.

 

 

Furman Power Conditioner -> In the top of the rack, to provide power for the rack units Berhinger VAmp -> Second from top, the first thing to process the signal. Connect the following items in its effects loop, if it has one EQ -> In between the VAmp & Noise gate Noise gate -> After the EQ Digitech RP500 -> After the noise gate, before the fx return of the VAmp. Sonic Maximizer -> IN THE BIN

 

[ripper6192003]

Just to let u know the rp500 is not a rack unit. Its a pedalboard.In the bin??? What does that mean?? Do you mean throw it away or sell it or something???

[jimosity]

[ambient]

To be fair guys, maybe a VAMP is the kinda turb BBEs like to polish. To put it crudely, not dissing your gear.

 

It could be benificial in that rig.

[jimosity]

Actually, for the money - the VAmp Pro is an awesome little unit.

I prefer it to the Pod XT Pro and it's considerably less money.

[ripper6192003]

1st learn to spell. Second I like them, I think they sound great. And my salesman/tech info guy from sweetwater.com agrees that they are great. How come Scott Ian uses one?? And a ton of other really famous guitar player on the pro/touring level.......they don't have S*** gear and they use them..??? What ever. This site sux balls.

[bigjd]

 

Hey guys, thanks for all the suggestions. I ended up finding a great deal on a JMP-1 so I took it. I'm still kinda figuring out what power amp to pair with it. Initially I was thinking one of the Marshall amps to go along with the theme but I've heard ppl have reliability issues with them breaking down a lot... I don't know the validity on that though. I really like the way they look though haha. I think I would really like a VHT 2:50 but damn those are expensive. I'm in no hurry to finish this build as I want to make sure what I buy is absolutely what I am going to be happy with and at a good price. So considering I have a JMP on the way.. what would some power amp recommendations be to have that preamp sing? I also want to keep in mind speaker selections as well. For the music i'm playing, am I looking at Greenbacks or something else more appropriate?

 

 

 

Still got a Peavey Classic 120/120 for sale.

[XelderX]

How come Scott Ian uses one?? And a ton of other really famous guitar player on the pro/touring level.......they don't have S*** gear and they use them..??? What ever. This site sux balls.

 

 

 

 

Probably because Mr. Ian was using them back in the early 90s when they were all the rage and he was trying to make his Marshalls sound like something they were not. Now he is playing through Randall V-max heads so his gear is only slightly better than yours. I guess a BBE could be useful if everything from the pickups to the speakers you're using is crap gear. I have 7 12ax7 tubes in my preamp and my power amp has 3 12ax7s and 4 6L6s. How many tubes are in your setup? The BBe is a bandaid fix to a much bigger problem.

[ambient]

Not saying it's not, just that the BBE tends to do it's job best on modellers etc.

[petejt]