Flying back to Europe from the US with a guitar...

[TeenOnTheMoon]

PLAN:

 

Buy a (Fender Jazzmaster) guitar from an online shop and have it delivered to the hotel of a TRUSTED friend staying in the USA for holidays for a week or so. Ask the friend to cut the strings, unscrew the neck, put the neck in the shipped luggage and the body in the hand luggage thus avoiding international shipping and bloody custom duties.

 

Great plan or tinfoil hat lunacy?

 

What could go more wrong than having the guitar sent from the shop, with time spent at the customs to clear etc? what are cabin luggage restrictions when flying from the US to the UK these days?

 

[Jkater]

The customs in Europe will still be asking you where it comes from , how much you paid, etc. The hand luggage has a certain size over which you can't go over.

Cut the strings? Why don't you just remove them?

[lonerstoenr]

Look into your airline - they will usually determine whether luggage is allowable - and may have a guideline as what is allowed.

 

I'd be surprised if customs hit your friend up on arrival back into the country for tax though - it's not as if souvenirs get taxed, although I could be mistaken.

[GRANKOR]

Last year I brought a bass back from the US. Just walked straight through nothing to declare with it.

[soundcreation]

Uhhh.... you have to go through customs with your shipped bag and your carry on bag you know. So if he gets pulled aside for a search they are going to find a neck in one bag and a body in another both brand new and if he didn't declare it's value then he'll be looking pretty bad. Customs agents aren't stupid...they are going to know what your trying to do.

 

The only thing you can hope is he's not chosen for a search.

[Sanddancer]

I have an *ahem* friend that just came back 2 weeks ago to the UK from San Francisco with a shiny new Explorer. He just bought a handful of stickers for the case, stuck a couple of old looking straps around the case adding a bit of security and flew back with it in it's hard case. He flew Air France and asked at check in whether he could take the huge case as hand luggage and they said he couldn't, but to take it onto the plane by hand and give it to a stewardess who stowed it in a storage locker at the front of the plane. No problems at all. He then had a connecting flight on a plane too small to have spare locker space so carried it to the plane again by hand and just before boarding, handed it to the crew who put it in the baggage hold, but it gets strapped up there by hand, separate from all the regular cases etc. Once the plane landed they got it out and gave it to him as he was leaving the plane, no baggage handlers involved.

As for customs, he just waltzed through without any questions being asked, either when getting scanned or through passport control.

The case came through without a scratch and the guitar plays like a dream.

[SirJackdeFuzz]

I took an SG w HSC from Miami to Mancherster in 2004 with ZERO problems.

 

Flew Delta and Lufthansa, and then BA.

 

Guitar was with me in the cabin all the way !

[TeenOnTheMoon]

I was thinking that it'd be easier for my friend to carry the guitar in two pieces and not in the case, which would be extra luggage. She is a girl, not exactly big/strong, extra luggage will be a pain.

 

But anyways, thanks for the replies.

[lonerstoenr]

 

Uhhh.... you have to go through customs with your shipped bag and your carry on bag you know. So if he gets pulled aside for a search they are going to find a neck in one bag and a body in another both brand new and if he didn't declare it's value then he'll be looking pretty bad. Customs agents aren't stupid...they are going to know what your trying to do. The only thing you can hope is he's not chosen for a search.

 

 

Of course they won't know what's going on. Customs cannot magically see that this gentlemen set up an entire operation to avoid customs through using a friend to purchase something!

 

A girl walking through customs with a guitar (which you declare, obviously) isn't suspicious. It's an item she's bought overseas and taken with her - is it taxable? Maybe, I'm not up to date with England's taxation laws.

 

Personal goods aren't imports.

[Armchair Bronco]

You could also try this: actually have something to declare, like maybe some whiskey over the allowable limit or an extra carton of cigarettes. Then just walk up to the "Something to Declare" counter with the instrument in tow as if it's something that you took with you on the trip. Say to the friendly customs officer, "Hi, I think I need to declare this whiskey and alcohol that I'm bringing back for my dad!" Set the bag of stuff on the table and smile.

