Members dannyrajan Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 This is probably an easy question to answer, but I've never gotten a straight answer.Whenever I play a live gig, im never quite satisfied with the sound of my vocals. not my singing, but the effects on it, the tone, the reverb, etc. I want to have a distinct sound for my vocals, as in I'd like to perfect the sound thats coming out into the crowd.How does one add effects (delay, distortion, tremolo,etc) to their vocals at a live gig? I dont want it to be too fuzzy, but think lou reed with alot of delay.. I would guess that I should attach my overdrive pedal and a delay to their soundboard, but my friend gave me a confusing answer on how this wont work. am i asking to much? is there a simple cable i need to adapt some pedals somewhere? any suggestions are helpful. thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members turbocody Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 well, i would suggest a lexicon or t.c electronics processor....the entry level units can be had for around $200. with effects, a little goes a long way! just dont overdue it. hope this helps you in some way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stevie j Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 just dont overdue it How do you overdue an effect? Does that mean you still owe some in a few years time? You can certainly overdo effects, but with all due respect this is worse than not knowing which were goes where.:poke: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members turbocody Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 so you agree to disagree steve j? i was just saying that you can have the vocals too wet in the mix. but different kinds of music calls for different effect levels and such, lets take that into consideration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members davidss1 Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 but different kinds of music calls for different effect levels and such, lets take that into consideration. i agree with turbo,very hard to get a set and forget sound u will be happy with.much easier if u have a BE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stevie j Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 so you agree to disagree steve j? i was just saying that you can have the vocals too wet in the mix. but different kinds of music calls for different effect levels and such, lets take that into consideration. I agree with what you were trying to say, I just don't agree with your use of overdue instead of overdo. Use a dictionary and find the major error. I thought I had a good play on words in that reply. Obviously went over some heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members davidss1 Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 I agree with what you were trying to say, I just don't agree with your use of overdue instead of overdo. Use a dictionary and find the major error. I thought I had a good play on words in that reply. Obviously went over some heads. yes,,i was thinking maybe too long a delay setting could make it overdue but seriously,to the OP,,good effects sounds are a very fine line to tread,,best handled realtime by someone that can listen to the overall affect that it is having in the mix,and be able to modify it appropriately. hope i havnt made any spelling mistakes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GCDEF Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 I agree with what you were trying to say, I just don't agree with your use of overdue instead of overdo.Use a dictionary and find the major error.I thought I had a good play on words in that reply. Obviously went over some heads. I liked it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stevie j Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 BTW didn't mean any offence. Just found it funny in a geeky sort of way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stevie j Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ed Dixon Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 An effects unit will do what you want. There are hundreds of different kinds and models in all price ranges. Most connect via your PA and allow you to control how much effect is added to each channel. Most vocals will typically use some reverb and perhaps delay. What PA gear do you have now? What budget do you have in mind for an effects setup for vocals? There are gobs of these things on eBay and most online stores. Here are some examples: http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/signal-processors/multi-effects Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members turbocody Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 umm, this is not grammer class.....i'm trying to help this guy, maybe you should too. I agree with what you were trying to say, I just don't agree with your use of overdue instead of overdo.Use a dictionary and find the major error.I thought I had a good play on words in that reply. Obviously went over some heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dogoth Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 Well it is possible to connect an overdrive pedal and delay to a soundboard (depending on which board you're using). Is the Delay a pedal effect as well? If so. the first comment I'd make is that these devices are made for instruments and not voice so they'll be noisy and have limited bandwidth. Secondly they will have Hi impedence sensitive inputs so they might be a bit harder to interface with your board. I'm not against expirementing with things in the studio but I think this setup would probably suck pretty bad live. It could probably be made to work but the question is, how well? I'm in agreement with the other posters. You should get real (made for PA) FX units and a BE to make it sound right. Don't expect to have these FX in your monitors or your asking for a world of grief (you MIGHT get away with it if you play at REALLY low volume or use In Ear monitors). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stevie j Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 OK, well you more or less got it with the pedal board stuff. But the pros use effects in their racks and their BE's add them to taste. If you have a sound engineer with you, tell him what you want, otherwise keep a small reverb on and don't try to guess what it'll sound like out front. Get someone you trust to listen and generally, if someone who doesn't know you mentions the reverb it's too much and is probably muddying up the sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members W. M. Hellinger Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 I'd say the #1 reason for "bad vocals" is because "good vocals" are relatively expensive and arguably difficult to achieve with a PA system... because: 1) Truly good vocals need at least 6dB of headroom over the basic sound clutter of the backing band. 2) Truly good sounding vocal capable PA cabinets are fairly expensive and fairly rare in the general market. It might be that you're not happy with your vocals simply because you've never had the opportunity to work with truly good equipment and with a truly good mix engineer. 3) Just "more" or "different" generally isn't the answer. In a painting (as an example), for lighter areas to stand-out, there needs to be contrasting dark spaces... simply a different shade of light space or more light space piled on light space gets lost in all the light space. The same principal applies to sound. For the vocals to sound good and stand-out, that can't happen if there's all kinds of other sound competing for the sound space. 4) It's difficult to polish mud. The source material needs to be truly good to result in a truly good final product. Maybe the source (your singing) is fine, but if you haven't already done so, maybe recording your singing and giving it a critical review would be the thing to do. I was fairly frustrated with the sound of my bass playing for years... and yes, changing to a more suitable instrument and backline amp made some difference, but tightening up my playing made the biggest difference.... after I finally realized my playing was the biggest problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rhat Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 I'd say the #1 reason for "bad vocals" is because "good vocals" are relatively expensive and arguably difficult to achieve with a PA system... because:1) Truly good vocals need at least 6dB of headroom over the basic sound clutter of the backing band.2) Truly good sounding vocal capable PA cabinets are fairly expensive and fairly rare in the general market. It might be that you're not happy with your vocals simply because you've never had the opportunity to work with truly good equipment and with a truly good mix engineer.3) Just "more" or "different" generally isn't the answer. In a painting (as an example), for lighter areas to stand-out, there needs to be contrasting dark spaces... simply a different shade of light space or more light space piled on light space gets lost in all the light space. The same principal applies to sound. For the vocals to sound good and stand-out, that can't happen if there's all kinds of other sound competing for the sound space.4) It's difficult to polish mud. The source material needs to be truly good to result in a truly good final product. Maybe the source (your singing) is fine, but if you haven't already done so, maybe recording your singing and giving it a critical review would be the thing to do. I was fairly frustrated with the sound of my bass playing for years... and yes, changing to a more suitable instrument and backline amp made some difference, but tightening up my playing made the biggest difference.... after I finally realized my playing was the biggest problem. I think the bigger problem is that guys dont tend to be in school choir programs. Thats where you learn to sing harmony. You want good vocals ,, go find people who sang in chamber choir. those band and choir geeks are the most talented musicans in most schools. Hook them up with some rockers and you have a good band Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members banddad Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 Starting with the basics: What mic are you using? Getting a good "dry" sound first is key, before adding effects. If you haven't done this yet, experiment with a few different mics, even recording yourself with them as suggested, to optimize your starting point before adding effects. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tlbonehead Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 tremolo on vocals? BeeGees tribute band? Or Tammy Wynette? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted March 21, 2009 Members Share Posted March 21, 2009 Tight shorts are an inexpensive way to get pitch shift and tremolo... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dogoth Posted March 22, 2009 Members Share Posted March 22, 2009 Tight shorts are an inexpensive way to get pitch shift and tremolo... Not to mention more attention from the ladies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members davidss1 Posted March 22, 2009 Members Share Posted March 22, 2009 Tight shorts are an inexpensive way to get pitch shift and tremolo... classic . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted March 22, 2009 Members Share Posted March 22, 2009 classic . Yeah, 1000 choir boys can't be wrong... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dannyrajan Posted March 23, 2009 Author Members Share Posted March 23, 2009 thanks people for all the input so far. Im working with a tight budget (if I can get away with using one pedal, hallelujah) and the only real PA system I am working with is at the venues I play. so...linking a foot pedal up to their PA would most likely sound {censored}ty?thats all I can realistically afford, so I guess i'll have to sell enough albums to pay for that addition. thanks all.check out my tunes if your interested and leave any feedback. Danny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted March 23, 2009 Members Share Posted March 23, 2009 so...linking a foot pedal up to their PA would most likely sound {censored}ty?Danny That would be my best guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members arf-boy Posted March 23, 2009 Members Share Posted March 23, 2009 In my experience, vocals sound better with judicious use of effects. In my band, vocal monitors are as dry as I can get away with making them and FOH gets just a wee bit more reverb. Is the desire for effects hiding a problem with your voice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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