Who has built a Warmoth guitar?

[k4df4l]

 

And at the end of the day, an emcrae custom guitar is still just a custom guitar from a maker that nobody's ever heard of and it will be perceived and valued that way. It doesn't matter if you make the best guitar on the planet. If the name of the guitar isn't something that people recognize, they aren't gonna pay a lot of money for one on the used market.

 

 

I agree.

 

 

No offense emcrae,but truthfully when it comes down to brass tacks on resale and the like, what's the difference between a Warmoth partscaster and a build from a guy no one outside of a couple forums has heard of? The value of any lifetime warranty at that point is questionable as well.

[badbrain]

 

But...if it's a true custom instrument you're after, then a Warmoth parts guitar is the furthest thing from it. Because, like I said earlier, in the end, you haven't built a custom.....you've just assembled some prefab parts to make a parts guitar.

 

 

I strongly disagree with this. Custom shop necks are CNC'd and finished by hand, so was my warmoth neck and body.

 

I think there are two separate factors here, the quality of the instrument and the perceived value of an instrument, and they are apples and oranges. Is my 'partscaster' on par with the quality of a custom shop strat? I'm not ashamed to admit that it absolutely is. On par with a Suhr? probably. This of course is just my opinion. My point is that it is absolutely possible to get the same level of quality out of Warmoth or USA Custom as you would from the custom shop. Probably not with the first guitar you build, but is is possible. And in my opinion, the only difference between my guitar and a Suhr, is that nobody knows my name.

[EricFoss]

 

That's why I made the comment that I made earlier. If it's the learning experience that you're after or you just enjoy putting one together yourself, then maybe it's OK. But if the end result you're after is a true custom guitar, then you should consult a reputable builder. Because, I'm sorry to say, but it's just a fact......at the end of the day, a Warmoth guitar is still just a partscaster. And when or if it's time to resell or trade, it will be perceived and valued that way. That's just the way it is. And their 1 year warranty is really the moot point because that's actually just about the amount of time a guitar needs to play and wear itself in good. So you're warranty is gone right when the instrument is coming into it's own. Also, another point worth mentioning, with Warmoth or any other parts suppliers, you're limited to the options they offer and what they have available at any given time. With a custom builder, most of the time, you're options will be virtually unlimited. Quality of materials is another concern. Warmoth as well as others have some quite decent products but they buy in bulk and they pull of the top as they get to it. Custom builders, specifically myself, buy in smaller quantities and handpick and choose the woods they work with. Not only for looks and beauty but for correct and optimum grain structure. There are countless other points that could be brought up but bottom line is this......if you want the experience of building it yourself and can live with the end results, then Warmoth may be the perfect solution for you. Believe me, I fully understand that....I love what I do. But...if it's a true custom instrument you're after, then a Warmoth parts guitar is the furthest thing from it. Because, like I said earlier, in the end, you haven't built a custom.....you've just assembled some prefab parts to make a parts guitar.

 

 

 

Jeez. That's ridiculous.

 

I'm not trying to be rude, but why is your custom guitar going to be worth more than my custom guitar (that I built with wood from Warmoth)? I and most everyone else has never heard of you. Your model and my model are on an even playing field, I'd imagine.

 

At least with my model, I hand picked each and every part and was involved in every step of the manufacturing process...

[emcrae]

 

Jeez. That's ridiculous. I'm not trying to be rude, but why is your custom guitar going to be worth more than my custom guitar (that I built with wood from Warmoth)? I and most everyone else has never heard of you. Your model and my model are on an even playing field, I'd imagine. At least with my model, I hand picked each and every part and was involved in every step of the manufacturing process...