 

If he says "Do you have anything else to declare?", just say: "Naw, that's it. I didn't buy anything else at the airport." Which is true!

 

Or, you could buy something *AT* the allowable limit but still go over to the "Something to Declare" counter. Pretend that you think you need to declare the whiskey and cigarettes. They'll look at it and say, "You don't need to declare this -- it's under the limit." Act pleasantly surprised. Say, "Really? Wow, I thought I had to declare booze and cigarettes. Thanks! You just saved me some money." Look back and smile as if you just found a $20 bill on the ground, grab your stuff, and walk out with the bass in tow.

[soundcreation]

Of course they won't know what's going on. Customs cannot magically see that this gentlemen set up an entire operation to avoid customs through using a friend to purchase something! A girl walking through customs with a guitar (which you declare, obviously) isn't suspicious. It's an item she's bought overseas and taken with her - is it taxable? Maybe, I'm not up to date with England's taxation laws. Personal goods aren't imports.

 

 

I'm not saying she's a drug dealer.

 

When I'm saying she'll look bad, I simply mean customs will know she's trying to bring a high value item into the country without declaring it. He's implying she should try to avoid declaring it in his first post, so it's not obvious as you suggest.

 

A week or so traveling is going to put you on the LOW end of what you are allowed to bring back value wise. I'm sure she's going to have her own stuff she bought. That guitar will surely put her over her limit. So their WILL be duty to pay no doubt.

 

The OP is basically trying to save a few bucks by having this girl try to sneak it through undeclared. It's gambling. Plain and simple.

 

I don't know if you know how it works but when you get off the plain you go to the first customs booth. They give you that first little interview...then at the discretion of that agent...they decide if you are to be searched and write a code on your disembarkation card. Once you go get your checked bags you go through the second customs check where officers will look at the code on the card and either direct you for a search or let you walk out.

 

Now if she gets the search and they find it (which should be pretty easy considering it's a bloody guitar) and it's undeclared then she will not only have to pay the duty on it but she could also be fined for failure to properly declare items.

 

So the three choices are, try to sneak it in undeclared and hope your not searched. Declare it properly and just pay the duty on it. Or sneak it in, get caught, and have to pay the duty and most likely a fine as well.

 

I know what I would do if it was me trying to bring it in myself...but having a friend try to do it for you? Lame.

[lonerstoenr]

I know how customs works. I know how importing works. In Australia.

 

You do not have to pay taxes on anything unless you are over the limit of what you can bring in. There's no limit on guitars.

 

IF you mailed to yourself (as I did) that's importing, which is different from personal goods/baggage.

 

Is it different in England? Maybe.

 

But I don't see how this is any different from someone bringing back a lot of new clothes, or alcohol, or cigarettes, or anything from another country. Again, if you know the limits, you're unlikely to be taxed. Declare it, by all means. I found this tidbit on a customs site: "If you are a citizen of the EU, you can bring into Britain any amount of goods, as long as the goods are intended for your personal use. They must not be for resale in the UK."

 

Looks like if she declares it she's fine and he's fine and every one is happy.

 

Generally speaking airport customs have a lot less interest in investigating things like guitars if there aren't drugs or bombs in them. YMMV

[soundcreation]

 

I know how customs works. I know how importing works. In Australia. You do not have to pay taxes on anything unless you are over the limit of what you can bring in. There's no limit on guitars. IF you mailed to yourself (as I did) that's importing, which is different from personal goods/baggage. Is it different in England? Maybe. But I don't see how this is any different from someone bringing back a lot of new clothes, or alcohol, or cigarettes, or anything from another country. Again, if you know the limits, you're unlikely to be taxed. Declare it, by all means. I found this tidbit on a customs site: "If you are a citizen of the EU, you can bring into Britain any amount of goods, as long as the goods are intended for your personal use. They must not be for resale in the UK." Looks like if she declares it she's fine and he's fine and every one is happy. Generally speaking airport customs have a lot less interest in investigating things like guitars if there aren't drugs or bombs in them. YMMV

 

 

Right and the limit in Aus is 900 bucks worth of stuff. From the Aus gov website:

 

"General goods

If you are aged 18 years or over, you can bring up to A$900 worth of general goods into Australia duty-free. If you are under 18 years of age there is a A$450 limit. General goods include gifts, souvenirs, cameras, electronic equipment, leather goods, perfume concentrates, jewellery, watches and sporting equipment."

