Members 6Imzadi Posted March 18, 2011 Members Share Posted March 18, 2011 I can understand why he does it that way, just not all the time. Maybe once or twice to make sure you have all your cabling and etc correct. I would even dry run setup, teardown, and loading/ unloading a couple of times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GCDEF Posted March 18, 2011 Members Share Posted March 18, 2011 Because you need to practice the same way that you perform. If you don't, something will go wrong when you perform that didn't happen at practice. My band uses IEM's, but even so, we always play with the FOH on and constantly make sure that our setup is sounding good. Just my 2cents I don't agree with that at all. Our rehearsal is nothing like a performance. At rehearsal, we use 1 12" monitor, electronic drums, and play at levels you could practically talk over. We arrange ourselves so we can see each other well. Rehearsal is about communication, critical listening, stopping the music when something isn't right and fixing it, and did I mention communication. I don't see how you can focus on the minutia if you're rehearsing with IEMs at full stage volume. Doesn't matter if you use the full PA anyway, things will always happen live than you can't prepare for in rehearsal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mutha Goose Posted March 18, 2011 Members Share Posted March 18, 2011 I strongly disagree with the notion that rehersals* should be a complete mimicing of your live performance's setup. When playing live, there are SO many variables that could affect your sound and execution. If you can come to rely on a single environment, then when exposed to the real world, you will be left ill-prepared to handle it. *Practice: what a musician does to become prepaired. Learn your parts, excersizes, etc.Rehersal: the band playing together as a unit. working out arraingments, etc.Dress Rehersal: band working on specific aspect of the show. Correographing, etc. This should include the lighting designer and sound crew as well. Most bands at the club level will never need this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted March 18, 2011 Members Share Posted March 18, 2011 My line array wouldn't fit in most rehearsal rooms Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mutha Goose Posted March 18, 2011 Members Share Posted March 18, 2011 My line array wouldn't fit in most rehearsal rooms Maybe, but I want a rehersal room that could! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Donzi79 Posted March 18, 2011 Author Members Share Posted March 18, 2011 I would recommend the 312As for 50$ more a piece just in case he doesn't get a crossover right away. The RCFs don't have a highpass switch on them, so kick drum might hurt them more than the 12s. ?? Al Soooo, I would still need to buy a crossover with the RCF's? Do I want to avoid putting the kick drum through the mains altogether? Sorry for my newbness, and thanks for all the replies, guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Yer Blues Posted March 18, 2011 Members Share Posted March 18, 2011 I believe they were saying the RCF310As do not have a crossover, but the 312As do have a crossover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Al Poulin Posted March 18, 2011 Members Share Posted March 18, 2011 I believe they were saying the RCF310As do not have a crossover, but the 312As do have a crossover. Neither the 310A or 312A has a high pass filter so always run full range. If you do not use an outboard crossover to filter out the low frequencies, I would suggest not boosting the low frequencies too much on your mixer channels and simply putting the sub's gain a bit higher to obtain the bass you need. Not ideal, but it should help until you do get a crossover. You can also opt to get powered subd that do have internal crossovers and outputs to send a highpassed signal to your tops. RCF, QSC and Mackie subs have them if I'm not mistaken... Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OneEng Posted March 18, 2011 Members Share Posted March 18, 2011 I can understand why he does it that way, just not all the time. Maybe once or twice to make sure you have all your cabling and etc correct. I would even dry run setup, teardown, and loading/ unloading a couple of times. We have a basement that is setup as a bar complete with a stage for the band (it is actually nicer than many of the bars we play at ). We not only practice here, but host parties several times a year to a packed crowd of ~100 people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DaBender Posted March 18, 2011 Members Share Posted March 18, 2011 Do I want to avoid putting the kick drum through the mains altogether? No, there are overtones in the kick that give it the "snap" that are way above the crossover point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OneEng Posted March 19, 2011 Members Share Posted March 19, 2011 To the OP, go onto ebay and get a cheep crossover. You should be able to get one for $50-100 and it is well worth your effort. It is also possible that your sub could have a crossover built in depending on what powered sub you get. If not, get an external cross-over and use it. It isn't rocket science, and you can handle it just fine Try this or something like it: http://cgi.ebay.com/Rane-Professional-MX23-Stereo-3-way-active-crossover-NR-/160558957632?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25620f4440#ht_1628wt_1139 Keep in mind you only need a 2 way cross-over (all 3 way have a 2 way option though). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bobby1Note Posted March 19, 2011 Members Share Posted March 19, 2011 My line array wouldn't fit in most rehearsal rooms Have you considered something like the Bose???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted March 19, 2011 Members Share Posted March 19, 2011 We have a basement that is setup as a bar complete with a stage for the band (it is actually nicer than many of the bars we play at ). We not only practice here, but host parties several times a year to a packed crowd of ~100 people. Egress? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OneEng Posted March 19, 2011 Members Share Posted March 19, 2011 Egress? If you are referring to the exit/entrance, unfortunately, it requires stairs . They are abnormally wide and at the bottom, lots of room is available to maneuver gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted March 20, 2011 Members Share Posted March 20, 2011 If you are referring to the exit/entrance, unfortunately, it requires stairs . They are abnormally wide and at the bottom, lots of room is available to maneuver gear. 2 seperate sets of stairs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OneEng Posted March 20, 2011 Members Share Posted March 20, 2011 2 seperate sets of stairs? Only one. It is just like any other basement ..... that someone spent a fortune on to put in a stage, a bar, lighting, seating, darts, pool table, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted March 20, 2011 Members Share Posted March 20, 2011 100 people in a basement with only one set of stairs would probably be considered a felony in CA, were something to happen. IIRC, national code for commercial occupancies requires 2 seperate egress paths for an occupant load of >49 on a ground floor (for most occupancy types) and for way less in a basement occupancy. For residential, all basements now require 2 paths of egress regardless of load but add to this as load increases per local codes. One exit must be directly to the outside. The reason I mention this is because horrible things can happen when there is a basement accident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stangconv Posted March 20, 2011 Members Share Posted March 20, 2011 Is used an option? How about the Proel Flash 15 subs? I've never used them but they peak my curiosity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OneEng Posted March 20, 2011 Members Share Posted March 20, 2011 100 people in a basement with only one set of stairs would probably be considered a felony in CA, were something to happen. IIRC, national code for commercial occupancies requires 2 seperate egress paths for an occupant load of >49 on a ground floor (for most occupancy types) and for way less in a basement occupancy. For residential, all basements now require 2 paths of egress regardless of load but add to this as load increases per local codes. One exit must be directly to the outside. The reason I mention this is because horrible things can happen when there is a basement accident. Ahh. Commercial. This is a home residence doing a party. I agree that there are risks associated with any basement party (or large party of any kind for that matter) and that care must be taken to avoid a fire, or to combat one if it should occur. I suspect that we aren't the only people doing a residential party that gets more than 100 people Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted March 20, 2011 Members Share Posted March 20, 2011 Residential is even more strict. If folks can't get out in an emergency, it's going to end poorly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Donzi79 Posted March 21, 2011 Author Members Share Posted March 21, 2011 Residential is even more strict. If folks can't get out in an emergency, it's going to end poorly. I am a full time firefighter in Metro Detroit, and yes, there should be a secondary means to egress for any basement, there is absoultey no enforcement for residential non rental properties. I am just a line fireman, so I don't know the building codes that great for new builds, but cities in Michigan don't inspect old homes, unless it's a rental, and I don't think PD would ever right a ticket on that. But, if it were myself, I would put in an emergency egress window, if I were having large gatherings, along with multiple extinguishers and smoke detectors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted March 21, 2011 Members Share Posted March 21, 2011 Unfortunately, the building codes are only 1/2 the solution. Enforcement is the other half, and if it's lacking, so is the saftey that the codes are ment to improve. The biggest problem is any enclosed space is smoke that limits the ability to escape, as well as inadequate egress means that would clog up with those trying to escape. Add to that lack of fire stops, combustable materials and no emergency lighting and it's a recipe for tragity. Anybody remember The Sation nightclub in RI? It wasn't the fire that killed, it was the lack of (clear) exits and smoke that escalated the panic level making escape impossible. And, that was on the ground floor. Firefighters fear basements and attics the most. Both have restricted egress in the event something goes more wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Donzi79 Posted March 21, 2011 Author Members Share Posted March 21, 2011 Nah, we fear basements because its a bitch to get to the fire due to all the heat and smoke coming the stairs, creating a chimney effect. We don't fear them because of the egress issue, any burning structure is to fear, many FF's get disoriented in bedrooms and closets. Now falling though a first story floor into a burning basement, thats a problem. Anyway, this topic I started on powered PA speakers has somehow became a discussion about residential building code and firefighting, I am still trying to put together a nice system for the money I have, and I appreciate all the help. Is there any other suggestions? Nobody has commented on one of my original questions about the the JBL Eons(new). I like Al's suggestions, but I am leary of spending half my budget on 130 lbs subwoofer which I pretty much would only be putting a kick drum through for now. I'm still thinking about though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Donzi79 Posted March 22, 2011 Author Members Share Posted March 22, 2011 I have a few different listings on my local CL for Mackie 1801 powered subs. Anyone have any experience with these? I do like the Yorkville sub, but I can pick up one these used for 4-500, instead of 1200 new for the Yorkie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Donzi79 Posted April 1, 2011 Author Members Share Posted April 1, 2011 Thread update. I ended up buying a couple of the RCF 312's and the Yamaha MG 166cg mixer from RMC Audio (found a 15% off coupon code too) and ran some recorded music through them in my garage yesterday. They sounded great, and I will get the full band test in a couple of days. Since this is pretty much my first time running this kind of equipment, it took me a few hours of reading and rereading the manual for the mixer and messing with it to fully understand how to operate it.(90% there) Kind of a silly question though, at what volume levels should I be running the Main volume from the mixer and Speakers? Do I set the volume at the Speakers then if I need to adjust use the Mixer slide control? Or do I do the opposite? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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