Going straight to a PA?

[aldo247]

Hey guys, so I have a question, don't know if this has been answered or asked before, but here goes.

I play out a lot and also play for my church a lot. At church I have no problem with my amplification, I go straight from pedalboard to my amp and the amp is mic'd. We've started to play out at other places more often, but one problem that I've encountered is that some churches or other places don't like to have an amp on stage (I know there's gonna be a lot of folks here that have had that problem) I don't like puggling straight to the PA 'cause I just hate the sound.

Now here's the question, for the ones with this problem, what have you tried or done to solve this problem?

*I've looked into the SansAmp Gt2, and The ethos OD, but never tried any of those. Anyone with experience on these?

Also, it seems that both are aimed to something similar. Is the Ethos worth the difference in price?

*I've actually used a POD X3 for amp simulation and while it has worked well, I would like something that I can incorporate on my pedalboard.

*When plugging to my amp I use nothing but the clean channel ( I have a Visual Sound Stallion Workhorse Amp. Only 1 channel made to work with pedals)

 

If you have other suggestions I'd really appreciate your input!

Thanks!

[southpaw pete]

I understand. At my church, I do have an amp on stage with me, but pretty much just have it at a level for me to hear, and run a line to the house system. For the house sound, I run through a POD 2.0. I just have it sitting there next to my pedal board, and have it set to a clean blackface setting, and use all of my pedals to work it like I would a clean channel of an amp. Works really well.

My father-in-law has been a full time performing musician for 35+ years - with tons of gear he's acquired over the years. He heard me playing at church one week, and said that was the sound he'd been trying to find for himself since he'd started playing! Awesome.

I have also tried the Hughes and Kettner red box classic DI, which has some decent cabinet modeling (2X12 combo, or 4X12). I still use my POD though, just for the added EQ, reverb and tuner with it.

I have heard good things about the Tech 21 character series pedals - which have some cabinet modeling as well from what I understand - so you can have a Liverpool or Blonde, or British... sounds sweet, though I've not yet tried them myself.

[delayed delay]

I used to get crap at my church all the time for my amp making too much noise on stage...

Then we went to an Aviom in-ear system, so I moved my amp off the stage (in it's own little hole) to where it doesn't really create any stage volume, and I can crank it as loud as I want in the Aviom.

But if you don't have the luxury of Aviom at your church, I just recommend moving your amp off the stage or even backstage somewhere and mic'ing it still and then just using the monitors as your volume. It worked well for us before we went to Aviom. Just make sure and don't crank your amp up in the monitors, or that'll tick off the rest of the worship team just as much as having the amp on stage....

The Pod X3 Live is a great idea too. Our church just got one, and while I won't have the opportunity to use it (I'll be gone in a month after graduating), I've heard AMAZING things about it. Just check out some of Lincoln Brewster's stuff... when he's playing live, he runs his Pod X3 Live straight into the PA. Granted he spent a lot of time in the studio dialing in his sounds and perfecting his tone, but still... straight into the PA... very similar to southpaw pete. Check out Lincoln Brewster's MySpace and listen to "Love the Lord" or "Majestic" to hear his amazing tone (I FREAKING LOVE IT) or check out his official website (click here), which he explains his gear setup to the "T".

[petejt]

Tell those churches that His voice comes from your amp, and if silenced by resorting you to run through a PA will cause wrath to plague their diocese.

[aldo247]

Hey guys,
Yeah, believe it or not I've had a POD X3 Live and a regular X3 ( not at the same time of course ) and while I used the regular x3 to model strictly amps to work along with my board, I did use the lie me as my main board.
The reg X3 was great for that and so far is the one thing that has worked best. Only thing is that I would like something with a hit smaller footprint that I can house on my board, that's why I mentioned the tech 21 stuff. Which I never tried, and would like to new from someone who has used them too.
The x3 live was awesome ( don't understand why some folks say it's not) anyway, I liked it, but we play a whole different mix of music, I like that my board allows me to tweak or turn off and on stuff on the fly.
Like I said, at my church I don't have anynproblems, thankfuly, I have a good understanding sound guy. It's just when I go out to play to different venues, I may not have a good amp or no amp at all.
Thanks for the suggestions, keep writing!
By the way, the whole thing about hiding sounds like a good idea!
And oh yeah I've heard Lincoln's new records. He sounds great!And he does great stuff win the pod, but then again, he has a defined music style. If I was on a band with just one specific sound, I would have probably kept it... : S

[andreas]

It's a never-ending dilemma... to get the guitar to sound good, most of us wants to turn it up a bit. To get a good on-stage and out front sound, it needs to be turned down...

 

I never let anyone tell me I can't use my amp - it's part of my instrument, and asking me to go direct is like asking a drummer to leave the bass drum at home... That said, I'll go direct if it's more convenient, but then I'd need to know some time in advance, so I can arrange a setup that will work. If I were to do it regularly, I'd probably get an XT or X3 Live, and just use that (leaving the other pedals at home too) - IMO, modellers tend to sound best left at their own devices. I'd probably also use a small-ish powered monitor or speaker behind me, to make it "feel" a little more amp-like.

 

/Andreas

[DanJep]

If I were in a different position than I am now when it comes to playing at churches I would get one of these.