 

 

Why would guitars be some separate category?

 

Are you saying if I was Australian and bought 6 Les Pauls in the states, I could just bring them into Aus with no duty paid?

 

No way. You'd be way over the 900 dollar limit and have to pay duty on the value above that. Unless you can show me there is some "guitars are exempt from duty" rule. Even one LP standard would put you a grand over the limit in US prices...possibly more if they use the Australian retail prices as their guide.

 

The duty free allowance in the UK is 300 pounds for personal items. That means about 450 bucks US. (geez...didn't realize the pound has lost so much value). Cheapest I see a jazzmaster on musicians friend is like 800US and they average at about 1500 bucks. WELL over her limit coming home. And that's assuming she doesn't have anything for herself!

 

Customs agents have a big interest in collecting duty from people. It's a ton of tax revenue that the government is missing out on.

[lonerstoenr]

Underdeclare it.

 

In Australia they cannot tax you in regards to an item you've owned in another country. There are multiple ways around it. For England, I don't know - but there's certainly going to be ways around taxation.

 

Customs agents haven't taxed me before - the guy said it wasn't worth his time.

 

Guitars ARE in a slightly different category in Australia (well, electric basses to be semantic) because there are no manufacturers of them here there is no choice but to buy abroad. If you do get landed with tax on a bass you simply call up and they take 50% of the taxed amount off. (Which differs again when you IMPORT as opposed to fly in snarf, snarf)

 

There's a way around the English legislature - are you saying anyone who brings instruments in (touring bands, or what have you) pay outrageous tax? I doubt it, although I could be mistaken, now whether lying is a risk worth taking - that's the question.

 

Pretty easy.

[Jkater]

Look into your airline - they will usually determine whether luggage is allowable - and may have a guideline as what is allowed. I'd be surprised if customs hit your friend up on arrival back into the country for tax though - it's not as if souvenirs get taxed, although I could be mistaken.

 

 

I bought my Ampeg bass used in Canada for $600. At the airport, they opened the box I had put it in, asked me how much I paid and charged me $45 customs. Don't assume it will go like butter.

[Greg.Coal]

I was thinking that it'd be easier for my friend to carry the guitar in two pieces and not in the case, which would be extra luggage.

 

 

I have traveled with a guitar this way in the states: I packed it in what was a hard shell suitcase (rather than the more flexible kind which are common now). I didn't even remove the strings since both pieces were in the same case. Just had layers of clothes above, below and in between the neck and body.

 

I did this because work took me away from home for long periods. The people who X-ray it for explosives aren't the same people who care about duties. On the other hand, as you say, the international traveler has to go through customs with checked and carry-on baggage. At which point, honesty is the best policy - if asked.

 

Greg

[soundcreation]

 

Underdeclare it. In Australia they cannot tax you in regards to an item you've owned in another country. There are multiple ways around it. For England, I don't know - but there's certainly going to be ways around taxation. Customs agents haven't taxed me before - the guy said it wasn't worth his time. Guitars ARE in a slightly different category in Australia (well, electric basses to be semantic) because there are no manufacturers of them here there is no choice but to buy abroad. If you do get landed with tax on a bass you simply call up and they take 50% of the taxed amount off. (Which differs again when you IMPORT as opposed to fly in snarf, snarf) There's a way around the English legislature - are you saying anyone who brings instruments in (touring bands, or what have you) pay outrageous tax? I doubt it, although I could be mistaken, now whether lying is a risk worth taking - that's the question. Pretty easy.

