Free friendly advice

[Kramerguy]

For you folks out there auditioning, looking to join a band, or are the newer guy in a band; whether you are new to bands, or even a seasoned pro, here's some seemingly obvious, yet completely abused/forgotten advice/pointers:

 

Auditions

 

1. Never, ever, show up to an audition and 'wing it'. I don't care how good you are, how many blues/jazz/funk styles, 7/8 tempo variations, and national tours you've done. I know you've played most of those songs in prior bands. If you can't find enough enthusiasm to practice them and come to the audition prepared, you won't be invited back. I really don't care how gifted you are.

 

2. Don't show up, and within the first 20 minutes start dictating how you plan on running the band.

 

3. We know you are multi-instrumental... but don't ever hop on a band-member's instrument, and then proceed to try and show them up while YOU are the one auditioning. Actually it's a bad idea to ever do that... buh-bye.

 

4. Don't show up and try to convince the band to "follow you" on a song that's not in their genre. Don't even try to push on songs that are in the same genre if the band doesn't know the song. It's pushy, and another reason I'd never ask you back. The band isn't there to audition for YOU.

 

New to band / Rehearsals

 

1. Never show up to a rehearsal not knowing the material. If we all agreed to learn four songs for the next rehearsal, and you show up knowing any less than four songs, we end up spending half the time showing you how to play it and then the other half of the time listening to you {censored}ing up. It's a fast way to get kicked out, if that's your goal.

 

2. I know you are so damn gifted on your instrument that you don't have to practice, but guess what? You suck. The finest musicians in the world all practice every single day. Yeah, we may just be a local bar band, but I guarantee you that you won't ever rise above it if you don't practice. Not just the material mind you, but try to better yourself on your instrument and stop being a douchebag.

 

3. The band has established goals and means to achieve them. If you are "that guy" who does the bare minimum of helping achieve them, don't try relentlessly to push everyone into thinking the goals are whack, and that your lack of achievements are a valid protest. Don't try pointing the finger at band-mates accusing them of the very things you are guilty of. The fact is that you are a lazy {censored} who is making up self justifications to take the focus off the fact that you aren't carrying your weight.

 

4. Stop showing off between songs. I know you can play 45 nps/bps whatever. I know your rig/kit sounds fukin amazin. I know you just learned that

[vanlatte]

I approve of this message.

 

 

Especially this:

 

4. Stop showing off between songs. I know you can play 45 nps/bps whatever. I know your rig/kit sounds fukin amazin. I know you just learned that

[Zon5string]

 

For you folks out there auditioning, looking to join a band, or are the newer guy in a band; whether you are new to bands, or even a seasoned pro, here's some seemingly obvious, yet completely abused/forgotten advice/pointers: Auditions 4. Don't show up and try to convince the band to "follow you" on a song that's not in their genre. Don't even try to push on songs that are in the same genre if the band doesn't know the song. It's pushy, and another reason I'd never ask you back. The band isn't there to audition for YOU .

 

 

I'll take issue with the bolded (emphasis mine) statement, and say that, yes, they are auditioning for me as much as I for them. Now, I'm not going to be having an "outlaw country" band try to play a Dream Theater song, obviously, but I am checking out the talent and abilities of them at least as much as they are checking me out.

 

I should add that I do agree with the "don't try to get them to play something else" thing. It is an audition, and the test music should be agreed to beforehand.

[stratman77]

Excellent post and sound (sorry no pun intended) advice

[pmtrub]

 

The band isn't there to audition for YOU.

 

 

Yes they are. This is a two way street.

 

That said, I agree with most everything you posted, be mature and reliable. Seems simple enough, but oftentimes that's not the case.

[MusicalSchizo]

All good advice.

 

And I concur, the auditions are a two-way street. I've been to many where I walked out hoping they didn't call me so I didn't have to reject them.

 

We've been through A LOT of auditions with my current band (People keep moving out of town on us), and we've been through ALL of it - people not showing up, bringing a HUGE rig, playing too loud, not playing loud enough, sucking, sucking balls, being an egomaniac, expecting the band to be what they want it to be instead of what it is (e.g. wanting to change THE WHOLE SETLIST), not learning songs.

 

We've actually fired two different people within the first few weeks because they were so far behind learning the songs.

 

I vouched for a friend of mine to come audition for one of my old bands in Jacksonville (ckcondon's band Dial-9), and he showed up not really knowing the material. Immediate disqualification. Even if he had nailed the audition in the sense that he impressed us tremendously as a player (and he was really good, he just didn't dazzle us and definitely didn't know the songs well enough), the fact that he wasn't prepared was really NOT cool with us.

 

I know that when I've auditioned I've always gone through the band's entire list and charted out the songs (learning them in the process) so I can basically play whatever they want to hear. I just feel it's respectful to show that sort of effort if you're really interested in being a part of a band, if you have the time, of course. I made the time because I saw it as an opportunity to learn a lot of new stuff.

