Members aqualung211 Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 How old are those rudes? I mean...when i listen to those old police records, they just don't sound like a cymbal that would be marketed to the heavy music crowd. The rudes i've heard in person were very similar to the Z's i heard. Very loud, only made one loud, abrasive sound. I like cymbals that can be reall mellow, but through good manipulation can be made to go out of control. A wide tonal pallete i guess you can say. Thats the one thing i dislike about Rudes, Z's, Metal X's etc. But that's just my opinion, different strokes for different folks. So what im wondering is.....how are yours? Really loud? How old are they? Were the ones being made in copelands day different than the modern ones? I remember seeing a discussion on the Tama board, about 2002 rudes, and other forms. I'm lost here. Now that a new Guitar Center is opening up 50 miles away, (alot closer than before) i can try more out. Just curious.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members the DW Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by tangmanUK How rude! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aqualung211 Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 his cymbals need some lessons in manners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aqualung211 Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Actually i've always thought the Rudes look coolest. sumhing 'bout em. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tangmanUK Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by aqualung211 How old are those rudes? I mean...when i listen to those old police records, they just don't sound like a cymbal that would be marketed to the heavy music crowd. The rudes i've heard in person were very similar to the Z's i heard. Very loud, only made one loud, abrasive sound. I like cymbals that can be reall mellow, but through good manipulation can be made to go out of control. A wide tonal pallete i guess you can say. Thats the one thing i dislike about Rudes, Z's, Metal X's etc. But that's just my opinion, different strokes for different folks. So what im wondering is.....how are yours? Really loud? How old are they? Were the ones being made in copelands day different than the modern ones? I remember seeing a discussion on the Tama board, about 2002 rudes, and other forms. I'm lost here. Now that a new Guitar Center is opening up 50 miles away, (alot closer than before) i can try more out. Just curious.... I have been accumlating my rudes over a couple of years, I got my first rude (17" Crash/Ride) in late 2004, my 20" power ride around Dec '04, my 18" Crash/Ride in March '05, 14" Sound Edge Hi Hats May '05 and my 18" China july '05 . I would suggest you check out the sound clips on the Paiste website, they are very accurate to what mine sound like, obviously mine sound slightly different because of the different circumstances of where I have my kit (acoustics etc etc) They do sound very loud and similar to Z Customs if played hard, however if you play them at different dynamics you do get more than just a loud unaudible noise. One thing which I cant seem to understand is when your in a live situation the rude's sound very "musical" Im not sure exactly how to describe it. I watched video's of me playing old gigs when I was using Z Customs and they just blew away everything else on stage, I watch video's of me playing the Rude's and they dont overpower everything on stage and I think they sound great but obviously I will say that because I own them, what Im trying to say is they sound different to the audio clips on the Paiste website (in a live situation. If your just jamming by yourself the audio clips are quite accurate, but you also have to take into account the guy testing them isnt really going through all the different techniques and dynamics possible), there are elements which are similar obviously but because a certain amount of the overtones are wiped by the rest of the band they can sound a lot different in a good way. Im not saying they sound like signatures, 2002's, Zildjian A Customs etc but they are more than capable of just "Loud", I play in a Death Metal band but I have also used these cymbals for pop, motown, funk and loads more. It is a bit of a unfair comparison to compare the Rude's and Z Customs because my playing style changed during the transition from one set of cymbals to the other. Its really hard to explain what Im trying to convey, Im in the middle of recording with my band and once thats done I'll try get a MP3 uploaded asap. Im 99% sure that Copeland's Rude's would have been different to what the Rude's are now, Im not sure on the exact history of the rude's but I believe that when they were first released they were part of the 2002 palette for a few years, then they were made into there own palette called the "Rude 3000" if I recall correctly. Then from there Im not to sure what happened, I THINK that they were put back into the 2002 palette, and then later put into there own Palette which is the current one. All I can say is try them before you pass judgement, no audio clip will give you enough of a indication of how a cymbal can sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tangmanUK Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by the DW How rude! oh man you didnt wanna do that...the crashes have put a contract on your head now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aqualung211 Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by tangmanUK I have been accumlating my rudes over a couple of years, I got my first rude (17" Crash/Ride) in late 2004, my 20" power ride around Dec '04, my 18" Crash/Ride in March '05, 14" Sound Edge Hi Hats May '05 and my 18" China july '05 .I would suggest you check out