 

 

Yes you could try to under declare it. But as I said before customs agents aren't as stupid as you think. They know values of thousands of items and have computer too, so it's pretty easy to find out.

 

 

Your second point only applies if you've LIVED in the other country for like 6 months to a year. Not for tourists. One look at the departure/arrival dates will be enough to shoot that one down.

 

Maybe the agent you got was lazy, I don't know. Agents are people too. Some do it by the book and others slack. That's hardly a reason to assume it's common practice and you'll get away with it every time. Especially when your asking a friend to do it for you. Would you really want to put them in that position? Having to lie for you?

 

And the more you lie to them the more it pisses them off and the more likely they would be to slap a fine on you rather than just making you pay the required duty.

 

Your last point has absolutely nothing to do with what we are talking about. And kind of leads me to believe that you really don't understand this situation. Touring bands own their gear and are not coming "home" as tourists. And most likely would be required to fill out tons of paperwork prior to leaving their country documenting what they are taking so when they return customs checks off what they bring back to see if it matches. If they come back with more stuff than they left with customs would ask why. But none of this is relevant to the OP's situation.

[diagrammatiks]

i travel internationally with my guitar all the time. just tell them you own it forever and you brought it to play on vacation. so easy. they won't even look twice.

[lonerstoenr]

Yes you could try to under declare it. But as I said before customs agents aren't as stupid as you think. They know values of thousands of items and have computer too, so it's pretty easy to find out.

 

 

Neither in Japan nor in Australia have I seen customs agents at the airport look things up. I'm not saying they won't - but realistically the average guy, long day, does it really matter for $50?

 

Like I said - lying's a risk versus reward thing.

 

 

Your second point only applies if you've LIVED in the other country for like 6 months to a year. Not for tourists. One look at the departure/arrival dates will be enough to shoot that one down.

 

 

Cool.

 

Maybe the agent you got was lazy, I don't know. Agents are people too. Some do it by the book and others slack. That's hardly a reason to assume it's common practice and you'll get away with it every time. Especially when your asking a friend to do it for you. Would you really want to put them in that position? Having to lie for you?

 

 

I never assumed, or implied, it was common place - only that it's possible. Nothing more.

 

Me? I wouldn't bother with this {censored} in the first place. But that's not the hypothetical, is it?

 

I'm not suggesting anyone lie - just that's it's a possibility. Whether anyone is comfortable, or uncomfortable with that is hardly my place to decide, in this case.

 

 

And the more you lie to them the more it pisses them off and the more likely they would be to slap a fine on you rather than just making you pay the required duty.

 

 

lol generalisation lol

 

 

Your last point has absolutely nothing to do with what we are talking about. And kind of leads me to believe that you really don't understand this situation.

 

 

Look - he asked is it possible to bring gear back from another country. Yes, it's possible. Say a touring band, in another country BUYS another piece of gear, or is given something in an endorsement deal, or picks up a custom instrument. Are they taxed upon arrival? I don't know - but given that those type of musicians are the ones that probably are experts in this system I'd say it's at least worthwhile talking to people who do this fairly regularly. Because:

 

 

Touring bands own their gear and are not coming "home" as tourists.

 

 

 

And most likely would be required to fill out tons of paperwork prior to leaving their country documenting what they are taking so when they return customs checks off what they bring back to see if it matches. If they come back with more stuff than they left with customs would ask why. But none of this is relevant to the OP's situation.

 

 

"most likely"

 

Nice assumption.

[soundcreation]

Dude I seriously don't know why your even debating this. I'm not speaking in any hypotheticals. The rule is she will have 300 pounds worth of duty free allowance. That's it. End of debate. There are no special circumstances that will change this. So she either takes a chance going through unclaimed or she doesn't. Everything else you mentioned was completely irrelevant the first time you brought it up and I'm sorry I even addressed it at all.