 

On bass, that's easier than guitar, but I've done it for both.

 

I usually don't expect as much from people, but I know that when we've auditioned people, if they didn't know a certain number of songs from the list we gave them (we usually let them choose from a list of 10 specifically-chosen songs that are regulars in our playlist, because it allows for a little flexibility (in case they already know some of our tunes) and lets us in on what they're keen on that we do.

 

I really hate auditioning people, though. I much prefer auditioning for bands.

 

It's a rush, and it usually forces me to broaden my experience as a musician...it's part of the reason I love to do fill-in gigs, too.

Brian V.

[karlw]

#4 in the band part - we used to call that "everyone plays their favorite licks". Totally wastes time and also ensures that those playing the licks aren't listening and also so that no one else can effectively talk or listen.

[BlueStrat]

I approve of this message.

 

+1000

[jeff42]

Auditions 1. Never, ever, show up to an audition and 'wing it'. I don't care how good you are, how many blues/jazz/funk styles, 7/8 tempo variations, and national tours you've done. I know you've played most of those songs in prior bands. If you can't find enough enthusiasm to practice them and come to the audition prepared, you won't be invited back. I really don't care how gifted you are. 2. Don't show up, and within the first 20 minutes start dictating how you plan on running the band.

 

we have had 2 guitarists do these things last time we held auditions!!!!

 

they both chatted me up for a couple weeks before the audition they both sounded like great guys. I listened to some online clips (original stuff) NOT BAD I thought! OK, so we set up auditions on different nights for these 2 guys.

 

They both sounded really into our stuff... One guy even said he learned most of our set! We only asked for 4-5 songs to audition with, but this guy claimed to know almost our whole show!!!

 

When the first guy got to our audition, he didn't know one song on our audition CD! Not ONE!!!!!

 

His guitar was stupidly loud (shaking the garage loud!) and boy did it sound like ass! I describe it as sounding just like chewing on aluminum foil. UUGH!

 

The songs he did claim to know he didn't play close to being right.

 

I hate being lied to.

 

the other guy knew nothing on our audition CD, jammed a blue riff for 15 minutes and then pretty much told us that we were to be his backing band...

 

sure!

 

I hope we never have to audition players again...

[GCDEF]

Good post. I'd add, if you don't have an electronic tuner, don't even bother showing up. It doesn't matter how good you think your ear is, it isn't as accurate or as quick or as quiet as a tuner.

 

To expand on number 4 a bit, if people are talking, shut up with your instrument. The other guitar player in my band has a horrible habit of wanking really loudly right in the middle of conversations.

[jeff42]

Oh!! Just remembered another awesome almost-audition!!!

 

A guitar player contacted us, a guy who is a great player, loved that we were a working band really interested in getting started ASAP.

 

...and then sent us a list of songs we would be playing with him!!!!

 

We were to learn these songs, I think there were about 25 of them. Many of these were songs we would never play and IMO wouldn't work with our crowd.

 

And then, he said after we had learned his stuff... the rest of the show can be "the best" of what we are doing.

 

 

we never auditioned him. He's a great guitar player but one of us would have slugged him within a week.

[wades_keys]

The last 2 auditions I went to I had to find ways to get myself out of there.

 

1 was a "band" (so they said) that needed a bassplayer. They didn't even have a setlist, and couldn't get through 10 songs.

 

The other band was actually quite good, musically, but the drum kit was held together with paper clips, the guitarist used a nickle for a pick and the "PA" was a 1970's vintage radio shack amp connected to hifi speakers.

 

Actually the last audition I was a part of was about 2 weeks ago, for a possible VH tribute.

 

We'd never rehearsed together but all agreed to work up 8 or so songs for the audition; the singer that we auditioned wasn't as good as we were hoping for, but I'm still on the fence in terms of should we try to work with him or find someone else.

 

Here's one of the songs that we recorded - this was one of the better ones:

http://hc.bloodyvelvet.com/files/222/01%20Somebody%20Get%20Me%20A%20Doctor.mp3

[tim_7string]

Oh!! Just remembered another awesome almost-audition!!! A guitar player contacted us, a guy who is a great player, loved that we were a working band really interested in getting started ASAP. ...and then sent us a list of songs we would be playing with him!!!! We were to learn these songs, I think there were about 25 of them. Many of these were songs we would never play and IMO wouldn't work with our crowd. And then, he said after we had learned his stuff... the rest of the show can be "the best" of what we are doing. we never auditioned him. He's a great guitar player but one of us would have slugged him within a week.

 

Man, what is it with people who think they are running the show when they are merely showing up and inserting themselves into something already established?