the sound clips on the Paiste website, they are very accurate to what mine sound like, obviously mine sound slightly different because of the different circumstances of where I have my kit (acoustics etc etc)They do sound very loud and similar to Z Customs if played hard, however if you play them at different dynamics you do get more than just a loud unaudible noise. One thing which I cant seem to understand is when your in a live situation the rude's sound very "musical" Im not sure exactly how to describe it. I watched video's of me playing old gigs when I was using Z Customs and they just blew away everything else on stage, I watch video's of me playing the Rude's and they dont overpower everything on stage and I think they sound great but obviously I will say that because I own them, what Im trying to say is they sound different to the audio clips on the Paiste website (in a live situation. If your just jamming by yourself the audio clips are quite accurate, but you also have to take into account the guy testing them isnt really going through all the different techniques and dynamics possible), there are elements which are similar obviously but because a certain amount of the overtones are wiped by the rest of the band they can sound a lot different in a good way.Im not saying they sound like signatures, 2002's, Zildjian A Customs etc but they are more than capable of just "Loud", I play in a Death Metal band but I have also used these cymbals for pop, motown, funk and loads more.It is a bit of a unfair comparison to compare the Rude's and Z Customs because my playing style changed during the transition from one set of cymbals to the other.Its really hard to explain what Im trying to convey, Im in the middle of recording with my band and once thats done I'll try get a MP3 uploaded asap.Im 99% sure that Copeland's Rude's would have been different to what the Rude's are now, Im not sure on the exact history of the rude's but I believe that when they were first released they were part of the 2002 palette for a few years, then they were made into there own palette called the "Rude 3000" if I recall correctly. Then from there Im not to sure what happened, I THINK that they were put back into the 2002 palette, and then later put into there own Palette which is the current one.All I can say is try them before you pass judgement, no audio clip will give you enough of a indication of how a cymbal can sound. hmmm..i'll be at GC in a week. I'll play on a few a' them. The Z custom mega-bell i played was trash. it literally could only make one noise. A uber loud overpowering ping....with undertones underneath that were downright disgusting....like a weird cyborg-ish lasery sound. Even when played softly, it eas the same exact sound...just at lower volumes. My wuhan ride can get in good pings, but if i want i can crash it and get that big, dark, Kyuss kinda crash ride sound.I've heard great things about the Rude soundedge hats. I was astonished when i read that they were thinner than new-beats, cause new beats are VERY far from a metal oriented. I understand though, what you say bout them being different live. I'm just craving that copeland ride sound so badly:love: Especially on Synchronicity. How do you like the hats? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tangmanUK Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 I love my sound edge hats, I dont think I will ever go back to a set of hi hats where the bottom hat isnt crimpled, they have a very nice "chick" and open sound, I would not hesitate to use these for even the softest, "poppiest" ballad's. The sound you get from playing the hi hat closed then opening it almost simultaneously so you get a swooshing style sound is also very nice, it is very well defined and just sounds great! I dont think the Rude ride would be for you though, it is definitely more ping than wash and it definitely ISNT crashable, you would break a stick before you would be able to crash on that beast. I havent heard a lot of The Police in general, but the power ride would provide quite a similar sound to "O My God" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aqualung211 Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by tangmanUK I love my sound edge hats, I dont think I will ever go back to a set of hi hats where the bottom hat isnt crimpled, they have a very nice "chick" and open sound, I would not hesitate to use these for even the softest, "poppiest" ballad's. The sound you get from playing the hi hat closed then opening it almost simultaneously so you get a swooshing style sound is also very nice, it is very well defined and just sounds great! I dont think the Rude ride would be for you though, it is definitely more ping than wash and it definitely ISNT crashable, you would break a stick before you would be able to crash on that beast. I havent heard a lot of The Police in general, but the power ride would provide quite a similar sound to "O My God" True...but now that i've got the washy ride, i want one that has great ping. I can just turn my wuhan ride into a crash. i love ping:love: I usually would have held out for a pingier ride but the wuhan $80 price was irresistable. Sorry for being so rude way back when btw.....i was an asshole. Didn't mean to insult your mannerless cymbals either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rockfister Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 From May 1984 Downbeat article regarding Stewart's gear... Cymbally speaking, on-stage it's Formula 602 13-inch medium hi-hats (sans Sound Edge) and a 16-inch thin crash, two eight-inch 2002 bell cymbals, two eight and an 11-inch 2002 splashes, and RUDE 14-, 16-, and 22-inch crash-rides; in the studio Formula 2002 16- and 18-inch mediums, and a 22-inch 602 heavy ride replace the RUDES. I remember the first Rudes were marketed as a live cymbal being able to cut through stage volumes, etc., rather than just for 'heavy' players. I was a Zildjian guy back then and bought one of their crash equiviliants called Impulse. Much like the Rudes it had very little finesse but was able to cut right through everything. I'm definitely not an expert on Paiste, but the new Rudes certainly look different than the old ones. Didn't they actually stop production on them for quite a while? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aqualung211 Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 hell if i know. I'm almost positive they've changed...even the Z's have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cheeseadiddle Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 I'm pretty sure they stopped making the Rudes and they were re-introduced. I was always of the opinion that Copeland had to be using something besides Rudes in the studio, and the Rudes live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aqualung211 Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by cheeseadiddle I'm pretty sure they stopped making the Rudes and they were re-introduced.I was always of the opinion that Copeland had to be using something besides Rudes in the studio, and the Rudes live. Probably.....i just cant picture a rude ride being used on Every Breath You Take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Drumming4Him Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Do you really place your feet the way the pedals are placed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Thingfish Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by Jessz1 Lots of nice kits here. Sort of embarassed to post my dirty ol beater up on here. I love the snare! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members artstarcordia Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Although this is a STOCK photo, my digital camera went out on me, so for now this will have to do. Just imagine, this picture PLUS Tama Superstar Super Mahogany 6, 8, 10, 12 inch concert toms, matching 13 and 14 inch Tama Timbales, 20 and the VERY RARE 22 inch Tama Gong Bass Drums BOTH on the Chrome Rollaway Stands, and the ULTRA SUPER RARE Tama Artstar Cordia 20 inch floor tom. Add to that a 2 octave MalletKAT with an Alesis DM-PRO sound module, 8 cowbells, 5 LP Granite blocks, and 3 sets of windchimes. As far as cymbals go, ALL of them are Paiste 3000 RUDES: 8, 10, 12 inch splashes, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19 inch crashes, 13 hi hats of left, 14 inch SOUND EDGE hi hats on a Tama Cable Hat, 22 inch Power Ride on Right, 22 inch ride/crash on left(Simon Phillips style). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aqualung211 Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 oh. my. god. The kit from hell:mad: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tangmanUK Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by aqualung211 True...but now that i've got the washy ride, i want one that has great ping. I can just turn my wuhan ride into a crash. i love ping:love: I usually would have held out for a pingier ride but the wuhan $80 price was irresistable. Sorry for being so rude way back when btw.....i was an asshole. Didn't mean to insult your mannerless cymbals either. its alright dude, in the past now heres a little excerpt from a Paiste leaflet I got with my rude's maybe itll clear things up a bit. "Throughout the 1970's, Rock's popularity explodes, draws ever larger crowds, and embraces folk, roots and jazz influences. Two developments of the latter 1970's stand out and will have a main influence on Paiste's work with cymbals. The first is the explosive growth of Rock genre Heavy Metal, as pioneered by Judas Priest, Motorhead, Iron Maiden, AC/DC and Van Halen. The second is the counterculture advent of Punk lead by the Ramones, Sex Pistols, The Damned and The Clash. As idealogically diverse as the styles maybe be, both are characterised by extreme bolume, speed and midrange heavy distortion. Paiste's answer is the creation of the RUDE cymbals, who's raw power and energy stems from there hand hammered, un-lathed uniform thickness design, and naturally the CuSn8 bronze. Punk and Heavy Metal players like Rat Scabies, Marky Ramone, Alex Van Halen and Bobby Rondinelli gladly welcome RUDE cymbals into there arsenals. As rock music enter's the 1980's, exploring the stylistic boundaries of Punk and New Wave, two 2002/RUDE players stand out, in both terms of success and stylistic influence: Stewart Copeland with his intricate, textured drum work in the context of Police's stripped down Punk-Reggae inspired mix, and Larry Mullen jr, with his instinctual drumming style in the hugely successful U2, the band that bridged the simplisitic vehemence of punk rock with hte mass appeal of pop. Metal, Punk and Hardcore continue to expand there stylistic variety throughout the decade and beyond, as Paiste players like Dave Lombardo, Charlie Benante, Tico Torres and Joey Castillo prove that there 2002 and RUDE cymbals effortlessly hold up to the merciless and powerful playing styles that are unleashed on them. In 1986, Paiste launches the 3000, which successfully advance the 2002 sound based on 1980's musical trends. Towards the late 1980's the formula 602 starts to lose its relevance in the musical context of the times. Both series are quickly overshadowed by groundbreaking development of the signature series in the late 1980's, which utilize's Paiste's own specifically developed bronze alloy and sets a new standard for advanced paiste sound. The formula 602 is discontinued soon thereafter. In 1994 Paiste decides to merge the RUDE series and selected 3000 models into an expanded 2002. The 1980's definitely reinvigorate Rock music a nd give it