CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted November 29, 2014 CMS Author Share Posted November 29, 2014 RCF-USA didn't do anything wrong. I just looked back and realized I sent an email to a specific person at RCF. I thought he was in charge of service' date=' but he was in charge of another department and someone who's helped me in the past. I didn't hear back but that's on me for sending it to the wrong place. [/quote'] Anyplace I've worked has always expected that a customer contact should either be handled, or directed to someone who could handle the request. Transfer to another department or position is never an excuse to ignore a customer contact. And the expected service level is a response within a business day. This can simply be, "I've received your email and will forward it to as he/she can better fulfill your request", so at least you know your message didn't float off into the mists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted November 29, 2014 CMS Author Share Posted November 29, 2014 I got a reply from service@rcfusa.com] When you call RCF's number during normal business hours someone almost always answers the phone. I don't know why abzurd did not get a response but that is not typical. To continue my mini-rant, do you accept "almost always" as good service? There's no good excuse other than physical inability due to natural disaster to not answer the phone during normal business hours. No voice messaging system? Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Audiopyle Sound Posted November 29, 2014 Members Share Posted November 29, 2014 To continue my mini-rant, do you accept "almost always" as good service? There's no good excuse other than physical inability due to natural disaster to not answer the phone during normal business hours. No voice messaging system? Really? I said that "someone" almost always answers the phone, meaning an actual living person. OF COURSE there is a messaging system, but it is rare that your call would be answered by it during business hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abzurd Posted December 22, 2014 Author Members Share Posted December 22, 2014 So here's an update. The diaphragms I bought were on a different mounting ring so they were a no go. I looked briefly at trying to remove and swap out just the diaphragms but they are glued down pretty darn good so I just ordered from RCF. Here's that story in bullet points My retail vendor called RCF and they said they had none in stock and it would be at least 4-6 weeks to get them Knowing Mike P said they were in stock when he called, I called myself and they actually went looking and said they did have them in stock. (NOTE - first time I called I got VM so I hung up. Second time I called nobody was available to help me and sent me to someone's VM. The person did call me back a few hours later) My retail vendor had them drop shipped from RCF. I just got them a few minutes ago. The box was large and heavy.... hmmmmm Sure enough, they weren't diaphragms, but complete drivers. OK, bonus right? Maybe, but not for sure yet. First off they were filthy with packing dust from those cellulose peanuts that fall apart when touched. (see pic) Secondly, at least one of them is well used and out of a 722A box as that's what's written in sharpie on the driver. It has a few dinged up corners on the cooling fins indicating it's been dropped or otherwise been around the block a few times. (see pic) I know he ordered just the diaphragms as that's the pricing he got and gave me. Also, I talked to RCF myself about it. So after I confirm from my vendor that he wasn't charged for 2 complete drivers, I guess I'll be taking them apart when I get home today to check out the condition of the diaphragms. I'm going to be one PO'd dude if there are blistered paper bobbins in there as I personally told RCF why I needed new diaphragms. Sending me used drivers instead? Well, that's consistent with my experience with RCF service. Oh, and it took RCF a week from getting the order to ship them and 11 days to get from ordered to in my hands. I confirmed in the packing slip that the order was placed on Dec 11th. I would appreciate it as going the extra mile if RCF presented it that way, but it just seems they throw used parts in a box and send as this isn't the first time I've gotten used stuff. I once got an amp that was from another broken speaker. At least tell me what's going on. Let me know the diaphragms are fresh and you're being swell eggs and sending me drivers too. That would turn my frown upside down. Instead it's a weird thing to get a box of used drivers, shipped a week later than they should of been and arriving in a condition that makes me have to take them apart to clean and confirm they are acceptable. Oh well, if I keep having problems I may be able to put another full speaker together. The last go around I ended up with an extra amplifier and now have 2 extra compression drivers. I just need another plastic box and a woofer...LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted December 22, 2014 Members Share Posted December 22, 2014 Ugh, not looking good for team Italy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abzurd Posted December 23, 2014 Author Members Share Posted December 23, 2014 Well nutz. One paper bobbin diaphragm circa 2007 and one kapton circa 2008... tells me they likely had problems with the paper ones. Also, while my originals say 0.00 on the ring, these have an adjustment number stamped on them. RCF instructions I found say shims need to be added to compensate. Do you think RCF included the shims? ... sigh. One is -0.07 and the other is -0.09. What's the down side of putting them in "as is"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dboomer Posted December 23, 2014 Members Share Posted December 23, 2014 Do you think maybe they came up with the shim idea one day when they didn't have anything to do ? 😗 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted December 23, 2014 Members Share Posted December 23, 2014 Everything I have used with RCF has been Kapton, I don't know why anybody is using paper anymore. Kapton can be made just as light weight, but is dimensionally more stable at high temperature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted December 23, 2014 CMS Author Share Posted December 23, 2014 ....And I'm still gonna say this is totally unacceptable service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abzurd Posted December 23, 2014 Author Members Share Posted December 23, 2014 ....And I'm still gonna say this is totally unacceptable service. And I'm going to agree with you. Most of my interactions have involved incompetence, deceit, and finger pointing. All have involved seemingly needless delay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abzurd Posted December 23, 2014 Author Members Share Posted December 23, 2014 Do you think maybe they came up with the shim idea one day when they didn't have anything to do ? 