 

 

I'm not trying to offend anyone in any way. I'm just stating simple facts. Furthermore, you didn't "build" your guitar with wood from Warmoth......you assembled it with parts prebuilt from Warmoth. And unless you physically went to the Warmoth facility, you didn't hand pick anything and you certainly weren't involved in the manufacturing process. Also, my statements here were not meant to be directed at me or my business. So you don't know me or have never heard of me. That's fine. Plenty have. But you haven't. BUT...I'm sure their are some quality reputable builders that you have heard of that are selling customs in the same price range. And those instruments will hold far greater resale value to those who have also heard of those builders. And will most likely be of far better quality. If you doubt what I'm saying about the values of part-guitars, visit the "for sale" forum here and see for yourself what they bring. Very sad but it's a far cry less than what they cost or what they're probably worth in all reality. At any rate, it's certainly not worth getting into a cyber-argument over. The biggest difference is this....had you rather have a truly handmade custom built for you to your every spec and need or had you rather have a guitar that you assembled with manufactured parts from an outside source. Not saying either is correct. Only you can decide what's correct for YOU. My involvement in this discussion was simply to point out that for what you spend on a parts-guitar, most of the time, a true custom build can be had. And in that case, it will most likely be suited and built more to your needs than a parts assembled guitar.

[k4df4l]

I agree that you've presented a good argument for custom builders and at the same time provided another aspect to the conversation by bringing your guitars into the discussion. I'm not picking on you; your situation really illustrates the uphill battle a custom builder has before establishing a name and rep:

 

Just think about if I see one of your guitars on Ebay by a customer, used.

 

I google your company name and what do I find? Not much of anything 'cept a couple threads on forums...no website, no business address, no DBA info or business history/presence. Warranty? If you get hit by a bus tomorrow, who's going to honor your lifetime warranty? How do I know you're not going to hang this up to start a landscaping business next month? Are you a legit registered business doing this full time or some dude part time in your basement? I have no way to answer any of these questions independently so the value of your instrument is immediately undermined because it's a series of unknown elements.....just like the partscaster.

 

Now, your guitars could be excellent and I have no doubt they are..you just get short changed by being somewhat obscure.

[emcrae]

 

I agree that you've presented a good argument for custom builders and at the same time provided another aspect to the conversation by bringing your guitars into the discussion. I'm not picking on you; your situation really illustrates the uphill battle a custom builder has before establishing a name and rep: Just think about if I see one of your guitars on Ebay by a customer, used. I google your company name and what do I find? Not much of anything 'cept a couple threads on forums...no website, no business address, no DBA info or business history/presence. Warranty? If you get hit by a bus tomorrow, who's going to honor your lifetime warranty? How do I know you're not going to hang this up to start a landscaping business next month? Are you a legit registered business doing this full time or some dude part time in your basement? I have no way to answer any of these questions independently so the value of your instrument is immediately undermined because it's a series of unknown elements.....just like the partscaster. Now, your guitars could be excellent and I have no doubt they are..you just get short changed by being somewhat obscure.

 

 

Well put, but you, as well as a few others, act as if I entered this discussion trying to plug for or advertise my business and I did not. Nowhere in this discussion have I tried to persuade the sale or purchase of MY guitars. I posted the links to two of them strictly to show for example that custom builds can be had within that price range. I never mentioned my company name although I do see and realize now that it is in my signature. At any rate, I certainly was not trying to advertise in any fashion. Also, one other fact you failed to mention but sort of insenuated is about reputability. You're correct about resale value vs notoriety and reputation. But, as reputation increases, so does price. You won't find the widely well-known custom builders selling a guitar in the 1200 price range. They'll more likely be 3K and up. Still doesn't change the fact that you can still find some very nice, quality builders that may or may not be known that build with high quality and at an affordable price. I've been fortunate enough that, for the most part, word of mouth, has kept me busy. Eventually, I will slow down and establish a nice website. Something I greatly need to do. But that's not the issue or the topic here. As I said, it's simply a matter of whether you can get exactly what you want or need from a parts supplier or rather from a custom builder and which is more or less cost effective. If you're a DIYer, then by all means...knock yourself out and assemble one yourself. Like I said earlier, I fully understand that. But if you're not, there are other options that may be far better suited and far more cost effective. And pointing out that fact was my only intent in entering this discussion.

[k4df4l]

Well put, but you, as well as a few others, act as if I entered this discussion trying to plug for or advertise my business and I did not. Nowhere in this discussion have I tried to persuade the sale or purchase of MY guitars. I posted the links to two of them strictly to show for example that custom builds can be had within that price range. I never mentioned my company name although I do see and realize now that it is in my signature. At any rate, I certainly was not trying to advertise in any fashion.