new direction. The decade starts out with the development of alternative and progressive rock and swiftly moves into Grunge, Roots Rock brings country, Folk and Soul elements to the table. Emocore in its many sub varities infuses hardcore with Punk, Pop, Ska, Ballad and Jazz elements. Metal breeds new sub styles, and in the process incorporates progressive demands, punk minimalism and even funk and rap. It refines its dark side with Black and Doom Metal, while gothic rock and metal are alive throughout. Whats significant in all this dizzying variety, explosion and integration of styles is the underlying technical ability and stylistically broad training of the era's musicians in general and the drummers in particular that perform a magnificent rang of Rock Music. Certainly the drummers of the 1990's are well served by the selection of 2002, Rude and signature cymbals available to them. Satisfied Paiste drummers in the progressive grunge, hardcore, punk, metal and roots based rock include such able and superb drummers as Danny Carey, Jordan Burns, Joey Waronker, Joey Castillo, David Silveria, Aaron Montgomery, Joey Jordison, John Dolmayan, and Aquiles Priester. Paiste nonetheless recognises the tremendous musical developments of the decade and once more sets out to create new cymbals from the tried and true CuSn8 bronze alloy. During the 1990's Paiste develops the Traditional's series, dark, complex and musical cymbals that faithfully reproduce vintage jazz, blues and Big Band sound from the '40's through the '60's. To develop new cymbals based on the 1990's musical developments, Paiste borrows design principles from the signature and traditionals series and applies them to the trusted CuSn8 bronze alloy. In 1999. Paiste re-launches RUDE cymbals under there original name. Dimensions cymbals readily make it into many of Paiste's top rock artists cymbal sets. In 2003, Paiste adds a significant set of models to the Dimensions." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tangmanUK Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by Drumming4Him Do you really place your feet the way the pedals are placed? was that to me?? If so then yes IMO you get the quickest response and best feel of the slave pedal if its parellel to the primary pedal, there will be less lag time than if the pedal was angled. I was also taught my techniques teacher to sit at the kit facing forward with the drums, I'd already had my pedal set up like it is though by now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Watchdog Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Personally I cant stand those bicycle thrones. They are very hard to "mount" (aqualung). I had one for a long time and then finally bought a really nice tama throne (actually my wife got it for me) and I still, as a habit, reach down between my legs (are you listening?) and adjust the seat to point forward, even though now its round and I dont have to. Wierd how your body just goes through motions its used to doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cheeseadiddle Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by tangmanUK was that to me?? If so then yes IMO you get the quickest response and best feel of the slave pedal if its parellel to the primary pedal, there will be less lag time than if the pedal was angled. Do you have any engineering theory to back that up? Or is it just speculation? Because that's a universal joint on that linkage between the slave and the primary pedals. The universal works the same whether it's at an angle or straight. Same as a drive shaft on a car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members the DW Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 There could be something to this. I know when I'm using a u-joint on a socket wrench, there are points in the rotation where the u-joint offers a bit more resistance to turning. If you have a 200 horsepower motor turning the joint, I doubt it would be noticable, but when it's 1 anklepower, you might be able to feel the resistance. $0.02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TimeKeeper310 Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by the DW There could be something to this. I know when I'm using a u-joint on a socket wrench, there are points in the rotation where the u-joint offers a bit more resistance to turning. If you have a 200 horsepower motor turning the joint, I doubt it would be noticable, but when it's 1 anklepower, you might be able to feel the resistance. $0.02 ...unless, said 'anklepower', is distributing the equivalent of 200 HP, repetitiously, in a manner that....Mraia?...anything?...mraia?... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cheeseadiddle Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Originally posted by the DW There could be something to this. I know when I'm using a u-joint on a socket wrench, there are points in the rotation where the u-joint offers a bit more resistance to turning.If you have a 200 horsepower motor turning the joint, I doubt it would be noticable, but when it's 1 anklepower, you might be able to feel the resistance.$0.02 Yeah, I'll agree with that to a point. You take that same socket U-Joint and bend it about the same angle that your average double base pedal would be bent at, and tell me if there is a noticeable difference. I just tried it with mine. Couldn't feel a difference at all. With my foot or my hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Drumming4Him Posted November 20, 2006 Members Share Posted November 20, 2006 Did someone say "entry level"? I finally made room for the floor tom. I'm itchin' for a splash cymbal yo. Any suggestions in my configuration? The hi-hat pedal CAN'T turn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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