 

Only guys like Tom Petty have such balls and can make it work! (He basically stole Benmont Tench's recording band and turned it into The Heartbreakers)

 

A guy that was in a band with me that I recently quit was going to be a part of the new band that I started with my girlfriend. At our practice, he seemed to think he was going to do the booking, come up with the band name, sing most of the songs and we would back him up. The nerve...I'm glad he figured out that WE were starting the band, naming it, owned the equipment and made the gigs and thankfully decided to bow out.

 

He actually suggested that he would eventually be singing 12 songs in the band I just left! The band is the stage name of the main lead singer/bandleader and he wanted to do 12 songs? {censored}, I only did 6 at the most in one night! What a tool...

[MusicalSchizo]

Here's one of the songs that we recorded - this was one of the better ones: http://hc.bloodyvelvet.com/files/222/01%20Somebody%20Get%20Me%20A%20Doctor.mp3

 

Not bad...well, not bad on everything except the vocals. Vocals were BAD.

 

The drummer nailed it, and the guitarist did an admirable job. I could barely hear your bass, though...which is probably because I was using really crappy computer speakers to listen. I bet it's great, though.

Brian V.

[wades_keys]

 

Not bad...well, not bad on everything except the vocals. Vocals were BAD.

 

YEah, that's exactly what the guitarist said too, and I don't disagree really: it's just...so...hard...to find a competent ANYBODY in this goddamn {censored} town that it's tempting to go with the mediocre.

 

We're gonna keep looking for singers....

[wades_keys]

Not bad...well, not bad on everything except the vocals. Vocals were BAD. The drummer nailed it, and the guitarist did an admirable job. I could barely hear your bass, though...which is probably because I was using really crappy computer speakers to listen. I bet it's great, though. Brian V.

 

Actually I didn't play the breakdown part right - I had just learned it the night before. I mean, it sounds OKAY but it's not up to "tribute" standards (I kinda faked it rhythmically)

 

Then again, I wasn't expecting much (and was not disappointed, lol), and I'm in 2 other bands with full setlists, so it was a bit of a chore to make myself sit down and learn the tunes (even though they're easy - I spent a total of about 2 hours on 8 or so tunes)

 

Thanks man - your opinion actually sealed the deal for me; I was on the fence but no more - we'll find a singer that can do better....

[Philbigtime]

 

YEah, that's exactly what the guitarist said too, and I don't disagree really: it's just...so...hard...to find a competent ANYBODY in this goddamn {censored} town that it's tempting to go with the mediocre. We're gonna keep looking for singers....

 

 

 

One thing that I've learned, even in a music town like Austin...

 

Everyone can "play guitar". Many people can "play drums". A lot of the same people that claim to be guitarists can "play bass".

 

But damn, if you can find a good singer, HOLD ON and DO WHAT THEY SAY. That's the rarest real talent in a band, and the most important. Thankfully, I have been able to attach myself to a good singer. Good luck in your search.

[wades_keys]

One thing that I've learned, even in a music town like Austin... Everyone can "play guitar". Many people can "play drums". A lot of the same people that claim to be guitarists can "play bass". But damn, if you can find a good singer, HOLD ON and DO WHAT THEY SAY. That's the rarest real talent in a band, and the most important. Thankfully, I have been able to attach myself to a good singer. Good luck in your search.

We're gonna have a guy out in a couple of weeks that has (had, maybe still does) legendary pipes...

 

BUT...he's a bum, has had alcohol issues....Man, I was totally opposed to it at first but we've got a plan to keep the clamps on him enough to where we can hopefully make it work.

 

If he shows up drunk one time I'm gone, and I've made that clear (guitarist won't tolerate it either, so we're square...)

 

The "good news" is that he's married now and 'supposedly' more mellow; at least he gets rides from his wife so he won't be driving drunk or bumming rides (which is a no go from the start).

 

Wait for the followup - should make a hell of a thread here.

 

What sucks I guess is the guy we tried seemed real responsible, fairly level headed, and not drunk. But he gave his name as mike, and when he showed up I said: "hey Mike" and he goes "call me Dave".

 

The plan is to invest minimal time in this deal - I'm already in 2 bands, drummer and guitarist are both in other bands....

[tim_7string]

The plan is to invest minimal time in this deal - I'm already in 2 bands, drummer and guitarist are both in other bands....

 

Well, if that's the plan (minimal time), and you're not going to take it that seriously, then you're good to go. For just doing it kinda halfassed, it sounds pretty good. If everyone is on the same page, the singer should work just fine.

 

I'm only being kind of sarcastic...

[wades_keys]

Bass was pretty tight for the most part, a little loose here and there, but overall a damn good job. If you could get down Mike's fast triplets during the solo section, it would sound great (I *think* they are triplets anyway, maybe just sixteenth notes). I agree with MusicalSchizo. The vocals aren't going to cut it (flat in a couple parts). He doesn't sound anywhere close to Roth and if you're going to do a serious tribute, the vocals MUST sound as close as possible to the original. Well, if that's the plan (minimal time), then you're good to go. For just doing it kinda halfassed, it sounds pretty good. If everyone is on the same page, the singer should work just fine.