 

No, I don't really think you were trying to advertise...you threw out a parallel using your experience (which I appreciate that perspective btw). The points I find interesting and wanted to discuss further were the warranty and resale factors you mentioned.

[mdog114]

 

I like their stuff. When you do it right, they play real nice.

[emcrae]

No, I don't really think you were trying to advertise...you threw out a parallel using your experience (which I appreciate that perspective btw). The points I find interesting and wanted to discuss further were the warranty and resale factors you mentioned.

 

Maybe my point will be a little more evident if I approach this from a slightly different angle and aspect. Let's suppose you are the buyer. You have 1200 to spend on one of two guitars. The two guitars are on a table in front of you. Guitar 1 was assembled by a guy who puts together 2 or 3 a year. It has a fit and finish that you'd expect from Warmoth finished bodies and necks. And we'll assume that Warmoth will honor the 1 year warranty since it's passing hands from the original purchaser. Guitar 2 is the exact same guitar but was built by a custom luthier who you've not heard of but know to make a fulltime living building custom guitars. It has a fit and finish that you should expect a nice custom to have. And has a lifetime warranty. As you have to purchase one of the two, which do you choose? Does that scenario help establish my point a little clearer as far as parts-guitar vs. custom when it comes to resale?

 

Now as far as the warranty issue is concerned, I see your point. But you should ask yourself this.......what would any custom builder have to gain by not honoring his/her warranty? All of the custom luthiers I know or know of right now offer a lifetime warranty that's honored for their lifetime as an active luthier. Now I realize that could be construed as subjective, but I can tell you, coming from me....I'm 42 years old and I don't have any inclination to be changing professions this late in the game and I certainly hope I'm not hit by a truck tommorow. So, having said that, most if not all of us, simply put, can not afford NOT to honor the warranty and, in fact, also bend and be quite flexible with it as well. Why? Because if we want to continue to make our living in this field, we simply can not afford any bad word of mouth. I can't speak for anyone else, but I can tell you hole-heartedly that that binds me to my warranty policy. Bottom line...without happy customers, you don't have customers.

[scolfax]

 

I disagree. I've built two Warmoths and ended up with Custom Shop level instruments for about the price of a standard MIA Fender...and that was with Warmoth doing the finish.

 

 

+1, that's how I feel about mine. I would put up my Warmoth against an off the rack American Fender any day. I've never tried a Custom Shop guitar, but I just can't see how they could be any better sounding or playing, and mine cost probably about half as much. Having said that, I would have to part out my guitar to sell it, and I don't think I'd get all that much for the parts.

[k4df4l]

 

Maybe my point will be a little more evident if I approach this from a slightly different angle and aspect. Let's suppose you are the buyer.

 

 

I think we're kinda going 'round in circles now. I still see the point you're trying to make and recognize it has some validity.

[almightycrunch]

I end up having to post in these threads just because..... Listen, If you wish to "assemble" yourself a Warmoth guitar, go ahead and do it. Do it for YOU, and YOU only. This is generally done by someone who wishes to decide exactly what they want on THEIR guitar. The last thing "I" think you should be thinking about when building a Warmoth is resale or trade-in value, because it wont be there, dont expect it to be either. You are buying quality pieces, the guitar itself will be worth more in parts than it will as a whole guitar. The average Warmoth "assembler" is more than likely someone with a bit of experience, who is not foolish enough to think that he can sell it for what he has into it. When I put my Warmoth strat together, I bought exactly what I wanted, and put together one of the most toneful guitars I have ever played. My guitar is a chambered alder with a maple cap, thick and rock solid boatneck neck, loaded with Kinman AvN blues pickups and harness, Am Std trem with Callaham block, sperzel lockers, schaller locks. My guitar was played by a couple of local musicians who also work at a local music store, they had a Suhr of some sort hanging in there the previous week, and BOTH of them swore up and down that my strat sounded and played a thousand times better than that Suhr did.

 

[almightycrunch]

Heres a shot of fellow HCAF'er Weathered playing my strat at a MPLS/ST PAUL mini ampfest a couple of years ago, notice the little smile on his face???? he said, "Man!, I gotta get me one of these strats!!!!"