 

 

It won't allow you to massively crank but it does SO much when it comes to stage volume. When I was looking they were roughly the cost of a POD.

[aldo247]

That enclosure looks pretty cool...
Sorry foe the crappy spelling. I'm at work typing the messages on an iPhone
Haha...

[aldo247]

Do you have the name of the company who makes that?

[DanJep]

Sorry. I thought I included a link.

 

The company is called clearsonic.

 

http://www.clearsonic.com/amp_isolation.htm

 

The one pictured above is $140 from the link below.

 

http://www.ccisolutions.com/StoreFront/product/CLE-GTRAMP1.prod?origin=GoogleBase

[turnitto11]

I know what you mean. Going direct in sounds like crap. Recently, my church got a new theatre room that has boxes for your amp in a box about 50 feet away. That's was lame for me because of all that cable length sucking my tone, and I couldn't use my amps footswitch, and I had to wear in hear monitors. I hate in ear monitors!! They make my tone sound like crap, and the overall sound through monitors is just gross. And I usually have to share the in-ear signal with another guitarist, so the overall sound I'm hearing isn't as I would prefer.

I've stopped playing in that room because I feel I have no inspiration or creativity with it set up like this.

But to help your problem, there are some digitech pedals that have cabinet modeling on them. Try the Digitech bad monkey (cheap, $50) and just use the mixer output. Some people have said they are a reasonable alternative to using an amp.

[southpaw pete]

Just re-visiting this post. Wondering if you've found a solution yet, aldo247.

[aldo247]

Hey!
It's funny, I was just thinking about writing back here. I decided to try out one of the Tech 21 pedals and oh man! It is such and awesome device. I've been wanting to write here some sort of small review, but I wanted to wait for the honeymoon to be over. I think it's the right time now, I've had the pedal for almost 3 weeks now ( mind you I play out about 4 days a week)
so I will write about it later, right now I gotta go... LOL

[southpaw pete]

Right on. Glad to hear. I just bought a Liverpool from a guy on here - can't wait to try it. Looking forward to your review!

[aldo247]

Man I'm pretty sure you ar egonna like the Liverpool. That's actually what I bought. When I first got it I kinda was expecting some sort of digital sounding pedal (I'm not against digital pedals) but I was wrong, thing is pretty awesome. It's packed with features!

My settings on the pedal are pretty much set for just a clean, punchy sound. I almost never adjust the drive setting. On my real amps I like to hit the clean channel of the amp and just base my OD's and Distortions of off pedals.
Here's my signal chain:
Boss / NS2 - Line 6 / Dm4 - Visual Sound / Route 66 - 2nd Od (I usually swap this out between different OD's, believe it or not, I've been inlcined towards a Bad Monkey lately, but I use anything from a Sparkle Drive to an original Expandora) - Keeley / RAT - Cusack / Screamer Fuzz - Boss NS2 - Visual Sound / Visual Volume - TC / Nova Delay - Line 6 / Echo Park - Line 6 / DL4 - Tech 21 / Liverpool. I have everything wired with Lava Solderless cables.

So as you can see I have the Liverpool at the end of the chain just as if I was hitting my amp straight into the clean channel. Now onto my experience with it.
SO like I said on my original post, I have no problem mic'ing my amp at my local church, they are VERY flexible and understanding with me , LOL; but I wanted to get something for those times where an amp is not an option.
The first weekend with the Liverpool I brought my amp to church too, just in case. If the pedal didn't deliver live, I could just plug to my amp and set up a mic, so I plugged in straight to the PA and my jaw dropped, I smiled like the first time I bought my first boutique pedal LOL.
The sound was great, and best thing of all, the cab simulation actually works, my od's didn't sound muddy or dull, they actually sounded like if was plugged to an amp. The Liverpool is based on the AC30 and mind you, it is not an actual AC30, but it does sound similar to it, I can actually hear the chimmey tones the AC30 is famous for. YES i have actually played AC30s before, both Chinese and European ones, so I know what I'm talking about, LOL. Of course nothing beats the feeling of having your amp blasting behing you, but this is a perfect solution for this type of situations.
There's a bunch of knobs on the pedal (six in total) and they are all very responsive, I would even say very sensitive, but functional. It'll take a bit to get used to how the controls interact with each other, but the 2 page instruction sheet that comes with the pedal is a good reference point to get you started.
I'm glad I decided to try out the pedal, it was more of a random oportunity to buy one that an actual desire to do it. Same as you, I bought it used from another member in this forum. This is what I was looking for, something not big that I could fit on my board and that would sound good.
I'm actually looking into trying out the rest of the character series, if they all deliver the same as this one did, then I'll get the whole collection
When you get the pedal make sure to base your judgement until you plug in into a PA or your studio monitor. When you plug to your amp it'll sound good depending on your amp, but it won't do what it was made for. I plugged it into my amps and it ok, nothing out of this world, but the truth came to light when I plugeed to the mixer and listened to my tone through the house speakers.
I kinda extended myself sorry..
Aldo

[southpaw pete]

Excellent! Thanks for the review, Aldo. Very good to hear. I am glad it is working for you. I was hoping for a good sounding way to run direct at my church (still will probably have an amp on stage just for my personal "monitor"), without having to set up the POD in addition to my pedal board... Sounds like it should work very nicely. Right on.