British and American voicings

[Say Ocean]

Why are their "british" and "american" voiced amps? By that I mean, why are they voiced differently? What ever started that? I know the difference; I'm asking why.

[asdfjkl semi]

Why does chicken not taste like steak?

[Nevandal]

Amps have different voices like people have different voices.

 

When a person speaks, you can tell it's a person and you can understand them, but they sound unique.

 

It's the same with amps.

[Say Ocean]

Amps have different voices like people have different voices. When a person speaks, you can tell it's a person and you can understand them, but they sound unique. It's the same with amps.

Uh ok

Thats not what I asked at all. I was asking what lead to british and american amps to being voiced differently.

[Nevandal]

Uh ok Thats not what I asked at all. I was asking what lead to british and american amps to being voiced differently.

 

...

 

 

 

 

I'm not sure how my answer didn't answer your question, or what the hell you're asking, then.

[Say Ocean]

WHY DO AMERICAN AND BRITISH AMPS HAVE DISTINCT VOICINGS? WHAT MADE IT TURN OUT LIKE THAT?

[metalfanat1c]

British people like high mids and treble, Americans like low mids and bass?

[Nevandal]

They were made by different people, and are different amps. Therefore they have different "voicings", and sound different.

 

 

It's not really any more complicated than that.

[Rich]

I love the british voicing like an old JMP or an AC30.

I don't like teh mesa boogie voicings that attemp to be british as they fail miserably. Kind of like brittany spears with a British accent if you will.

[asdfjkl semi]

I don't like teh mesa boogie voicings that attemp to be british as they fail miserably.

[metalfanat1c]

I don't like teh mesa boogie voicings that attemp to be british as they fail miserably. Kind of like brittany spears with a British accent if you will.

That doesn't make sense. Mesas aren't trying to be British. Right now they're the DEFINITION of American voicing.

[Cibyl]

I'm not 100% sure, but I think the British vs American voicing thing came out of what tubes were available at the time when tube guitar amps were first being made. Regarding the big two, Fender and Marshall:

 

Early Fender Tweeds circuits were designed around 6v6's and 6L6, and it continued on with the Blackface era and Silverface. Marshall started out with the JTM45 (copied from the Fender Bassman) and utilized KT66 tubes,..but later Marshall started using EL34's which were cheaper and more available in England at the time. Vox used EL34's and EL84's in their amps as well -- again, what was easily available to them.

 

So really, the different voicings evolved more out of what tubes were cheaper and more readily available at the time. Later on (60's through the 70's) as electric guitar became more popular the aritists/players started to drive the design concepts and things evolved even more from there.

 

I'm over simplifying things a bit,...but I think that's kind of how it all started.

[FalseRevRG]

That doesn't make sense. Mesas aren't trying to be British. Right now they're the DEFINITION of American voicing.

the Stiletto is sort of Mesa's attempt at a Marshallish-sounding amp.

[petejt]

I'm not 100% sure, but I think the British vs American voicing thing came out of what tubes were available at the time when tube guitar amps were first being made. Regarding the big two, Fender and Marshall: Early Fender Tweeds circuits were designed around 6v6's and 6L6, and it continued on with the Blackface era and Silverface. Marshall started out with the JTM45 (copied from the Fender Bassman) and utilized KT66 tubes,..but later Marshall started using EL34's which were cheaper and more available in England at the time. Vox used EL34's and EL84's in their amps as well -- again, what was easily available to them. So really, the different voicings evolved more out of what tubes were cheaper and more readily available at the time. Later on (60's through the 70's) as electric guitar became more popular the aritists/players started to drive the design concepts and things evolved even more from there. I'm over simplifying things a bit,...but I think that's kind of how it all started.

I think that is it.


Also too, I think people refer to "British" and "American" voicings so they avoid pointing out specific amp brands, as it might be seen as advertising. Which is a bit bollocks but I don't care.

So they are just euphemisms for "Marshall-sounding" and "Fender/Mesa/Boogie" sounding, respectively.


This is an interesting thread, thanks for writing it Say Ocean .
Just today I was reading a past article which reviewed the Ashdown Fallen Angel guitar amp, which was decribed as being between a "British" amp sound and an "American" amp sound.

[dreamspace]

I've always thought that:

British voicing: strong-mids, smooth crunch and gain...EL34, ala Marshall, Vox, Orange and Laney

American voicing: sparkly cleans, big low-end, lower mids...6L6, ala Fender, Mesa etc.

[Procreatur]

Jim Marshall changed some capacitor values on the bassman preamp circuit among other things and came up with the Marshall. along with tubes, the tone stack is slightly different, resulting in a different response to what is put in. Vox's are different, but the use of EL84s and the preamp voicing give it the british flavour. Vox and Marshall are the basis for the "British" sound. there are others as well. Fender was the only major american manufacturer that dominated the market, and so that became the basis for the "american" sound. there were plenty of other amp companies around, but most did not make the impact that fender did. speakers can alter the voicing of an amp better than a tube change can. and they are also labeled as being british or american. jensen was the major vintage player, along with JBL and Altec. Celestion made a name for itself in the marshall and vox camps, and is still a major player today. eminence came along a little later and now makes speakers for everything, will all sorts of voicings depending on what you want the speaker to do. they supply the majority of OEM speakers in amps that are for sale now.

[xbryanx]

epic failz.

[R0B0]

Jim Marshall changed some capacitor values on the bassman preamp circuit among other things and came up with the Marshall. along with tubes, the tone stack is slightly different, resulting in a different response to what is put in. Vox's are different, but the use of EL84s and the preamp voicing give it the british flavour. Vox and Marshall are the basis for the "British" sound. there are others as well. Fender was the only major american manufacturer that dominated the market, and so that became the basis for the "american" sound. there were plenty of other amp companies around, but most did not make the impact that fender did. speakers can alter the voicing of an amp better than a tube change can. and they are also labeled as being british or american. jensen was the major vintage player, along with JBL and Altec. Celestion made a name for itself in the marshall and vox camps, and is still a major player today. eminence came along a little later and now makes speakers for everything, will all sorts of voicings depending on what you want the speaker to do. they supply the majority of OEM speakers in amps that are for sale now.

 

 

Yeah, back in the day, America used different tubes than what the Europeans were using. When Marshall first reproduced the Bassmen, it was easier and cheaper for them to use European tubes. American tubes produce a mid scooped voicing whereas European tubes produce more mids. The speakers in use on both continents also had different voicing. The British voice is associated with Celestions, and American, with Jensons and JBLs.

[Rich]

the Stiletto is sort of Mesa's attempt at a Marshallish-sounding amp.

That was exactly what I was getting at when all the eye rolling and panty waste crap started.

[JBecker]

It's actually really simple. R0B0 pretty much has it.

 

Jim Marshall and Leo Fender used what was cheap and available. In the USA that was 12ax7s, 6L6, and 6v6 tubes with Jensen speakers, while in Britain it was EL34s, EL84s, KT66s, ECC83s, and Celestion speakers.

 

Most builders just used whatever tubes they were familiar with working with and that's the stuff that was available on each side of the pond for cheap.

[WakeTheDead]

I like em both... what the hell?

[Locky]

the Stiletto is sort of Mesa's attempt at a Marshallish-sounding amp.

 

 

yeah those amps have amazing tones. Im GASing for one so badly. Mesa definately got the brit sound right with those amps.