 

[vintage clubber]

 

swamp ash body, maple neck with ebony board, abalone dot inlays. pickup/control set up is a combination of Robin Ranger and Danelectro DC-3. I just ordered a replacement pickguard in red tortoise. It will be slightly different with the control pots centered and I am adding a mini switch to get series/split/parallel out of the neck neck humbucker like I did on my Squier CV.

[Shask]

I like their stuff. When you do it right, they play real nice.

 

This one is pretty sweet! What are the specs?

[mdog114]

 

This one is pretty sweet! What are the specs?

 

 

Thanks! It's a great guitar.

 

I used 6100 wire for frets, Ebony FB over a Padauk neck just like the body. The body is chambered and has a traditional 6 screw trem with all 5 springs (11-52 strings). The neck has a 10-16" compound radius fingerboard and an 1.75" Earvana nut. Pickups are Dimarzio, a ToneZone humbucker in the bridge, VV Heavy Blues in the middle and VV Blues in the neck.

[SuperAmerMetal]

I have one on the way, a basswood strat with maple/rosewood neck, wolfgang neck profile and hardtail bridge. PAF Joe neck/Evolution bridge, 16" fretboard radius with 6100 frets, standard tuners, nut etc... Should be an awesome guitar to bring to a friend's house and just have fun with without dealing with a floyd rose. The whole guitar costs around 1,000 including professional setup, and I get a pretty unique, but also useful blend of specs.

[IPlayMetronome]

My Warmoth build is my #1. I came in at just shy of $700,but i did all the finish work myself. Tung oil on the neck and Reranch Nitro Copper.I would not hesitate to build another,but for now i don't want anything nearly as "Custom" as this

 

[DaveAronow]

Maybe my point will be a little more evident if I approach this from a slightly different angle and aspect. Let's suppose you are the buyer. You have 1200 to spend on one of two guitars. The two guitars are on a table in front of you. Guitar 1 was assembled by a guy who puts together 2 or 3 a year. It has a fit and finish that you'd expect from Warmoth finished bodies and necks. And we'll assume that Warmoth will honor the 1 year warranty since it's passing hands from the original purchaser. Guitar 2 is the exact same guitar but was built by a custom luthier who you've not heard of but know to make a fulltime living building custom guitars. It has a fit and finish that you should expect a nice custom to have. And has a lifetime warranty. As you have to purchase one of the two, which do you choose? Does that scenario help establish my point a little clearer as far as parts-guitar vs. custom when it comes to resale? Now as far as the warranty issue is concerned, I see your point. But you should ask yourself this.......what would any custom builder have to gain by not honoring his/her warranty? All of the custom luthiers I know or know of right now offer a lifetime warranty that's honored for their lifetime as an active luthier. Now I realize that could be construed as subjective, but I can tell you, coming from me....I'm 42 years old and I don't have any inclination to be changing professions this late in the game and I certainly hope I'm not hit by a truck tommorow. So, having said that, most if not all of us, simply put, can not afford NOT to honor the warranty and, in fact, also bend and be quite flexible with it as well. Why? Because if we want to continue to make our living in this field, we simply can not afford any bad word of mouth. I can't speak for anyone else, but I can tell you hole-heartedly that that binds me to my warranty policy. Bottom line...without happy customers, you don't have customers.

 

so if I buy precut and sized pieces of lumber and use them to "make" a house with. I didnt "build" the house? I just assembled it?

 

[Assumer]

Here is my current warmoth. The knobs are now the proper black.

[emcrae]

so if I buy precut and sized pieces of lumber and use them to "make" a house with. I didnt "build" the house? I just assembled it?

 

When the discussion gets to the point where it's that childish, it's time for me to leave. Good luck to you all.

[Prages]

FWIW, I agree that putting together a Warmoth guitar or any Partsocaster is not "building" a guitar, but assembling one. Especially with quality parts like Warmoth where everything goes together so easy that you don't really have to have a lot of skill to put the thing together. The setup requires some know-how, but to just put the thing together is pretty basic.

 

I still say that when it comes to resale value, it makes no difference whether it's a Warmoth or a custom build from an unknown maker. You're not going to do well at all with the resale.