I went home and worked up the part that night, but still have to practice it a little to get it tight.

 

But I want to hear the singer first.

 

Man, that's crazy about the takeover attempt in your band - we had a guy try that crap on us a while back after one audition: he came out for our cover band (at the time), proceeded to try and get us to play his nu-rock/emo originals, telling us we "rocked" and all that good stuff.

 

Uh, we'll be in touch....(not)

 

As far as the "minimal time", I meant minimal band rehearsals, maximum homework - which I'll only do if the singer is capable.

[tim_7string]

Man, that's crazy about the takeover attempt in your band - we had a guy try that crap on us a while back after one audition: he came out for our cover band (at the time), proceeded to try and get us to play his nu-rock/emo originals, telling us we "rocked" and all that good stuff. Uh, we'll be in touch....(not)

 

Yeah, it's like people think that if they overly-flatter you, you'll just fall all over them and let them do whatever they want. Doesn't work that way, at least not for me. Maybe if I was still in high school and just starting out, but not after 20+ years of being in bands.

 

As far as the "minimal time", I meant minimal band rehearsals, maximum homework - which I'll only do if the singer is capable.

 

Thanks for clarifying that. I have had to work that way in my most recent bands, due to schedule conflicts, people living in different towns/cities and lack of a place to rehearse as a band. It isn't my favorite way to work, but as long as people do work on the songs, then things are still getting done!

[wades_keys]

Yeah, it's like people think that if they overly-flatter you, you'll just fall all over them and let them do whatever they want. Doesn't work that way, at least not for me. Maybe if I was still in high school and just starting out, but not after 20+ years of being in bands.

Right.

 

I can't even say that, really - I mean most of my "bands" in the past have been glorified jam sessions (except for the church gig)

 

But I've been around long enough to recognize manipulation when I see it - working in corporate settings and dealing with office politics for 12 years has given me a real sense of how to spot that garbage, and has also told me that nothing gets done right without goals and direction, mixed with diplomacy (this last part I'm still learning, but I'm getting much better. I do my venting on here and then go into the situations diplomatically, but with resolve. I love this place. )

[tim_7string]

I do my venting on here and then go into the situations diplomatically, but with resolve. I love this place. )

 

Haha! Yeah, it sure is fun to bitch about stuff, isn't it?

 

I'm usually pretty diplomatic myself. Sometimes I wish I could be more of a dick, but really, just wish I knew what to do to shut down problem areas before they become bigger problems. Be more assertive without pissing people off.

[wades_keys]

 

Thanks for clarifying that. I have had to work that way in my most recent bands, due to schedule conflicts, people living in different towns/cities and lack of a place to rehearse as a band. It isn't my favorite way to work, but as long as people do work on the songs, then things are still getting done!

 

 

I think we proved that pretty well by all showing up ready to play 8 songs (for the most part) with no prior rehearsal.

 

I love it when that happens - the 3 of us are going to stick it out; we've all played together in various incarnations in the past so we've got a good feel I think, and the guitarist uses an attenuator and has no volume issues at all with his halfstack - a rare find indeed.

 

And Sean was once one of the best metal drummer's in this town (former member of My Own Victim when they got their record deal and mini-tour)

 

Me, I'm the weak link musically compared to those 2 - they keep me on my toes which is always a good thing!

 

How the hell do you pull of the out-of-town deal? That must be a real b**h....

 

My problem has been the opposite (diplomatically) - I find I'm real good at spotting the problem areas but less good at getting "buy in" from the other band members that I'll need to deal with the issue, which has lead to me being frustrated, which then leads to ME becoming the "problem".

 

So now - I'll speak once and then let things run their course - to the point that I get the buy-in I was looking for.

[tim_7string]

 

How the hell do you pull of the out-of-town deal? That must be a real b**h....

 

 

Yeah, it was difficult.

 

With the band I had in 2005-2006, two of us lived in Forks, one lived in a small town in Minnesota about an hour and a half away, and another lived in a totally different small town about the same distance in a different direction. We had a total of three band practices: two at the lead singer's basement, one in the living room of the guitarist. It was just too much trouble to try to coordinate them, especially with the rising cost of gas.

 

We would basically just tell each other which songs we would be singing, give each other practice CDs whenever possible, and work on the parts on our own. Gigs were for ironing out the bugs. I always hated doing that before and I am still uncomfortable with it. I'd rather get stuff down really tight in practice, then be confident and stray from the script a bit (being very prepared). But I never want to end up like one of those groups that stays in the basement or garage either. You know the ones. The songs are never ready and no gigs are ever booked.