😗 So you're saying this is bogus? I'm not making it up. - http://www.speakerrepairshop.com/other/RCFp2.pdf I have no idea what the shims look like either. There aren't any on my driver, but then again the diaphragm being used currently has 0.00 stamped on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OneEng Posted December 23, 2014 Members Share Posted December 23, 2014 Wow Abzurd. I have followed your RCF issues for a few years. Where once I would routinely recommend these speakers due to the smooth top end and overall great sound they produce, I will have to put them on the naughty list now Hope you get things worked out. If not, the DSR112's work really nicely over those XLF's of yours Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abzurd Posted December 23, 2014 Author Members Share Posted December 23, 2014 Wow Abzurd. I have followed your RCF issues for a few years. Where once I would routinely recommend these speakers due to the smooth top end and overall great sound they produce, I will have to put them on the naughty list now Hope you get things worked out. If not, the DSR112's work really nicely over those XLF's of yours I actually have the matching PRX712's over them now. They do OK, but the RCF's are better..... when they work. I'm actually putting together a full account of the life of these speakers and will be talking to someone at RCF about it, probably after the first of the year. It's just been a train wreck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dboomer Posted December 23, 2014 Members Share Posted December 23, 2014 So you're saying this is bogus? . Absolutely not. I am saying that they are absolutely necessary if you expect to get maximum performance out of the drivers. Most manufacturers don't go to the trouble and so you get performance over a wide variation. Kudos to them for going the extra mile. As far as customer service. I think there must be some missed communication somewhere in the chain. I wouldn't brand them as having poor service until you talk to them about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abzurd Posted December 23, 2014 Author Members Share Posted December 23, 2014 Absolutely not. I am saying that they are absolutely necessary if you expect to get maximum performance out of the drivers. Most manufacturers don't go to the trouble and so you get performance over a wide variation. Kudos to them for going the extra mile. As far as customer service. I think there must be some missed communication somewhere in the chain. I wouldn't brand them as having poor service until you talk to them about it. Then your original comment baffles me. I didn’t claim it was unneeded. To the contrary, I knew about it, not from RCF, but from some heavy googling I did on my own. I absolutely WILL brand them as having poor service. I have examples of it from the middle of 2008 through yesterday. I have 100-ish emails, half of them asking if anyone is planning on getting back to me, along with some information from an insider that explains why what happened originally took place and why they shut down their NH facility and moved everything to NJ. I have emails from the repair facility that went to bat trying to get both of my speakers replaced due to the multiple issues. I have emails explaining, even though I’d waited a long time and they had the amps, RCF policy was to not ship overnight, which amounted to them not giving 2 turds if I had no speakers for a very important show. The repair company was sincere and apologetic.... RCF was not. What missed communication would explain them sending 2 unmatched drivers with different diaphragms stuck together by their magnets and packed in what’s essentially sawdust? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abzurd Posted December 23, 2014 Author Members Share Posted December 23, 2014 Left a message with the receptionist at RCF then called a 3rd party repair service that RCF told me about a few weeks ago. Apparently the original diaphragm is matched to the phase plug of the specific driver and are stamped after being fitted. What's stamped on any replacement diaphragm is irrelevant. That makes me wonder why anything at all is stamped on them. So apparently I don't need shims as the diaphragm that's is coming out says 0.00 and I know it to be the original one mated to that driver. Kind of a silly system. If the measurement is due to the phase plug then why isn't there just a sticker on the back of the driver itself so you always know what to do? Not that I really care I guess, but I have no idea what the measurements are of the 2 replacement driver phase plugs. They are either not the original diaphragms or the shims have been discarded. There's no way to know without a special tool and the skills to measure it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pro Sound Guy Posted December 23, 2014 Members Share Posted December 23, 2014 You can center a diaphragm by injecting a sine wave into the compression driver input and move the diaphagm until you get the maximum output from it. When you are moving the diaphragm voicecoil in the gap you will hear the sine wave change in output and max out with that given input when the voice coil is centered.One could trim away a small amount of the material that sits in the step if you wanted to center it yourself with the above method.You could do this with the older Altec compression drivers and use location pins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abzurd Posted December 24, 2014 Author Members Share Posted December 24, 2014 You can center a diaphragm by injecting a sine wave into the compression driver input and move the diaphagm until you get the maximum output from it. When you are moving the diaphragm voicecoil in the gap you will hear the sine wave change in output and max out with that given input when the voice coil is centered. One could trim away a small amount of the material that sits in the step if you wanted to center it yourself with the above method. You could do this with the older Altec compression drivers and use location pins. Thanks, but these are self centering. The shim is an up - down thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted December 24, 2014 Members Share Posted December 24, 2014 The shim has to do with the spacing above the phase plug. Un-necessary with most drivers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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